Is perception reality?

[Kyuuketsuki]

Does reality only exist within our minds?

Yes kinda, no kinda.

When you think about it we (fairly obviously in my opinion) cannot actually sense the real world directly as our eyes, ears, hands etc. are effectively only dumb sensors so it our brains that must indirectly observe reality so our reality is really in our heads (that's why yes and no).

Kyu

[Giff]

Reality requires a conciousness, or perhaps perception is requiring that. Perhaps reality is what things really are and perception is osmething that tried to interputate the reality?

[Edwardo Piet]

Well I see it that reality is what really exists and is also outside the imagination. Although the imagination ITSELF is real (in the sense that it exists) the imagination does not have to exist outside itself...in 'the real world' - which is generally what is meant by 'reality' I think. What is real that is outside our own heads too.

And if there was no consciousness the universe would still exist...so it would still be 'real', and not imaginary (besides it can't be imaginary becasue there's no conciousness to imagine it)...

Whatever exists would still exist with or without us so I think there would still be a reality.

But then on the other hand what is meant by reality is also, often, anything that we percieve that isn't 'imaginary' or made up. What corrosponds to 'reality' is often called reality too!

E.G those who's beliefs don't corrospond with reality are said to not live in reality sometimes...to 'not live in the real world' - but then... they DO still live in the same world - the same reality really. We all live in the same world 'really' don't we?

So I think it's kind of both - depending on the context. Reality is often said to be what is believed that corrsoponds with 'the real world' - but 'the real world' itself is also called reality - in the sense that it is real - it is existence itself - and we live in the same reality really, so noone can be 'not living in the real world' (or reality) in that sense. We all live in the same world really.

Just people are said to 'not be living in the real world' or in reality, when they're beliefs are thought to be deluded, etc, - even though really everyone lives in the real world and reality...

How can you not live in reality and still exist? If you dont' live in reality...you're not real - hence you cannot (and therefore don't) exist!

So you must 'live in reality' in that sense. Everything that is real is reality right? It's existence. When something is 'not reality' then we are thinking up a hypothetical idae, or giving into a delusion that doesn't actually exist outside our own heads...it's 'not real' (except in our heads).

Phew it can be a pickle talking about this for me. I know what I mean though - sometimes it's just hard to express it!

EvF

[WWLD]

Phew it can be a pickle talking about this for me. I know what I mean though - sometimes it's just hard to express it!

EvF

I understand

But I must admit I had to read it twice lol

[Edwardo Piet]

Hehe well - at least you understand!! I mean, that's something! lol.

[g-mark]

Im glad you understand. I need an english translation please.

[infidel666]

Recall a time when you discovered that you were wrong. Now, were you wrong before you discovered it, or only after? If the latter, then you were not actually wrong, were you? So you have to realize now that you were not wrong, and that becomes the reality, until you change your mind. Convenient, isn't it?

[Edwardo Piet]

Your imagination really exists...in your brain - that's still reality in the sense it exists (your imagination exists)...

WHAT you are imagining though doesn't necessarily exist outside itself (outside your imagination) - and if it DOES exist outside, then that's obviously reality - if it DOESN'T then it's not reality in the sense it doesn't exist outside your imagination.
The only shape or form that it IS reality...is that what you are imagining exists in your head or is 'real to you', that is not to say, however, that it's part of 'reality' in the sense it exists outside your head as well.

Hope that was put a BIT better at least! That's kind of how I understand it anyways.

I find it a bit hard to explain. Because I'm basically saying that I think people often use the word 'reality' in two different senses - and trying to explain how I understand it, etc, basically.

EvF

[Tiberius]

Reality requires a conciousness, or perhaps perception is requiring that.

Saying reality requires a consciousness is ridiculous. Reality existed long before humans were around (of that we have proof) and long before any form of life was around (again, we have proof). Are people forgetting that reality is "the set of all things which are real". Reality doesn't simply cease to exist because no conscious mind is thinking about it.

There is a famous quote by Philip K. Dick which goes: "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."

I'd say that reality both requires a good level of perception and consciousness to understand, but in terms of existence, reality requires neither. In fact both consciousness and perception are in the set of reality (in that they are real), not the other way around.

[Giff]

Reality requires a conciousness, or perhaps perception is requiring that.

Saying reality requires a consciousness is ridiculous. Reality existed long before humans were around (of that we have proof) and long before any form of life was around (again, we have proof). Are people forgetting that reality is "the set of all things which are real". Reality doesn't simply cease to exist because no conscious mind is thinking about it.

There is a famous quote by Philip K. Dick which goes: "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away."

I'd say that reality both requires a good level of perception and consciousness to understand, but in terms of existence, reality requires neither. In fact both consciousness and perception are in the set of reality (in that they are real), not the other way around.

Agree with you, reality is what it is.

Hope you don't punish me for my quite ridicolous satement, o great Administrator