Is there any secular reason why being gay is bad?

[kılıç_mehmet]

On the same accord, being deaf or mute isn't unfortunate either, yes?
But enough is enough. I will not debate on this subject any further as it's getting a bit boring.

nobody asked you to.

There is an obvious motivation behind the multitude of homosexuality related threads.
I'm going to break your game.

[Tiberius]

On the same accord, being deaf or mute isn't unfortunate either, yes?

Being deaf or mute is unfortunate, since you are either missing a valuable sense or way of communicating. Being homosexual does not make your life harder because of who you are or who you love, but generally because of bigots like you trying to give them a hard time.

[kılıç_mehmet]

On the same accord, being deaf or mute isn't unfortunate either, yes?

Being deaf or mute is unfortunate, since you are either missing a valuable sense or way of communicating. Being homosexual does not make your life harder because of who you are or who you love, but generally because of bigots like you trying to give them a hard time.

We're also giving thieves, murderers, traitors, provocators and other people the hard time they need.
No one is a unique snowflake here. Those who live in harmony with the normal majority deserve the right to respect, those who don't, deserve only the hard stick on their backs.

[Adjusted Sanity]

Being deaf or mute is unfortunate, since you are either missing a valuable sense or way of communicating. Being homosexual does not make your life harder because of who you are or who you love, but generally because of bigots like you trying to give them a hard time.

We're also giving thieves, murderers, traitors, provocators and other people the hard time they need.
No one is a unique snowflake here. Those who live in harmony with the normal majority deserve the right to respect, those who don't, deserve only the hard stick on their backs.

The only reason homosexuals aren't able to live in harmony with the majority is because people like you won't let them.
Thieves and Murderers can't live in harmony with the majority because they're assholes who directly harm others with there actions.

[Tiberius]

We're also giving thieves, murderers, traitors, provocators and other people the hard time they need.

Thieves, murderers, traitors, and provocators affect other people in a negative way. Homosexuals do not. They only affect themselves and their partner (who has consented, assuming this is not rape).

No one is a unique snowflake here. Those who live in harmony with the normal majority deserve the right to respect, those who don't, deserve only the hard stick on their backs.

How do homosexuals not live in harmony with heterosexuals? They are not asking that heterosexuals should be treated any worse, they are simply asking that homosexuals should be treated equally, which is fair.

[kılıç_mehmet]

We're also giving thieves, murderers, traitors, provocators and other people the hard time they need.
No one is a unique snowflake here. Those who live in harmony with the normal majority deserve the right to respect, those who don't, deserve only the hard stick on their backs.

The only reason homosexuals aren't able to live in harmony with the majority is because people like you won't let them.
Thieves and Murderers can't live in harmony with the majority because they're assholes who directly harm others with there actions.

And for good reason. I rather have the people out there with a reasonably harmonious identity, than with their deviant sexual identities.
Just as I do not go out and introduce myself to people as a "heterosexual", I do not want people to go out and introduce themselves to others as being homosexual. But I know that people who suffer from minority complex are very passionate about whatever that makes them a minority, and want everyone else to know that they are a "minority". The "coming out" process, essentially leaving behind whatever identity you have, to adopt your sexuality as your prime identity.

Just like thieves and murderers, any sexual deviants are directly harmful to society by the way they act. Is a provocator that agitates people to acts of arson and riot not harmful? Yet he only uses words, nothing else.

[Tiberius]

You really are a moron if you think the "coming out process" is some kind of adoption of "gay" as your prime identity. Plenty of gay men come out and then don't ever mention it unless someone asks, or it is sensible to mention it. One of my gay friends came out last year and I've never even heard him utter the word. Coming out is a personal thing; it is letting people know who you are, that is all. There are people who adopt a more flamboyant lifestyle than others, but that is true of everyone.

[kılıç_mehmet]

Thieves, murderers, traitors, and provocators affect other people in a negative way. Homosexuals do not. They only affect themselves and their partner (who has consented, assuming this is not rape).

Well, in the case they do not interfere into the current normal society by demanding special rights for themselves, they are not breaking social harmony. Everyone can agree with that.
However, if they try to act as a thief would, who sees the other man's property as his own...As the current liberal ideology states how we should be treating "sexual minorities", like allowing them to participate into society using their sexual identities, is like the thief's work. They see the society as their own, where they may act as they wish, with no one having a say on their deeds.
No, friend. Such actions cannot be tolerated once they go public.

How do homosexuals not live in harmony with heterosexuals?

They do try to bring heterosexuality on the level of homosexuality, or try to elevate their condition to the level of heterosexuality, don't they?
They try to destroy the existing harmony.

They are not asking that heterosexuals should be treated any worse,

Not that they can, they can't. Who are they to suggest such a thing in the first place?

they are simply asking that homosexuals should be treated equally,

I've said it a couple of times that equality is only amongst equals. If they want to be treated with their national identities, ethnic identities, religious identities, or whatsoever, they would receive the equal rights within these contexts.
However, they prefer to be treated by their sexual affiliations. According to this, they will receive their treatment. Heterosexuality and homosexuality are not equals of eachother. A homosexual might be treated as an equal within the "homosexual scene", but within society, that is built on the norm of heterosexuality, they cannot expect equal treatment.
And I guess one could agree on the fact that society has always accepted heterosexuality as the norm.
Those who wish to break this norm, act against the natural harmony that exists between anyone.
Will there be a time, when people will associate themselves with their existing sexuality, rather than anything else? Then we will be doomed.

which is fair.

Forcing the public to accept their condition as an equal with the normal standards which lead our lives, and labeling others who oppose this as "bigots" is clearly fair, I assume.

---

You really are a moron if you think the "coming out process" is some kind of adoption of "gay" as your prime identity. Plenty of gay men come out and then don't ever mention it unless someone asks, or it is sensible to mention it. One of my gay friends came out last year and I've never even heard him utter the word. Coming out is a personal thing; it is letting people know who you are, that is all. There are people who adopt a more flamboyant lifestyle than others, but that is true of everyone.

Is it not? I think it's the same for you atheists, if not, you'd not be here.
It's the same for us Turkists. We have adopted Turkism as our primary political identity, with which we present ourselves before fellow Turks and other people of non-turk affiliation. Similarly, homosexuals do this.
Besides, you do not need to mention anything by word. Do I specifically tell people that I'm a Turkist? I don't have to. They understand this by my views on certain subjects, or the way I act towards people, the way I act in public, the articles I publish, or the "likes" I have on my facebook.
Similarly, homosexuals who come out, come out with their homosexual identity.
These recent times have seen the collectivisation of this homosexual identity, where a subculture was created. Perhaps not all around the world, but the fact that it exists in the USA, a country which is the prime exporter of popular culture around the world is a threat.

[Gooders1002]

Memhet I created only this thread so you can't blame in on me.
Secondly I just want to be normal and treated normally, I have very few Gay friends and lot of straight one and I don't scream my sexuality as that not how I was brought up. My sexuality is a tiny part of me, So what If I prefer other guys, I also like playing computer games, cycling in the country, getting drunk with my friends, laying in the sun, marshal arts, e.t.c.
I don't what to be treated different, I want to blend in, the only difference between us is who is next to me in bed thats it. I always what to be treated like every other average Joe and have the same rights as him. is that to much to ask. You would not know who I slept with unless you saw us together or I told you. I am like you, and I want to blend in the best I can but some parts of me will stick out slightly.
what I find more disturbing is a world were two men holding guns is more acceptable then two men holding hands.
Also I don't follow the 'gay scene' as I find it a bit unnessary

[kılıç_mehmet]

Memhet I created only this thread so you can't blame in on me.

Blame what?
I believe other peoples of this forum have noticed the lot of homosexuality themed threads around the forum, yes?

Secondly I just want to be normal and treated normally,

Well, maybe you can start by acting normal, if you don't do that already.
But other than that, do not expect me to treat you as a normal person.
Sorry.

I have very few Gay friends and lot of straight one and I don't scream my sexuality as that not how I was brought up.

Well, you don't, or you can't?

My sexuality is a tiny part of me, So what If I prefer other guys, I also like playing computer games, cycling in the country, getting drunk with my friends, laying in the sun, marshal arts, e.t.c.

Well, obviously these are things that other homosexuals like to do aswell.
But what is your identity? Do you become suddenly so defensive when someone states that he doesn't like computer games, getting drunk or laying in the sun? Obviously not.

I don't what to be treated different, I want to blend in, the only difference between us is who is next to me in bed thats it.

If you want to blend in, then I suggest that you do not sprout out as to create political controversies, yes?
Not just talking about you, I'm talking to homosexuals as a whole. But you obviously do vote for politicians on their stance regarding state policies towards the LGBT community, yes?
Then you do rather stand out with your identity. For those who want to blend in generally sacrifice a portion of their identity, always. You cannot blend in without doing that.
How would I blend in with the American public if I came there and dressed in my traditional clothing all the time?
How well would I blend in with the American public if I professed the same pride and nationalism I profess in this forum, amongst many Americans?
I'm standing out here, without really doing anything other than to write down words.

I always what to be treated like every other average Joe and have the same rights as him.

But you do have the same rights, if you do not profess to your homosexual identity as your prime identity. You can get married with a woman, you can join the military, you can do this and that and everything that normal people are legally capable of.
However, with your homosexual identity, you're barred from entering the military, or marrying, although no one tells you that you can't open a business, start a bank account, get a driver's license or own property, yes?
The state treats you differently, because you treat yourself differently from everyone else.

You would not know who I slept with unless you saw us together or I told you.

Not that I really do care. And I'm sure that no one else does.

I am like you, and I want to blend in the best I can but some parts of me will stick out slightly.

I do not want to blend in with the rest, as I do not have to do that. I am the majority. I am a Turk. There is no way for me to stick out, other than politically, perhaps, but in no other way, am I a thorn in anyone's eyes.

what I find more disturbing is a world were two men holding guns is more acceptable then two men holding hands.

Guns, weapons and arms are necessary when one's life, honour and country is at stake. Besides, our women wield guns as proficient as our men do.
There is a huge difference between two men shaking hands, and two men holding hands.