Why does God exist?

[Mystic]

The "why" in my OP is not a cause question. I asked why does God exist as opposed to nothing. I did not ask "what caused God to exist."

The idea that God is just a "brute fact" or "must have existed" I find intolerably strange. You're saying that it makes more sense for an incredibly complex, infinitely intelligent, and all powerful conscious personality to have existed first rather than just the universe by itself? The latter seems like a much more simpler answer.

Will the universe is composed of very small parts. I don't think small parts can exist by themselves without something continuously causing them to exist.

To me whatever exists by itself is such that it must be rich in existence. But if it's rich in existence, why would there be a limit? There is no reason for there to be a limit in it's existence, rather it seems whatever it is, and whatever it must be to exist on it's own, would be unbounded/unlimited.

When I see quarks, I see a limit, something setting the existence to a limit.

When I see limits, I see a limiter. But the limiter must have no limit (be ultimate) because nothing was limiting it.

[genkaus]

I was just searching for opinions on this because it really is an amazing thing to ponder.

The topic is known as Divine Aseity. Meaning God has life in Himself. God is Self Actualized.
I think what you're getting is which is the brute fact--the universe or God.
Christians dont theorize about these things and believe because its a matter of the humble heart. You go to God and ask about the truth regarding Christ. Is this real and so on and if so allow me to understand it. Then it is placed in your mind as fact by God. If belief was based on these types of conversations(which it is for many religious people) then you've built your belief upon a list of pro's. The problem is all it takes is one con to sway back and forth. Thats not what real Christian is. They Know as sure as they know their own name.
So now that thats out of the way--so you know where Im coming from.

Theist Philosophers conclude there must be a being that is "Necessary" to explain all other contingent beings otherwise the spacetime universe is the cause of itself which is incoherent. I was born in 1963...I cant plan and design myself in 1962 so I come into being.

Such is the problem with the big bang. Yes, I understand QMechanics and its virtual particles but that occurs in already existing universe so you have to keep kickin the can down the street causing us to avoid the obvious---I cannot bring myself into existence if I dont exist and with the physical universe we are always talking about a little bit of "something". It unavoidable and semantics cant escape that fact.

You can really forget about all the fine tuning that has forced multiverse conjecture and logically ludicrous infinite universe maker machines and just stick with your question--which really cant be satisfied by the universe...we must stop at God because he is not a physical spacetime object. Only an Eternal Mind satisfies all questions and is why its has been "the" explanation for existence for all of human history.

As an atheist Im sure you've heard all the infinite regress, unmoved mover, finetuning probabilities, God is not in time, so I wont bore you.

But your question is the exciting question and It seems to me that it must be chalked up to a Brute Fact that God is the only one who truly exists.

All we know is the physical world... that is bound by Time and enclosed in Space and we cant help but limit our imagination to OUR TYPE of existence.
Even though we all dream entire worlds every night that are composed merely of Thought. A space we create where objects have substance, speech is heard and things are seen that have no concrete existence apart from You sustaining them by your very Will.

One theologian said physicists are like the cartoon character looking for the clues to the illustrator in the cartoon world. I think of the actors in your dream trying to find You sleeping in your bed. The apostle Paul describes it by saying "we live, move, and have our being IN God".

As I alluded to... Im completely biased on this because I can never shake this fact placed in my head. But it makes complete and logic sense to me that the answer that best fits the physics of design, the morality and freewill we feel, and the testimony we have shows that the Universe is created and sustained by God Thought.

That although we feel rocks are hard and yellow is bright-----to God, they are not. They have no more substance or perception than we have in dreams. Everything..even the notion that " I think, therefore I am" are given to us by the only one who actually has true self actualized existence and God has given each of us a place to exist in his thought, to be free to reveal exactly who we are to him, without coercion, and with just enough proof through creation and testimony to seek him out and just enough doubt to say its all nonsense. Leaving only those who truly love the idea of his majesty and humility shown through Christ to turn to him and those who dont to feel perfectly free of coercion rejecting him.

Anyway,,thats my take. I find it amazing to think about. there is probably nothing cooler and more unfathomable as the nature of existence and what Gods life is like. He has limited us to one thought after another --a singular consciousness--and we cant imagine what it would be like to think a trillion things at once. To know, see, and fully comprehend every particle in the universe. To have no location or angle to witness things but to simply "know", inside and out, all of creation. It makes sense to me why he described himself as "I Am"

Can you tell me about your dreams from before you were born? Let's say dreams from a month before your actual birth. Or what about dreams from when you were a month old? Or two months? Or an year?

Let's make it a little easier. Can you tell me if a person who's been deaf from birth can dream of sounds or a born blind can see colors in his dream?

The point is, everything a conscious entity can dream, imagine or come up with, would ultimately be based upon reality and his perception of it. What he is incapable of perceiving, he cannot dream about. If there is nothing to perceive, for example, if you are kept and grown in an artificial womb for 40 years with all of your senses cut off, then your consicousness would never be conscious of anything - not even itself, and you'd never dream.

Existence precedes consciousness - always. Even if your assumption - that this universe is a solipsistic dream of god - is correct, then all that would mean is that god is a part of another reality which he perceives and is basing this dream upon.

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I would think he exists, because ultimate existence must exist, as opposed to nothing or finite small existence (quarks and what not). Original reality is ultimate existence. Therefore he exists, because he had to have existed.

Any logical justification for any of it? Why can't this universe be the original reality and the ultimate existence?

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So, to the Christians here, why does God exist? Please note I'm not asking what caused God to exist.

"why" is a cause question, so you're creating a paradox before we even begin. The only instance in which "why" would not be an investigation of cause is in a question like "why should God exist?" which focuses on God's effects instead.
Example (if you are skeptical):
Why are roses red? Because they were created/developed that way.
Why should roses be red? To please us/to attract bees.
As you will find, all physical objects work this way. God is not a physical object. He is out of our realm of experience. Any attempt to apply our universal laws to God will hit a dead end. God put his Word on earth to put Himself in our terms, to cross the boundary and communicate. But there's only so far He can go. Words like omnipotent and omniscient only just brush the ideas of transcendence and self-existence.

The fallacy of special pleading at its finest.

[Tea Earl Grey Hot]

The "why" in my OP is not a cause question. I asked why does God exist as opposed to nothing. I did not ask "what caused God to exist."

The idea that God is just a "brute fact" or "must have existed" I find intolerably strange. You're saying that it makes more sense for an incredibly complex, infinitely intelligent, and all powerful conscious personality to have existed first rather than just the universe by itself? The latter seems like a much more simpler answer.

Will the universe is composed of very small parts. I don't think small parts can exist by themselves without something continuously causing them to exist.

To me whatever exists by itself is such that it must be rich in existence. But if it's rich in existence, why would there be a limit? There is no reason for there to be a limit in it's existence, rather it seems whatever it is, and whatever it must be to exist on it's own, would be unbounded/unlimited.

When I see quarks, I see a limit, something setting the existence to a limit.

When I see limits, I see a limiter. But the limiter must have no limit (be ultimate) because nothing was limiting it.

Or....you're seeing the result of natural phenomena that we haven't understood yet (or maybe we have...I'm not an astrophysicist so I wouldn't know).

[genkaus]

Will the universe is composed of very small parts. I don't think small parts can exist by themselves without something continuously causing them to exist.

To me whatever exists by itself is such that it must be rich in existence. But if it's rich in existence, why would there be a limit? There is no reason for there to be a limit in it's existence, rather it seems whatever it is, and whatever it must be to exist on it's own, would be unbounded/unlimited.

When I see quarks, I see a limit, something setting the existence to a limit.

When I see limits, I see a limiter. But the limiter must have no limit (be ultimate) because nothing was limiting it.

And exactly what limits do you see in this universe? Limits of size? Of time? What limits do you see being applied to the infinitesimally small and infinitely dense singularity that was the form of the universe?

[Mystic]

It doesn't matter what the state of the original universe is, because these small parts are existing now. My argument wasn't about what the universe was but what it is. Independent existence simply seems to me to be rich in existence, and that it would have no reason to have a limit. But all parts in the universe are not all ultimate, they are limited.

[genkaus]

It doesn't matter what the state of the original universe is, because these small parts are existing now. My argument wasn't about what the universe was but what it is. Independent existence simply seems to me to be rich in existence, and that it would have no reason to have a limit. But all parts in the universe are not all ultimate, they are limited.

You didn't name any limits to the universe itself - just the limits of some of its parts.

[Darkstar]

Also, is it stranger to think of natural reality existing inexplicably by itself or God existing inexplicably by himself?

Definitely the latter. Which is why I don't understand arguments for design; as such arguments cannot be based on anything other than untestable speculation.

[Killman]

So, to the Christians here, why does God exist? Please note I'm not asking what caused God to exist. Nor am I asking "who designed or created God?" I'm not trying to frame God in a temporal terms. Merely, why does God exist as opposed to nothing existing?

Also, is it stranger to think of natural reality existing inexplicably by itself or God existing inexplicably by himself?

That is all.

God only knows.

Quite possibly the best worst answer on the forums.

[The Grand Nudger]

Sigh, only a christian would respond to the question "Why does god exist" with a (faulty) explanation of why roses are red.........

[Reforged]

So, to the Christians here, why does God exist? Please note I'm not asking what caused God to exist. Nor am I asking "who designed or created God?" I'm not trying to frame God in a temporal terms. Merely, why does God exist as opposed to nothing existing?

Also, is it stranger to think of natural reality existing inexplicably by itself or God existing inexplicably by himself?

That is all.

Haven't we be through this before? God says that no one can understand why God eternally exists. So good luck on getting a real answer.

Who said God existed by Himself, you'll not find that in scripture, even if He did He is all encompassing and would never be alone. So to answer your question, I could never believe in a existence that God was not a part of.

Sorry, God says we can't understand him? Very emo.
Only problem is most emos are very easy to understand in that they are attention seeking whores who speak about as much truth as... well... The Bible.

Oh right? Sounds abit like you're suggesting God was mentally ill. Everyone knows you're never alone when you have schizophrenia.
Probably explains the mentality of alot of his followers too.

...
:-)

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So, to the Christians here, why does God exist? Please note I'm not asking what caused God to exist. Nor am I asking "who designed or created God?" I'm not trying to frame God in a temporal terms. Merely, why does God exist as opposed to nothing existing?

Also, is it stranger to think of natural reality existing inexplicably by itself or God existing inexplicably by himself?

That is all.

God only knows.

Oooooh, bad luck. Don't worry though, you get a consolation prize;
My shit... on your doorstep. :-)