Atheist and ex-gay?

[sleep]

First of all, sorry if this is in the wrong forum.

Also apologize ahead of time if this offends anybody.

I'm too lazy/can't be bothered to be religious or study the Bible. I hate reading most fictional works, which I believe the Bible sort of is. I don't think I'm 100% atheist, but I definately don't share religious beliefs with most organized religions.

I'm a gay male and don't want to be. It has nothing to do with religion, God, Jesus, sins, all that nonsense. I have a list of reasons.

a) Any gay male I've met has been sub-par, at best, with one or (usually) more of the following: really flawed personality, shitty or no job or goals in life, substance-user, or (as shallow as this is) really unattractive, among other stuff. And yes, I fit a few of those (the one I don't fit is that I'm strictly substance-free).

b) Gay males make fools of themselves in front of everybody, and pretty much make everybody hate them. They have to force their views and agenda onto everybody.

c) Less chance of finding love, obviously. I'm a misanthrope to begin with and hate most people. Finding a gay male I get along with can be almost impossible (I'm technically in a relationship but I doubt it'll work out). Finding someone I get along with AND find attractive... mission impossible.

d) It just feels embarrassing to me. Most societies force men to "act like men", including liking (feminine) women. It'd be one thing if I was one of the masculine gay men, but I'm not. Most people know I'm gay as soon as they meet me, no matter how hard I try to hide it. I'm too stereotypical and I feel ashamed. I know that it's because I was brainwashed by society into thinking this way, but I don't think there's any way to unbrainwash me.

You'll notice I'm not mentioning gay women (lesbians). While a few have annoyed the living daylight out of me with their radical feminazi views among other stuff, most have been very nice and decent, hard-working women. So I don't have much against them. Plus, they tend to keep quiet about being lesbians.

Anyway, the ex-gay ministries out there are only religious. I don't want that. I don't care about Christ or the Bible teachings. I just want to be a straight atheist. The few friends I do have are almost all straight atheists. They're the best people I've ever met.

Among the straight atheists who dislike homosexuals, they usually give good reasons. It has no intended purpose in nature (I feel useless). The gay men I've seen and met contributed nothing good to society. The feminine ones who preach acceptance of feminine men are teaching men that it's okay to be weak and girly, and that someone should be there to protect them. If I had more radical teachings of the opposite, maybe I'd have toughened up and have been more manly.

Sorry this thread was so long, I'll stop now.

So, is there any way to make myself straight while still not caring about religion? I just want to fit into society better, not feel ashamed/embarassed about myself, meet and date decent people, etc. Thanks for reading.

PS- I would have posted this on like an ex-gay forum... couldn't find any. Just Christian forums.

[NoraBrimstone]

I'm sorry about your internalised homophobia. It must be really difficult to cope with.

Unfortunately for you, you are what you are. You cannot "turn straight" any more than I can "turn tall." You're gay, I'm short. That's the way it is. Instead of hating who you are, maybe try looking for gay support groups which can help you deal with your issues and learn to be happy to be you.

---

Oh and thanks for implying that women are weak and need looking after.

[frankiej]

Interesting, you just sound like a bit of a cunt to me.

a) Any gay male I've met has been sub-par, at best, with one or (usually) more of the following: really flawed personality, shitty or no job or goals in life, substance-user, or (as shallow as this is) really unattractive, among other stuff. And yes, I fit a few of those (the one I don't fit is that I'm strictly substance-free).

b) Gay males make fools of themselves in front of everybody, and pretty much make everybody hate them. They have to force their views and agenda onto everybody.

I haven't met any gay people like this. I met a gay guy at a party last weekend, he was one of the coolest people I've met in a long time.

And pretty much everybody hates? That is certainly not true.


Oh, welcome.

[LastPoet]

Strangely what I see in your post is just pure narcisism, so everyone else don't conform to your standarts?. You are gay and make a mis-representation of what gays are? Kind of a broad stroke you just did there.

[jonb]

Sorry this thread was so long, I'll stop now.

It seems you have problems living up to your own claims whatever they are.

[Rev. Rye]

So, is there any way to make myself straight while still not caring about religion? I just want to fit into society better, not feel ashamed/embarassed about myself, meet and date decent people, etc. Thanks for reading.

There's two things you need to know:
1) The vast majority of ex-gay programs are religious, because, simply put, that's the crowd they're catering towards.
2) More importantly, whether these ex-gay programs are religious or not, there's one very important thing that must always be kept in mind: they don't work. At the most, it can just change behavior. It doesn't change desire, and I can't find a single instance in history where it has. Seriously, try to find one person who went through an ex-gay program, is currently leading a fulfilling sex life with somebody of the opposite sex, but doesn't have a job working for an ex-gay program. I thought not.

Judging from the rest of your post, it seems you have bigger problems than being gay.

[Kayenneh]

I think this has nothing with you being gay, you just have a really shitty attitude.

a) Any gay male I've met has been sub-par, at best, with one or (usually) more of the following: really flawed personality, shitty or no job or goals in life, substance-user, or (as shallow as this is) really unattractive, among other stuff. And yes, I fit a few of those (the one I don't fit is that I'm strictly substance-free).

Huh. All gay men I've met have been quite decent guys, actually.

b) Gay males make fools of themselves in front of everybody, and pretty much make everybody hate them. They have to force their views and agenda onto everybody.

That's one hell of a generalization. I can say for sure that I've met more straight people who make fools of themselves than gay. And no gay has ever forced his or her opinion onto me.

c) Less chance of finding love, obviously. I'm a misanthrope to begin with and hate most people. Finding a gay male I get along with can be almost impossible (I'm technically in a relationship but I doubt it'll work out). Finding someone I get along with AND find attractive... mission impossible.

Bolding mine. With that attitude you won't probably succeed.

d) It just feels embarrassing to me. Most societies force men to "act like men", including liking (feminine) women. It'd be one thing if I was one of the masculine gay men, but I'm not. Most people know I'm gay as soon as they meet me, no matter how hard I try to hide it. I'm too stereotypical and I feel ashamed. I know that it's because I was brainwashed by society into thinking this way, but I don't think there's any way to unbrainwash me.

Welcome to the gender equality era. Either you can be a front figure and tell the world it's alright to be a 'feminine' man, a 'masculine' woman, a total dude or girly girl, or then you can hide in a corner and whimper. The choice is yours. BTW, talking about stereotypical gay guys, this guy is a hoot and a fantastic artist at that. You could take some notes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96SMw0wU5QI

I just want to be a straight atheist.

You are aware of the fact that you can't chose your sexuality, right..?

The few friends I do have are almost all straight atheists. They're the best people I've ever met.

Well, they're your friends. If they're awesome people, probably they think the same of you. A comforting thought, no?

The feminine ones who preach acceptance of feminine men are teaching men that it's okay to be weak and girly, and that someone should be there to protect them.

I hope that you don't seriously mean that. 'Girly' does not equal weak, or in need of protection. What an idiotic notion.

If I had more radical teachings of the opposite, maybe I'd have toughened up and have been more manly.

You can still toughen up. Being 'manly' has absolutely nothing to do with it.

[frankiej]

I'd also like to add that all the gay people I know are funny as hell. They make for great banter. I always like having someone who I can bounce jokes off of and they will know exactly how to steer the joke to make it funnier.

[Faith No More]

So, because you can't find the right guy you're going to switch teams? The world would be in chaos if everyone changed their sexuality simply because they can't find the right mate.

I don't think the problem is your sexuality. I think the problem is your ability to accept your sexuality. You can't change your sexuality despite how many people claim they have. They've just repressed their feelings and are living a lie. Even the president of Exodus International has come out and said that you can't change a person's sexuality. There could be another problem there, too, and that is you are too picky.

Just accept yourself for you are and fuck those people that make you feel like you don't fit in.

[C.W. Sims]

Wow, you said you hope this doesn't offend someone and then spew complete crap like that. Let me elucidate. I am a gay man, most people who I speak with in regular society, even jobs, are quite shocked to learn I am gay. I just act like me, not like a stereotype.

When it comes to forcing views on people the only views I have are that we should all be free to live our lives the way we see fit. As to any moronic gay pride bullshit I have never and will never participate in any of that foolish nonsense that simply does more to set us back than it does to help us in any way. Not to mention I don't find being gay something to be proud of, I was born this way, it's not a fucking achievement. I don't even wear rainbow jewelry, though I have no problem with other people doing so. After all it doesn't hurt anyone and again, we should all be free to live our lives as we see fit.

I have a huge sense of personal responsibility, and believe that one must take such responsibility for all of their actions. As such I do not have an addiction to any illegal substance, or even any legal drugs. I don't even drink. I have plenty of goals in my life, and the fact that I do not have a job is because I travel with my partner as his passenger in his very well paying job. A decision we came to together, over several months, because any other solution would have meant we rarely spent any time together, hence I will be his navigator and companion.

As to your personal shame, that's your own skeleton to deal with and I hope you find a way to heal, but with the attitude you have no I must simply say good luck. You have a lot of issues to get over and will likely need intense psychological help from a professional. None of them will help you turn straight, even those who claim to. They might help you act straight, but not be straight. There is nothing wrong with being gay, and your past experiences aside many of us are actually very good people. My partner is quite a lot like me actually. Your problem is a shitty attitude and an intense self hatred along with internalized homophobia.

As to gays not being something that has a purpose in nature, just because a purpose is not obviously forthcoming does not mean we do not have one. After all homosexuality is evident in plenty of other species as well. Especially those who engage in sexual actions for pleasure. And when it come to your views that the gays you have met haven't contributed to society you show just how arrogant and opinionated you are to assume something so broad about those you have met. Not to mention you seem to think that those of us you haven't met are incapable of contributing in any meaningful way. That's simply ignorant and rude.

You also seem to have a dislike, or even hatred of the feminine male. I can't really even give you advice there, as I am not a feminine male, nor am I attracted to them. But I have been friends with them, some of them have been really great people. They are no less useful to society because of this. They are no less valid as human beings who deserve love and respect. There are parts of society that look down on them, but frankly, fuck them. They have absolutely no reason to judge or condemn them because of a personality trait.

My advice is this, and only this, get help from a legitimate psychologist who can help you come to terms with yourself and get rid of all the hatred and homophobia. You can live a happy life, and find someone worth caring about if you only try. But you have got to drop this ignorant attitude.