[split]Ron Paul plays Yahtzee with Nazis

[cratehorus]

Yeah, the Fed is pretty much a train off its rails and the conductor and engineer have jumped ship.

Also, it seems you've experienced the absolute idiocy of Cratehorus that I've already had to deal with.

how are you doing creed of heresy? .............

[A Theist]

Really? After I spend quite a long time breaking apart your argument and responding to it, you come back with a one line "prove it" and an unrelated picture?

The John Birch Society is a white power group, are you saying he didn't speak there, or are you saying it's not a white supremacist group? Or do you just have no clue what you're talking about?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Birch_Society

I'd tell you to go learn how to debate properly again, but it's clear this isn't a debate anymore. It's just you trying desperately to discredit me by using baseless accusations, all because I tore apart your entire argument in my first post.

I'm not sure what you've been debating exactly but I'm not debating, I'm informing you he's a nazi, and has been for over 40 years, if you don't beleive me (for whatever reason) there's nothing I can do to help

If you (or anyone else) happens to want to read up on why the Fed is out of control, or at least should be audited and kept under close scrutiny by Congress, there is a good Wikipedia page about it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_...al_Reserve

Federal reserve isn't a problem no matter what Ron Paul's you tube videos say

From the wikipedia link you posted, I read that the JBS society actually came under sharp criticism from "Antisemitic, racist, anti-Mormon, anti-Masonic, and various religious groups" for its inclusion of Jews, non-whites, Masons and Mormons...doesn't sound like a White Power group to me.....

Former Eisenhower cabinet member Ezra Taft Benson — a leading Mormon — spoke in favor of the John Birch Society, but in January 1963 the LDS church issued a statement distancing itself from the Society.[38] Antisemitic, racist, anti-Mormon, anti-Masonic, and various religious groups criticized the group's acceptance of Jews, non-whites, Masons, and Mormons. These opponents accused Welch of harboring feminist, ecumenical, and evolutionary ideas.[39][40][41] Welch rejected these accusations by his detractors: "All we are interested in here is opposing the advance of the Communists, and eventually destroying the whole Communist conspiracy, so that Jews and Christians alike, and Mohammedans and Buddhists, can again have a decent world in which to live."

Also interesting in the article is that the JBS has been labled as Ultraconservative, far right, and extremist by a ultraliberal, far left, extremist leftist hate group, Southern Poverty Law Center.

[cratehorus]

I am not sure if John Birch Society is really a group that believes in stripping power and wealth from others to concentrate them in the hands of whites, as white power might be reasonably taken to mean, as much as a group that really has been inclusive of non whites, but morbidly consider the prevention of collectivist action not sponsored by itself to be a higher good than anything such collectivist action might achieve.

The new KKK does not go around screaming Niggers and Jews while they dress up in white hoods, even stormfront.org blocks curse words and racial slurs.

In the 1960s Welch insisted that the Johnson administration's fight against communism in Vietnam was part of a communist plot aimed at taking over the United States. Welch demanded that the United States get out of Vietnam, thus aligning the Society with the left. The society opposed water fluoridation, which it called "mass medicine" and saw as a communist plot to poison Americans.

The JBS was moderately active in the 1960s with numerous chapters, but rarely engaged in coalition building with other conservatives. Indeed, it was rejected by most conservatives because of Welch's conspiracy theories. As Ayn Rand said in a 1964 Playboy interview, "I consider the Birch Society futile, because they are not for capitalism but merely against communism ... I gather they believe that the disastrous state of today's world is caused by a communist conspiracy. This is childishly naive and superficial. No country can be destroyed by a mere conspiracy, it can be destroyed only by ideas." Of course- a conspiracy that seeks to teach us all certain ideas through media or education is still a conspiracy.

Former Eisenhower cabinet member Ezra Taft Benson — a leading Mormon — spoke in favor of the John Birch Society, but in January 1963 the LDS church issued a statement distancing itself from the Society. Antisemitic, racist, anti-Mormon, anti-Masonic, and various religious groups criticized the group's acceptance of Jews, non-whites, Masons, and Mormons.

10. Willis Carto

Willis Carto is a holocaust denier, Hitler admirer and a white supremacist. A former campaigner for segregationist candidate George Wallace, Carto founded the National Alliance with William Pierce, the author of the “Turner Diaries,” which is credited for inspiring Timothy McVeigh. Carto founded the Populist Party in 1984 and ran David Duke as a presidential candidate. Carto also founded the American Free Press, which is labeled as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC), where Paul’s column runs. Paul has not sued Carto for running his column or explained how it wound up in a white supremacist publication. The New York Times writes that Paul used the subscription list to a white supremacist publication of Carto’s to solicit donations

9. Chuck Baldwin

Chuck Baldwin is a neo-Confederate New World Order conspiracy theorist who praises the confederacy and its leaders, Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson, and calls the Civil War the “War of Northern Aggression.” Baldwin writes a weekly column on the white supremacist site Vdare and is a proud supporter of American militia movements. Baldwin is also an Islamaphobe and homophobe.

Not only did Baldwin endorse Paul for president in 2007, but Paul returned the favor, endorsing Baldwin, who he calls his “friend,” for president in 2008. While Paul was quick to criticize Michele Bachmann for her Islamaphobia, he has said nothing about Baldwin’s, the man he endorsed for president. Here are some choice quotes from Baldwin: "I believe homosexuality is moral perversion and deserves no special consideration under the law." "I believe the South was right in the War Between the States, and I am not a racist."

8. Don Black

Don Black is a former Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan, a current member of the American Nazi Party, and the owner and operator of the white supremacist site Stormfront. Black regularly organizes “money bombs” for Ron and Rand Paul and has even taken a picture with Ron Paul, who refused to return donations from Black and Stormfront even with the political tradition of not accepting donations from people who seem unfit. Black, who was sentenced to three years in jail for trying to overthrow the Caribbean country of Dominica in 1981, supports Paul through his Twitter account and on message boards for Stormfront.

7. Lew Rockwell

Lew Rockwell is a close friend and adviser of Paul’s who served as his congressional chief of staff between 1978 and 1982, worked as a paid consultant for Paul for more than 20 years, and was an editor and alleged ghost writer for his racist newsletters. Rockwell formed the Ludwig Von Mises Institute, which Paul still has a close working relationship with.

The Ludwig Von Mises Institute is listed by the SPLC as a neo-Confederate organization. They also add that Rockwell said that the Civil War “transformed the American regime from a federalist system based on freedom to a centralized state that circumscribed liberty in the name of public order” and that the Civil Rights Movement was the “involuntary servitude” of (presumably white) business owners. Rockwell was listed as one of the racist League of the South’s founding members but denies membership. Rockwell regularly posts articles on his website, attacking a New World Order conspiracy.

6. David Duke

David Duke is a former Grand Wizard of the Ku Klux Klan and candidate for Governor of Louisiana. Duke is also a New World Order conspiracy theorist who believes that Jews control the Federal Reserve. On his website, Duke proudly boasts about the endorsements and kind words that Paul gave him in his newsletters and in turn endorses Paul for president:


Duke’s platform called for tax cuts, no quotas, no affirmative action, no welfare, and no busing…
To many voters, this seems like just plain good sense. Duke carried baggage from his past, the voters were willing to overlook that. If he had been afforded the forgiveness an ex-communist gets, he might have won.

5. Thomas DiLorenzo

Thomas DiLorenzo is another neo-Confederate who believes the South was right in the the civil war and that Abraham Lincoln was a wicked man who destroyed states’ rights. DiLorenzo is listed as an affiliated scholar with the racist League of the South, which promotes segregation and a new southern secession. Paul invited DiLorenzo to testify before congress about the Federal Reserve and is close friends with Paul and works for the Ludwig Von Mises Instiute. Paul cited DiLorezno’s book when telling Tim Russert that the North should not have fought the Civil War.

4. James Von Brunn

James Von Brunn was a white supremacist and anti-Semite who opened fired at the Holocaust museum, killing an African-American security guard. Von Brunn was an avid Paul supporter who posted a message on the Ron Paul Yahoo Group, saying, “HITLER’S WORST MISTAKE: HE DIDN’T GAS THE JEWS.” In 1983, Von Brunn was convicted of kidnapping members of the Federal Reserve Board, a common target of Paul’s, and was sentenced to six years in prison.Von Brunn died while awaiting sentencing for his crime.

3. William Alexander “Bill” White

Bill White is a neo-Nazi who is a former member of of the neo-Nazi group the National Socialist Movement and founder of his own Nazi group, the National Socialist Worker’s Movement. He has called for the lynching of the Jena 6 and the assassination of NAACP leaders. White previously campaigned for Pat Buchanan and the Reform party. This year, White was convicted of threatening a juror but then freed by a judge who called the threats free speech. White is a former Ron Paul supporter who became disenfranchised with Paul, when a Paul spokesman called white supremacy “a small ideology.” Here is what White wrote about Paul on a popular white supremacist website:


I have kept quiet about the Ron Paul campaign for a while, because I didn’t see any need to say anything that would cause any trouble. However, reading the latest release from his campaign spokesman, I am compelled to tell the truth about Ron Paul’s extensive involvement in white nationalism.

Both Congressman Paul and his aides regularly meet with members of the Stormfront set, American Renaissance, the Institute for Historic Review, and others at the Tara Thai restaurant in Arlington, Virginia, usually on Wednesdays.

2. Richard Poplawski

Richard Poplawski is a neo-Nazi from Pittsburgh who regularly posted on the neo-Nazi website Stormfront. Poplawski would post videos of Ron Paul talking about FEMA camp conspiracy theories with Glenn Beck.

Polawski was afraid of a government conspiracy to take away people’s guns and wound up killing three police officers who came to his house after his mother made a domestic dispute call.

1. Jules Manson

Jules Manson was a failed politician from Carson, Calif. Mason was also a big Paul supporter who would write, “I may be an athiest, but Ron Paul is my God,” on Paul’s website. Manson would also write, “Assassinate that n*gger and his family of monkeys,” of President Barack Obama.

This is not guilty by association. Ron Paul has spread white supremacy on conspiracy theories for years in his newsletters. The racism and conspiracy theories have driven some people to violence. Not only have Ron Paul’s racist supporters endorsed him and his views, he has endorsed them through his positions on the Civil War and the Civil Rights movement, without disavowing the support he gets from racists. This is guilt by racism.

Top 10 Racist Ron Paul Friends, Supporters
http://newsone.com/1748295/top-10-racist...upporters/

[Tiberius]

The John Birch Society is a white power group, are you saying he didn't speak there, or are you saying it's not a white supremacist group? Or do you just have no clue what you're talking about?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Birch_Society

Nothing on that page suggests they are a white supremacist group...

I'm not sure what you've been debating exactly but I'm not debating, I'm informing you he's a nazi, and has been for over 40 years, if you don't beleive me (for whatever reason) there's nothing I can do to help

No, you've claimed he is a Nazi, and you've provided no actual evidence other than your opinion coupled with several fallacious arguments.

Federal reserve isn't a problem no matter what Ron Paul's you tube videos say

I was hoping you would say that. The first audit of the Fed says differently:

http://beforeitsnews.com/economy/2012/09...49770.html

$16 trillion dollars loaned out at 0% interest to banks and corporations, both foreign and domestic.

[Tempus]

Homer: Do we want Old Man Patterson here with his finger on the button?
Patterson: What button? What the hell are you talking about?

[cratehorus]

$16 trillion dollars loaned out at 0% interest to banks and corporations, both foreign and domestic.

Do you really, really, reeeeeeeally think that an obstetrician knows fuck about economics? He hates the federal reserve because white nationalist groups, have tried several times to form their own currency, currently in America that is illegal and considered an act of terrorism, and treason. The main controlling factor in this, is The Federal Reserve, nothing else. It is only because ron paul wants coins printed with his face on it:



This is why white supremacists want the federal reserve abolished... nothing more. I see your worried about the $16 trillion in "reserve currency" given to banks over a 3 year period. But do you know what the OTC derivative market is worth? Last I checked, it was worth $689 trillion, I'm not sure what it is today, maybe you can help me out and find that for me?

[Tiberius]

Do you think Obama (a lawyer) knows fuck all about economics? Hell, if you're going to vote for people based on how much they know about economics, surely Romney (a businessman) is your guy? Businessmen have to know about economics; it's how they make profit.

Ron Paul is a libertarian. There are numerous libertarian-leaning economic schools, and numerous libertarian organizations that study and write about economic policy.

If you think Ron Paul is a white supremacist, or wants to abolish the fed so he can make money with his own face on it...PRESENT EVIDENCE.

As for how much the OTC derivative market is worth, how is that relevant to the facts I just stated? $16 trillion was simply given out to businesses and governments around the world, with 0% interest. $16 trillion of taxpayers money, without their permission, and without authorization by Congress or any other body of government. Are you seriously still arguing the Fed isn't out of control?

[DeistPaladin]

Do you think Obama (a lawyer) knows fuck all about economics? Hell, if you're going to vote for people based on how much they know about economics, surely Romney (a businessman) is your guy? Businessmen have to know about economics; it's how they make profit.

Well, in the case of Romney, it's the wrong kind of businessman. He's a corporate raider who takes over companies, loads them up with debt, sells off their assets and lays off their workforce.

He once slipped on the campaign trail and called America a "company". Be afraid.

[Tiberius]

Well, in the case of Romney, it's the wrong kind of businessman. He's a corporate raider who takes over companies, loads them up with debt, sells off their assets and lays off their workforce.

He once slipped on the campaign trail and called America a "company". Be afraid.

Oh sure, but I think my point still stands. Obama is no more qualified than Ron Paul. Romney studied a business degree, which probably including economics modules. Him knowing more about economics doesn't make him a better candidate of course.

[cratehorus]

Do you think Obama (a lawyer) knows fuck all about economics? Hell, if you're going to vote for people based on how much they know about economics, surely Romney (a businessman) is your guy? Businessmen have to know about economics; it's how they make profit.

NO, but he does seem to listen to world's top nobel prize winning economists. Instead of having some weird ulterior motive. Unless you think Obama is a communist, which I'm guessing you do. Obama's not just a lawyer either. I didn't vote for him so he could fix "the economy" there were few other reasons, the economy didn't become a concern of any right wingers when bush was around? It's not a recession, anyway if every rich person has a shitload more money then they did before. That's not a recession that's a theft. Obama graduated top of his class at Harvard Law and was the first black president of the Harvard Law Review. Ron Paul isn't even a good vagina doctor

Ron Paul is a libertarian. There are numerous libertarian-leaning economic schools, and numerous libertarian organizations that study and write about economic policy.

I was actually hoping you were a "real" libertarian like Mikhail Bakunin (who I've been reading about recently) , Ayn Rand (considered the mother of Objectivism), Milton Freidman (founder of trickle down economics), or Emma Goldman (considered founder of American anarchism).............. None of which have been involved in the white supremacist movement. The white nationalist movement began calling themselves "libertarians" in the 1980's.

If you want to be a real libertarian that's great!!! but it has absolutely nothing, at all, in the fucking world, to do with this fucking federal reserve BULLSHIT................

If you think Ron Paul is a white supremacist, or wants to abolish the fed so he can make money with his own face on it...PRESENT EVIDENCE.

I have......I even posted a whole book written about it...... you are asking for an unreasonable amount of evidence. Why don't you list what you're impossibly high standards of, what you consider, evidence are. And I'll try my best for ya

As for how much the OTC derivative market is worth, how is that relevant to the facts I just stated? $16 trillion was simply given out to businesses and governments around the world, with 0% interest. $16 trillion of taxpayers money, without their permission, and without authorization by Congress or any other body of government. Are you seriously still arguing the Fed isn't out of control?

The Federal Reserve is fine, it has no more problems than the board of education or the EPA or any of the other group, it's like saying mcdonalds has some problems let's outlaw their restaraunt. The money is not taxpayer money, first of all, second of all it's an accounting tool, just electrons, they didn't ship a boat of dollar bills, or gold bricks to all those counries did they? Their's no need to audit the federal reserve becuase it will only serve to hurt, the whole purpose, of the federal reserve.

SO if you don't beleive the money is just electrons then where is the $689 trillion that OTC Derivative people own? Is it in a secret underground vault somewhere? We should go get it! I was actually expecting the audit to be something like $500 trillion but it's only $16 trillion of reserve currency (which i'm sure you never bothered to google the difference between real currency) over a three year period to several banks including international ones..... If anything this proves Ron Paul is full of shit.