Excavating The Empty Tomb

[Angrboda]

There's a youtube channel with the whole series (click the link below). I watched through part 5 last night. I have my afternoon entertainment lined up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jOzCMy9e...9CD0684793

[Minimalist]

Min, can you tell me what the jist of the argument is so I don't have to watch the videos?

No, watch the videos. Are you afraid of learning something?


Most xtians are, btw.

Witness the brown stains on the pants of your confederates here.

[Drich]

It's pointless. Just like with the odysseus Jesus comparison I just dispelled. It was proven wrong by several different sources and it was glanced over by all of you. Why? because no one here is vested in anything the video says. We can go through every single line of these things and dispel all of them, and it means nothing to any of you. For there are 100 more videos just like it. Just like with Odysseus and Jesus when you have no where to go You will just move on to the next. Then in 3 months someone else will bring this first series back up like it was factual truth... I've been down this road a few times with the zygeists movie. I found unless you are made to pick a point and defend specific points, arguing this crap is a fools errand.

[The Grand Nudger]

Emptier words have never been spoken. I'd only ask the faithful to stick to one point and defend it, but they (and you) are incapable. Fools errand indeed.

[Godscreated]

Isn't it funny how nonbelivers will make fun of us for taking the word of those who lived during Christ time, yet they will take the word of those who are 2000 years removed from that time as absolute fact.

[Cato]

Isn't it funny how nonbelivers will make fun of us for taking the word of those who lived during Christ time, yet they will take the word of those who are 2000 years removed from that time as absolute fact.

Uh, still waiting for words from those that lived during Christ's time.

[Minimalist]

Don't hold your breath.


The Homeric references are less compelling than he might think. Literacy was so circumscribed in antiquity that virtually every highly literate person would have heard of, if not read, Homer. So I suspect that variants of the Homeric tales appeared in a lot of ancient literature and with a little stretching could be made to resemble almost any hero. Some of the seafaring omissions by "Matty" and "Luke" who copied much of "Mark's" gibberish into their own gibberish are consistent with the idea that "Mark" didn't know jack shit about the geography of Galilee.

Far more compelling are the copyings from the OT and in the insertion of OT words into the mouths of jesus and others. This is the basis of Earl Doherty's "Jesus Puzzle" which is certainly worth reading.

Then there are the equally well-documented edits and scribal fuck ups which Bart Ehrman has detailed in his books.

Of particular interest was the list of heroic figures who were "taken up to heaven" indicating that this was also a common literary motif in the Hellenistic world. Livy's discussion of the "ascension" of Romulus was particularly amusing but the point remains that if someone wanted to be taken seriously in antiquity then they had to fly up to fucking heaven at the end of the tale..... even mohammed took a trip there! And of course, Greek literature is full of tales of heroes going down to Hades for one reason or another to fuck with the dead.

He does provide cross references which enables some fact-checking and so far he has been correct in everything I examined but it does drag the process out somewhat. There are far more than 16 episodes to this series. I had to take a break during the "saul/paul" bullshit because that crap is hard to swallow at the best of times.

I'll see how he finishes up tomorrow.

[Zarith]

Really interesting series so far. Thanks for posting.

[Cato]

Don't hold your breath.


The Homeric references are less compelling than he might think. Literacy was so circumscribed in antiquity that virtually every highly literate person would have heard of, if not read, Homer. So I suspect that variants of the Homeric tales appeared in a lot of ancient literature and with a little stretching could be made to resemble almost any hero.

I took this as a central theme to the argument. If Christ's deeds and words were of any unique importance, then why did the very literate authors invoke limited and popular literary themes to express the message?

[KichigaiNeko]

Don't hold your breath.


The Homeric references are less compelling than he might think. Literacy was so circumscribed in antiquity that virtually every highly literate person would have heard of, if not read, Homer. So I suspect that variants of the Homeric tales appeared in a lot of ancient literature and with a little stretching could be made to resemble almost any hero.

I took this as a central theme to the argument. If Christ's deeds and words were of any unique importance, then why did the very literate authors invoke limited and popular literary themes to express the message?

Why indeed cato. Why did Homer write? I think the Chrestians might be a clue?