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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 8:13 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2013 at 8:18 am by Drich.)
(June 6, 2013 at 11:03 pm)orogenicman Wrote: (June 6, 2013 at 10:21 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do bad things happen to good people? Why do children get cancer? Why do bad people always seem to thrive?
Those questions have been asked and answers searched for since man became an introspective creature. The simplest answer is that these things happen because they can happen. The universe has no vested interest in preventing your child from getting cancer. It doesn't care. How could it? The laws of nature are not judgmental. Only people are. How is this any different than a world with God?
(June 7, 2013 at 1:35 am)FifthElement Wrote: (June 6, 2013 at 10:21 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do bad things happen to good people?
Bad things happen to bad people too, believe me, I know 
Example: Fucktard who was responsible for my torturing got 20 years in prison 
That sounds like a fun story.
(June 7, 2013 at 1:43 am)Esquilax Wrote: (June 6, 2013 at 10:21 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do bad things happen to good people? Why do children get cancer? Why do bad people always seem to thrive?
Aren't these questions more relevant in a world that supposedly features a benevolent deity that interacts with the world? 
...and what if the God of the bible is not the Omni benevolent God some people claim Him to be? After all most of you are quick to point out all the mean stuff He did or has done to people He did not like.
(June 7, 2013 at 1:49 am)Rhythm Wrote: (June 6, 2013 at 10:21 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do bad things happen to good people? Because "things" are always happening to people. A certain subset of those "things" are bad - and a certain subset of those people are good. Wherever those two subsets overlap -bad things are happening to good people.
Quote:Why do children get cancer?
The answer would depend upon what type of cancer we're talking about. Generally, genetics, tobacco, diet and physical activity, sun and UV exposure, radiation exposure....and a whole host of other carcinogens.
Quote:Why do bad people always seem to thrive?
You're asking -us- why -you- perceive something a specific way. In any case.... circumventing the rules that others follow can sometimes offer you an advantage.
If these things are true in a world you believe to be with out God, then why can the very same explanation work in a world with God?
(June 7, 2013 at 2:17 am)max-greece Wrote: In a world without God?
Oh - like this one.
A world just like this o e
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 8:29 am
(June 7, 2013 at 8:13 am)Drich Wrote:
If these things are true in a world you believe to be with out God, then why can the very same explanation work in a world with God? If these things are true in a world without god and consistent with the data we gather regarding our own world, why would you feel the need to add a god to the equation? To put it another way, if god can be added or subtracted from the equation with no impact on the results, you have an unnecessary god.
Sum ergo sum
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 8:31 am
A world without the abrahamic god?
 wonderful!
"The Universe is run by the complex interweaving of three elements: energy, matter, and enlightened self-interest." G'Kar-B5
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 8:39 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2013 at 8:41 am by Drich.)
(June 7, 2013 at 8:29 am)Ben Davis Wrote: (June 7, 2013 at 8:13 am)Drich Wrote:
If these things are true in a world you believe to be with out God, then why can the very same explanation work in a world with God? If these things are true in a world without god and consistent with the data we gather regarding our own world, why would you feel the need to add a god to the equation? To put it another way, if god can be added or subtracted from the equation with no impact on the results, you have an unnecessary god. Only if your idea of God is one who's sole purpose is to make your life easier for you to live.
-maybe God's interaction with us goes deeper than granting wishes and providing the good life.
(June 7, 2013 at 8:31 am)KichigaiNeko Wrote: A world without the abrahamic god?
wonderful! You do know the only place without the Abrahamic God is Hell right??
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 8:52 am
In a world without god....
- what would make people believe that such an entity exists?
- what would make different groups of people believe in different sets of such deities?
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 8:52 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2013 at 9:08 am by Faith No More.)
(June 6, 2013 at 10:21 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do bad things happen to good people? Why do children get cancer? Why do bad people always seem to thrive?
Because an indifferent universe cares not for human qualifiers such as "good" and "bad."
Even if the open windows of science at first make us shiver after the cozy indoor warmth of traditional humanizing myths, in the end the fresh air brings vigor, and the great spaces have a splendor of their own - Bertrand Russell
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 9:03 am
(June 7, 2013 at 8:13 am)Drich Wrote: (June 6, 2013 at 11:03 pm)orogenicman Wrote: Those questions have been asked and answers searched for since man became an introspective creature. The simplest answer is that these things happen because they can happen. The universe has no vested interest in preventing your child from getting cancer. It doesn't care. How could it? The laws of nature are not judgmental. Only people are. How is this any different than a world with God?
I never said it was, but since you brought it up, the main differences are that it refutes prayer, refutes a controlling deity that can manipulate and/or perform miracles in contradiction to natural laws to our benefit, or that there is a god that has your best interest at heart.
'The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and seal. It could not be expressed better.'
-- Samuel "Mark Twain" Clemens
"I think that in the discussion of natural problems we ought to begin not with the scriptures, but with experiments, demonstrations, and observations".
- Galileo Galilei (1564-1642)
"In short, Meyer has shown that his first disastrous book was not a fluke: he is capable of going into any field in which he has no training or research experience and botching it just as badly as he did molecular biology. As I've written before, if you are a complete amateur and don't understand a subject, don't demonstrate the Dunning-Kruger effect by writing a book about it and proving your ignorance to everyone else! "
- Dr. Donald Prothero
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 9:12 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2013 at 10:09 am by Ben Davis.)
(June 7, 2013 at 8:39 am)Drich Wrote:
Only if your idea of God is one who's sole purpose is to make your life easier for you to live.
-maybe God's interaction with us goes deeper than granting wishes and providing the good life. You misunderstand. I didn't suggest any purpose for the god, I stated that if the god can have no consequence (i.e. no interaction, makes no difference to the results) then it is inconsequential. A tautology, I know but one which it's important to point out from time to time. By the logic you're using in this thread, you can only arrive at an unnecessary god.
Sum ergo sum
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 9:18 am
(June 6, 2013 at 10:21 pm)Drich Wrote: Why do bad things happen to good people? Why do children get cancer? Why do bad people always seem to thrive?
Two words: Shit happens.
Christian apologetics is the art of rolling a dog turd in sugar and selling it as a donut.
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RE: In a world without God...
June 7, 2013 at 9:25 am
(This post was last modified: June 7, 2013 at 9:27 am by The Grand Nudger.)
(June 7, 2013 at 8:13 am)Drich Wrote: If these things are true in a world you believe to be with out God, then why can the very same explanation work in a world with God? Why -can't- I'm assuming you meant to ask? Who said they couldn't? I see nothing in those explanations which wouldn't work in a world with an indifferent god, a capricious god, or a powerless god- for example. Each type of god has been bandied about from time to time, place to place.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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