Rand Paul

[DeistPaladin]

He's about as "libertarian" as his daddy was.

Actually, I think Ron Paul IS a libertarian, complete with pro-choice, legalize pot and the rest of the socially-liberal views that are supposed to be part of being a libertarian. I could be wrong but it's his son that went with the evangelicals to become the hardcore authoritarian conservative that he is now.

Like Min, I have no love for libertarians but, if I'm ever elected president, I would love to have someone like Ron Paul in charge of auditing the Pentagon.

[Tiberius]

Rand Paul is rabidly anti-choice, pro-surveillance state and cozies up to the religious right. Can anyone name for me a single socially-liberal position he's taken?

Other than the "pro-surveillance state" remark, I agree with you. He is in no way a Libertarian (he's said as much himself), but he is most certainly not pro-surveillance state. He introduced this amendment recently, and has been supportive of Edward Snowden (he appeared on some news channel this week suggesting the guy flee to Iceland).

But yeah, he's not a Libertarian. I wouldn't call him an authoritarian either; he's a Republican who stands up for a number of civil liberties, just not as many as Libertarians stand up for.

[Raven]

Libertarian is rarely (if ever) more than shorthand for Adam Smith worshiping, market fetishizing, Ayn Rand deifying dirtbag. They were never liberal, never wanted to be. Bernie Sanders is a liberal.

[Tiberius]

They were never liberal, never wanted to be.

Nice to see you denying history: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_liberalism

Besides, the word "Libertarian" alludes to "liberties", since being a "liberal" started meaning something different in the last century.

[LastPoet]

Libertarian is rarely (if ever) more than shorthand for Adam Smith worshiping, market fetishizing, Ayn Rand deifying dirtbag. They were never liberal, never wanted to be. Bernie Sanders is a liberal.

People that put libertarians in a generalizing strawmanned cathegory are no different from the people that claim atheists are amoral sin-loving baby eaters. It should be obvious to you how much of a fail that post is.

[Raven]

Classical liberalism has precious little to do with the modern concept of liberalism. FDR, Truman, LBJ, Dennis Kucinich - that's liberalism as currently understood.

[Tiberius]

Classical liberalism has precious little to do with the modern concept of liberalism. FDR, Truman, LBJ, Dennis Kucinich - that's liberalism as currently understood.

That was my point! You said "They were never liberal, never wanted to be."

The Libertarian movement evolved out of the classical liberal movement, after liberal started to mean something else. Libertarians were at one point the very definition of "liberal".

[Minimalist]

There are so few actual libertarians that it hardly matters wtf they say. What they mainly are is a small gang of republicunts who think the drug laws should be tossed out so they can get high.

Given their vision of the country - they are already high as kites.

[Tiberius]

Loving the ignorance Min.

[Raven]

Classical liberalism has precious little to do with the modern concept of liberalism. FDR, Truman, LBJ, Dennis Kucinich - that's liberalism as currently understood.

That was my point! You said "They were never liberal, never wanted to be."

The Libertarian movement evolved out of the classical liberal movement, after liberal started to mean something else. Libertarians were at one point the very definition of "liberal".

True enough, but that was back so long ago - who cares? Today's libertarians find modern liberalism repellent. They have no use for social welfare programs, they just want no regulations, no taxes, privatize everything and if you don't make it on your own, too bad.