Fuck Churches

[bladevalant546]

I am a preachers kid, I was heavily involved in the Methodist church years and once I got older understood the financial situations that some smaller church do face. With that said, I will sum up what I heard ONE pastor state while they were discussing taxes and accounting management and I quote “Naw this stuff is not too bad, I used to run a business and this is really no different from what I already know and done.” How in the world can you be “humanitarian” if you run the whole damn thing like a business? Business are in it for making money. I have further evidence of this. My father who faithfully served 20 years as a remarkable pastor was screw out of his retirement why? Because he served in New Mexico before I was born and suffered a heart attack. Because of his lack of experience he did not have the best health insurance, and suffered bankruptcy. Because of that moment he had to go to doctors to “prove” he was physically able to serve. After receiving the green light by 3 doctors the New Mexican conference still denied him anything. Fast forward year later, my dad now serves under the Louisiana Conference. Officially he is still part of the New Mexican conference, he cannot become a full fledge member of the Louisiana conference. That barred him from his full retirement benefits, and now life insurance. They found a loop after 20 years to not pay him his life insurance. Now crippled with health debt, if anything happens my mother or if both die myself will receive nothing and maybe inherit a ton of debt. By the way one of the “small” churches my dad served had over 1 million in savings.

I can continue, when I was with a bible college was HAD to attend their church. Outside the church was a Lamborghini, we were all commenting on that nice 150k-500k car. Later that service they had an altar call for people in financial need. I have given up because after years and years of prayer my family was never given comfort they deserve. I saw atleast 10 people walk up to that altar…..and I asked most of them of their situation and seen them up there multiple times. I did not see a damn millionaire sign a check that could change a person’s life around. I guess 20k is just too much for someone right? I myself have experienced a lot of pain from the church. I was in need of a car when I was 19-20. I had no money and parents were poor. Not one church would offer up a car for me. And expense I am sure would have been nothing. All I got was “we’ll pray for you.” What good was that? I been praying. I am sure there are decent churches, but as far as I am concerned they are just tax havens.

[Minimalist]

Churches do "charity" as a marketing ploy: A spoonful of soup and a spoonful of jesus. Fuck 'em.

Get it through your thick head already. Charity is never offered with "strings attached". People approach our church office off the streets, with needs which my particular church "can not" meet, oh and also with needs which we can meet.

There are times when your naivete is so charming!

[Owlix]

It depends on expenses. First is the building rented or owned? Is there a building, some people have church outside. How big is the church? What services, other than worship services, do they provide? First you have to answer these questions and a few more to get a complete picture. Bottom line, I am the former president of a Lutheran church. Our annual budget for 150 families in worship is about 230K per year. This budget includes staff salaries, operation expenses (phones, etc.), maintenace, insurance, heat, water, electric. And more. I hope this helps

Kind of an old article, but here it is.

And after much searching, it's the only article I could find without downloading nonsense.

I did see another website that used some 'scenarios', and I don't know how accurate they are but some of the numbers this person is using screams For Profit, if you ask me.

1. INITIAL COST. Assume that our new ministry facility is 30,000 square feet and we can have it built for $125 per square foot; of that, the construction partner’s fee was 9 percent and we paid the design professional a fee of 7 percent of the construction value. We will also assume that the land has been paid for and is unencumbered of debt. So what do the numbers look like?

INITIAL COST: 30,000 SF x $125/SF = $3,750,000 plus design fees = $4,012,500

Construction Partner Fee: $3,750,000 x 9% = $337,500

Design Professionals Fee: $3,750,000 x 7% = $262,500

2. COST OF “MONEY.” Assume that we borrowed $3 million to pay for the project and we did so based on a 15-year loan at 6 percent; but we paid it off in seven years. In this scenario, you will have paid about $1.1 million in interest.

http://churchexecutive.com/archives/what...-ownership

This church has gotta be doing REALLY well for itself to pay $3mil off in a scant 7 years.

[Godscreated]

...
Most people would be astounded at the amount of money it takes to keep the doors of a small church open.
...

I have a solution ...

... but I don't think you're going to like it.

We do not give up, God will provide, I know you don't like that.

GC

[DLJ]

I have a solution ...

... but I don't think you're going to like it.

We do not give up, God will provide, I know you don't like that.

GC

Oh, so wrong. I love that.

I really do wish that churches stopped being hypocritical and really did trust their gods to provide.

... rather than dodgy accounting practices, tax loop-holes and fund-raising scams.

[Esquilax]

Oh, so wrong. I love that.

I really do wish that churches stopped being hypocritical and really did trust their gods to provide.

... rather than dodgy accounting practices, tax loop-holes and fund-raising scams.

God helps those who help themselves!

---

... to other people's money.

---

[Aractus]

With that said, I will sum up what I heard ONE pastor state while they were discussing taxes and accounting management and I quote “Naw this stuff is not too bad, I used to run a business and this is really no different from what I already know and done.” How in the world can you be “humanitarian” if you run the whole damn thing like a business? Business are in it for making money.

Well I can assure you that of the churches I know, the priest/pastor is paid a salary, and can not receive a penny more for himself from the church's funding. The funds are used for general duties - eg the salaries of office workers, or for community programs, and this is decided by a parish council, and the PC is elected from ordinary members of the church by said members. So don't go pretending that the money all goes to the priest, because it doesn't.