All because I commented on an Atheist Resource post on facebook...

[Owlix]

The question from facebook was 'How many years do you think it will take for the US to be 51% atheist and why.'

I think we've got a hundred years at least and probably more. Belief doesn't justice you ignore rationality, I feel like it degenerates one's capacity for new knowledge. It's going to take time before people finally learn to put the books of stories down and pick up a microscope, telescope, or science book

I don't feel like a knowledge degenerate. If we are indeed by chance what is our purpose? If all is random who is determined evolved enough to set laws of right and wrong? Not an argument just questions.

We don't have a purpose. That's part of the 'by chance' thing. We are born, live and die. Our purpose is whatever we (individually) determine it to be. For some it's the pursuit of happiness. For others, of love. Being here completely at random doesn't mean we have to be barbaric. Just as we evolved from a quadrupedal species, so too we have evolved from 'rob, murder and rape all in our path'. Your purpose is whatever you choose. Good and bad don't really exist in the world. But adhering to the ideas that 'good and bad' present is still a good idea. It's our evolution as creatures of earth that's taught us this, not our strengthening of faith

Sounds hopeless to me. What if I decide I'm more evolved than those in authority and decide that I no longer am slave to their laws? can I simply create my own set of good and bad? After all if there is no origin of good and bad, and those two things don't exist, why should I be a slave to them? If I decide that murder does not personally conflict my worldview of right and wrong isn't it simply my prerogative to do as I please? Who is the law to define my own law if I am in fact the decider of Good and bad?

Well right now we have government for that. But if you look at it objectively, you might find that question doesn't come up. Being a person that doesn't answer to or acknowledge a higher power, it never occurred to me to try any of those things. I have been flat broke before, hardly money for necessities, which is why I don't steal. I have been a victim of abuse before, and that's why I don't care for violence of any sort (exception to the rule, self defense and what have you). Murder? Looking back on my life there are people I truly hate, but none that I would choose to end the life of. Being an atheist means this is all I've got. I die and that means I'm dead. End of consciousness as I know it. Knowing this, I wouldn't knowingly rob someone of that same short time of consciousness.

All of the above, I learned by living my life, not by learning about that of another.

In no way am I claiming that I believe we learn nothing from our daily lives. I believe life is a great teacher and instructor. But suppose this, a child is born to parents that close him off from the outside world and tell him and show him everyday that robbery is a way of life and justified based on their belief of good and bad. This child grows up knowing only this apparent truth and is sent to rob a store. Once there he decides he doesn't feel it is right to do this and doesn't go through with it. How did he reach this decision? Living his life taught him it was right, he knew nothing else. This is not, by the way a made up scenario, so how could he choose that robbery was wrong if life is the only thing that contributes to his conscience?

It's evolution and adaptation in process. Just as our bodies change, so do the basic rules and traits we understand on a daily basis, because our brains are changing too. How does a salmon know where it was spawned? Evolution.

Alternately, to be more clear on my original statement, I don't think religious folk are dolts who don't want to or can't learn, I just feel like believing in something that's only proven in one place and ignoring the evidence which points the other way, allows those to ignore or disregard the proof on unsubstantiated grounds. This leads to a larger deficit of thirst for knowledge beyond what's considered 'ok' by the standards of that belief.

History, nature, time, dates, moral law all of these things lead to a "higher power" as you call it. The same could be said of your position, ignoring the evidence which points the other way while believing in something that is only proven in books written by people of the same opinion leads to a thirst for knowledge as well. There is far less evidence for a lack of God than there is for the existence of God. It's hard to believe in the possibility of something untouchable. But I can make a historical tangible realistic case for God. Your side throws all of that out because it points the other way. Do I believe things adapt and evolve and change? Absolutely. In that way I don't look past those things. I do believe however that they were designed to do so rather than occurring by happenstance. If Darwin, the most known champion of Evolution and Atheism did not begin speaking about it no one would believe it. So you're view, as you accuse mine of being, is only shown in one place and not proven in any. If you take both views down to their basics there is more than just one mans ideas to back up my faith

I really believe this guy would bring his own brand of logic and rationality into the conversation here, but somehow I feel like the very mention of it might offend him.
Sorry for the typos in here, it came from FB on my smartphone.

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http://www.godtube.com/watch/?v=FJ0J0JNU

I haven't watched it yet, but I made mention of this forum and the fact that there's some very intriguing discussion to be had here...

Above is the link I was sent in response.

[Minimalist]

We've got plenty of assholes just like him...btw, he's typical of the type who think they are so FUCKING SPECIAL that there just has to be some higher power to be his special friend.

The guy is an asshole and reality terrifies him.

[Owlix]

He's not an ass by trade. We've had the religion discussion like once.

Until I commented on a page I'd liked. Didn't realize everyone would see it. Not that it makes a difference to me in the end, I just hope I don't start suffering personal attacks or an overwhelming amount of religious type posts because of it.

[Minimalist]

Sorry, dear....any one who writes this...

There is far less evidence for a lack of God than there is for the existence of God.

is an asshole.

We do not have to prove that his fairy god father does not exist. The burden of proof lies with the proponent of an argument to demonstrate that his argument is true.

[freedomfromforum]

Ten thousand years if man should last

And fill his books with fables past

To send the feast of sinners fast

t'ward heaven's wicked bloody wrath.

Then ever should the heavens host

The blood that heaven offered most

And heaven shall at last once die

and so shall you, and so shall I.

fff ©

[Cinjin]

Your coworker is a dumbass.

You should un-friend him, take a deep breath, and smile wide because you just rid yourself of one more source of ignorant primitive thinking.

[Captain Colostomy]

He's not an ass by trade. We've had the religion discussion like once.

Until I commented on a page I'd liked. Didn't realize everyone would see it. Not that it makes a difference to me in the end, I just hope I don't start suffering personal attacks or an overwhelming amount of religious type posts because of it.

Wanna know how to avoid all that?

Delete your account. Refrain from opening another. Easy peasy.

Fuck facebook. It's a den of dipshits. (Present company excluded.)

[Owlix]

Ten thousand years if man should last

And fill his books with fables past

To send the feast of sinners fast

t'ward heaven's wicked bloody wrath.

Then ever should the heavens host

The blood that heaven offered most

And heaven shall at last once die

and so shall you, and so shall I.

fff ©

What a poem. You just come up with that or is that old material?

[freedomfromforum]

---

Ten thousand years if man should last

And fill his books with fables past

To send the feast of sinners fast

t'ward heaven's wicked bloody wrath.

Then ever should the heavens host

The blood that heaven offered most

And heaven shall at last once die

and so shall you, and so shall I.

fff ©

---

What a poem. You just come up with that or is that old material?

It was extemporaneous. Thank you for asking the question that sparked the impetus.

[Owlix]

He's not an ass by trade. We've had the religion discussion like once.

Until I commented on a page I'd liked. Didn't realize everyone would see it. Not that it makes a difference to me in the end, I just hope I don't start suffering personal attacks or an overwhelming amount of religious type posts because of it.

Wanna know how to avoid all that?

Delete your account. Refrain from opening another. Easy peasy.

Fuck facebook. It's a den of dipshits. (Present company excluded.)

No no I can't do that. I use facebook for fun facts and things like that. I'm a humor-addict, as well as a random-fact-addict. That's usually what I find and share on facebook. I'm far far less prone to status updates of a personal sort than I am 'Hmm, this is interesting" or "What the fuck, too fucking funny" (for some reason I don't like using the term lol. Too boring I think).

But if I start seeing attacks of any sort that's probably going to be the thing to do.

Anyway, I've found much more suitable company intellectually right here and that's really what I've been missing for a long time. I have something (many things) to learn from many people on this forum.

Tactic, technique, definitions in general as well as things I wouldn't have thought to investigate on my own.