How can a book that tells you how to treat slaves possibly be valid moral guide

[truthBtold]

Ok I think I got what ur saying.. (not really)... so back then when people were allowed to beat slaves and as long as they dont die within a day or two it was ok by ur gods rules?? How could u think thats moral?? Ur god did make the rule??

Firstly, learn to write. Secondly, read what I wrote instead of jumping in like a bell end to tell me what you mistakenly think I meant. Seriously, it makes this sort of conversation much smoother if it's a dialogue between two people instead of between you and the voices in your head. I know there were some long words and challenging concepts in there but at least TRY to grasp them.

I didn't say slavery was moral, I said it was no more immoral than many of the things we accept quite happily as moral today (or if not moral then at least acceptable). As such I find the somewhat petulant op profoundly unmoving because it's actually just deploring the immorality then in context of the different but equally unpleasant immorality we have today.

Edited to reduce level of f bombage

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Actually, some Christians are open-minded enough that when they come across these arguments, they seriously consider their implications..and sometimes it leads them to leave the chain and ball of faith behind. I should know. I was one of them.

How many of these threads do you reckon that needs?

Hey crab apple. . That wasn't for u!! Gimme a break. . Im working off of a tiny old phone.. I dont have cash for a fancy computer.. please forgive me for I have sinned... amen and pass the biscuits!!!

[StuW]

3.slavery pretty awful shit? Compared to what exactly. Genocide? Famine? Anarchy? Against what moral yardstick. A society which has lost its way as badly as ours?

Isn't the god of the bible supposed to be both timeless and the ultimate arbiter of morals? Surely his morals wouldn't be dependant on then or now?

We live in a world where we drone bomb civilians be the thousand and call it war. Where tens of thousands die of starvation while we die from over consumption. Where we spend £30 on a kids cuddly toy which would feed a family in the third world for a month. Where warlords carry out genocides which would warm the cockles of the OT Yahweh's heart, and we ignore it. Where teenagers commit suicide because people say unkind things to them. Yeah, slavery is not a nice idea but considering how fucked and immoral our society is I'm afraid I can't get that worked up about it. So no, I don't particularly have a problem with the Bible not matching up to modern morality because modern morality ain't that special. It just seems that way to us because we're so inordinately proud of the horror we've created. It's like a paedophile taking a morally high stance over wife beating. Neither are moral. Both are funked.

And where the vatican supports Nazi's, hold billions of dollars but tell everyone else to help the poor? Genocides to warm Yahweh's heart? you mean like the 1994 Rwanda genocide that was sponsored by the church?

I understand your post and can partially agree but this IS an atheist forum and people might come here asking questions of the theists in order to get answers to things they might have issues with in their own minds. My 2c only.

[Simon Moon]

If your wanting to know my opinions on the traditional slavery arguement I've done one about every 6 months since I've been here. You can do a search or this one kinda sums it all up starting at post 35.
https://atheistforums.org/thread-22220-p...ight=slave

I'm glad you posted that link, Dritch.

It just goes to confirm the saying, " those that believe in absurdities, can be made to commit atrocities".

[Mudhammam]

Actually, some Christians are open-minded enough that when they come across these arguments, they seriously consider their implications..and sometimes it leads them to leave the chain and ball of faith behind. I should know. I was one of them.

How many of these threads do you reckon that needs?

Is too much exposure of the truth a bad thing for the Christian faith? Okay, maybe you shouldn't answer that.

[Jacob(smooth)]

Firstly, learn to write. Secondly, read what I wrote instead of jumping in like a bell end to tell me what you mistakenly think I meant. Seriously, it makes this sort of conversation much smoother if it's a dialogue between two people instead of between you and the voices in your head. I know there were some long words and challenging concepts in there but at least TRY to grasp them.

I didn't say slavery was moral, I said it was no more immoral than many of the things we accept quite happily as moral today (or if not moral then at least acceptable). As such I find the somewhat petulant op profoundly unmoving because it's actually just deploring the immorality then in context of the different but equally unpleasant immorality we have today.

Edited to reduce level of f bombage

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How many of these threads do you reckon that needs?

Hey crab apple. . That wasn't for u!! Gimme a break. . Im working off of a tiny old phone.. I dont have cash for a fancy computer.. please forgive me for I have sinned... amen and pass the biscuits!!!

Oh.

OK then.

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How many of these threads do you reckon that needs?

Is too much exposure of the truth a bad thing for the Christian faith? Okay, maybe you shouldn't answer that.

There is always such a thing as too much information.

[Mudhammam]

Is too much exposure of the truth a bad thing for the Christian faith? Okay, maybe you shouldn't answer that.

There is always such a thing as too much information.

Oh, like in the case of Jesus' biography?

[Esquilax]

3.slavery pretty awful shit? Compared to what exactly. Genocide? Famine? Anarchy? Against what moral yardstick. A society which has lost its way as badly as ours?

We live in a world where we drone bomb civilians be the thousand and call it war. Where tens of thousands die of starvation while we die from over consumption. Where we spend £30 on a kids cuddly toy which would feed a family in the third world for a month. Where warlords carry out genocides which would warm the cockles of the OT Yahweh's heart, and we ignore it. Where teenagers commit suicide because people say unkind things to them. Yeah, slavery is not a nice idea but considering how fucked and immoral our society is I'm afraid I can't get that worked up about it. So no, I don't particularly have a problem with the Bible not matching up to modern morality because modern morality ain't that special. It just seems that way to us because we're so inordinately proud of the horror we've created. It's like a paedophile taking a morally high stance over wife beating. Neither are moral. Both are funked.

Interesting. So tell me, Jacob: since when did two wrongs make a right?

Seriously, pointing out the problems of the past are how we avoid making them again in the future, and I submit to you that convincing people that this specific book is not a moral guide would be a net good, to begin with.

[Jackalope]

I submit to you that convincing people that this specific book is not a moral guide would be a net good, to begin with.

Leastwise, those who can't manage to identify the evil bits.

[là bạn điên]

So...let me get this right.

because there is great evil like genocide in the world right now it makes it acceptable that the bible endorses slavery. Note the bible doesn't refer to the concept Drich is trying to hoodwink us. Indeed the Bible specifically tells the Israelites that they were PREVIOUSLY enslaved

It is irrelevant what the dictionary definition in english is the important thing is what it meant in Hebrew and Greek and the terms are ανδράποδο (andrapodo) and עבד(Aved) both mean slave as defined as someone held as property not some modern crap about everyone being a slave

[Mudhammam]

As long as your slave can get back to work within two days, the Bible permits you to beat him or her too. Wonderful book of divine moral insight, I know.