3 Questions For Believers (A work in progress.)

[GrandizerII]

Rationalism: the belief that reason and experience and not emotions or religious beliefs should be the basis for your actions, opinions, etc.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/rationalism

[fr0d0]

That's funny. This is what your link actually says :-

Main Entry: ra·tio·nal·ism
Pronunciation: \ˈrash-nə-ˌli-zəm, ˈra-shə-nə-ˌli-\
Function: noun
Date: 1827
1 : reliance on reason as the basis for establishment of religious truth 2 a : a theory that reason is in itself a source of knowledge superior to and independent of sense perceptions b : a view that reason and experience rather than the nonrational are the fundamental criteria in the solution of problems

[GrandizerII]

That's funny. This is what your link actually says :-

Main Entry: ra·tio·nal·ism
Pronunciation: \ˈrash-nə-ˌli-zəm, ˈra-shə-nə-ˌli-\
Function: noun
Date: 1827
1 : reliance on reason as the basis for establishment of religious truth 2 a : a theory that reason is in itself a source of knowledge superior to and independent of sense perceptions b : a view that reason and experience rather than the nonrational are the fundamental criteria in the solution of problems

There was an older definition of rationalism that not many adhere to nowadays. Nowadays, empiricism and rationalism work together rather than act against each other.

But even the older definition still defies the point you're making. Your view is not based on reason anyway. It's based on wishful thinking.

[fr0d0]

And you would know. Not.

Baseless assertion.

Empiricism denies rationalism. You don't need to think about what your senses are telling you. But please prove your assertion.

[GrandizerII]

And you would know. Not.

Baseless assertion.

Empiricism denies rationalism. You don't need to think about what your senses are telling you. But please prove your assertion.

We were discussing the more modern definition in the other thread, remember?

I had the following link posted there:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Rationalism

[Jackalope]

Empiricism denies rationalism.

And pure rationalism denies empiricism. What's your point?

Most of us apply a measure of both, more or less.

[fr0d0]

Empiricism denies rationalism.

And pure rationalism denies empiricism. What's your point?

Most of us apply a measure of both, more or less.

My point was to counter what irrational had said before me.

---

We were discussing the more modern definition in the other thread, remember?

I had the following link posted there:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Rationalism

I pretty much reject that definition. I don't see how they make the connect. They just say it's so without explanation. Do a Google search and all the links state the same thing...

Wikipedia : Empiricism is a theory which states that knowledge comes only or primarily from sensory experience.

Dictionary.com : Philosophy. the doctrine that all knowledge is derived from sense experience.

Encyclopaedia Britannica : empiricism, in philosophy, the view that all concepts originate in experience

Thefreedictionary : The view that experience, especially of the senses, is the only source of knowledge.

Princeton : In philosophy, empiricism is a theory of knowledge which asserts the idea that knowledge arises via sensual experience

The OED : The theory that all knowledge is based on experience derived from the senses.

[GrandizerII]

And pure rationalism denies empiricism. What's your point?

Most of us apply a measure of both, more or less.

My point was to counter what irrational had said before me.

---

We were discussing the more modern definition in the other thread, remember?

I had the following link posted there:
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Rationalism

I pretty much reject that definition. I don't see how they make the connect. They just say it's so without explanation. Do a Google search and all the links state the same thing...

Wikipedia : Empiricism is a theory which states that knowledge comes only or primarily from sensory experience.

Dictionary.com : Philosophy. the doctrine that all knowledge is derived from sense experience.

Encyclopaedia Britannica : empiricism, in philosophy, the view that all concepts originate in experience

Thefreedictionary : The view that experience, especially of the senses, is the only source of knowledge.

Princeton : In philosophy, empiricism is a theory of knowledge which asserts the idea that knowledge arises via sensual experience

The OED : The theory that all knowledge is based on experience derived from the senses.

Ok, so reject the definition then. So where do we go from here? Have you managed to demonstrate that your theism is rationalistic in nature rather than based on emotions and desire to believe in a higher power?

[fr0d0]

Well you could defend empiricism as somehow linked to rationalism as you said.

I'm satisfied that I've used reason to reach my decision to believe, yes. I've covered it many times here.

Via thorough investigation of the bible and it's claims I concluded it to be true, and acted upon that information.

I've explored in detail my conclusions, which is a continual process. I investigate and question all the time as I believe I have the responsibility to do.

I'm from a non religious background. Both my parents were not religious. My Mum was quite a strong atheist. My dad made fun.

[GrandizerII]

Well you could defend empiricism as somehow linked to rationalism as you said.

I'm satisfied that I've used reason to reach my decision to believe, yes. I've covered it many times here.

Via thorough investigation of the bible and it's claims I concluded it to be true, and acted upon that information.

I've explored in detail my conclusions, which is a continual process. I investigate and question all the time as I believe I have the responsibility to do.

I'm from a non religious background. Both my parents were not religious. My Mum was quite a strong atheist. My dad made fun.

The scientific method makes use of both empiricism and rationalism. It employs both deductive and inductive reasoning.

Can you provide a rationalistic basis for your theism?