The lady who drove a Mercedes to pick up food vouchers.

[Welsh cake]

Remember...this phenomena of the state dole is only going to grow because automation is rendering human labor obsolete......and that's not a bad thing.

You're right, its not a bad thing.

Its a terrible thing.

Its toxic - its basically creating a *culture* of benefits. The country imports everything and exports nothing. And whatever work is required is relied upon by outsourcing it to foreign countries. Living costs soar. Wages fall. The economy stagnates and hits rock bottom. People are relying on welfare, as opposed to working for a living.

Skills of the manufacturing trade are being lost, heck the generation itself is being lost.

No one knows how to work or build anything anymore.

Don't be surprised one bit if your children or grand children end up on the dole. The day is coming where just about everyone will enjoy and awesome lifestyle without the need to work.....we just don't want that lifestyle managed by big brother.

Are you being satirical? I jolly well hope so.

You do realise what will happen next don't you?

The government starts cutting people's benefits - they can no longer afford to live or pay their rent. Then the poor really get f**ked by the ruling classes.

[Fidel_Castronaut]

[Bibliofagus]

[Fidel_Castronaut]

[Rev. Rye]

[Jaysyn]

[Mister Agenda]

Remember...this phenomena of the state dole is only going to grow because automation is rendering human labor obsolete......and that's not a bad thing.

You're right, its not a bad thing.

Its a terrible thing.

Its toxic - its basically creating a *culture* of benefits. The country imports everything and exports nothing.

Why would a country with advanced automation need to import more? Currently, we haven't reduced our manufacturing capacity, just the number of people it takes to do it.

And whatever work is required is relied upon by outsourcing it to foreign countries.

Um, whatever work is required is done by robots or other advanced automation. Perhaps you are not following how advanced the advanced automation Heywood is talking about is presumed to be. Foriegn laborers will not be able to compete with what's coming.

Living costs soar.

They shouldn't, advanced automation will make almost every product much less expensive due to reduced labor costs. It may even put small communities or even individuals in control of their own means of production, where they can make almost anything out of energy and raw materials.

Wages fall. The economy stagnates and hits rock bottom. People are relying on welfare, as opposed to working for a living.

This is a real possibility. I'd like to think it can be avoided, that a Star Trek future where people's common material needs are met for free and self-fulfillment is the rule, is possible. And maybe it is. Intelligent machines are electronics and electronics gets less expensive over time. When the common person has that kind of intelligence at their fingertips, they'll come up with things I can't imagine...maybe an economy based on creativity and social connection.

Skills of the manufacturing trade are being lost, heck the generation itself is being lost.

No one knows how to work or build anything anymore.

Not many people know how to make buggy whips anymore, either. Why should they?

You do realise what will happen next don't you?

The government starts cutting people's benefits - they can no longer afford to live or pay their rent. Then the poor really get f**ked by the ruling classes.

Why? That is, why would they do something so cruel for so little gain? And how can they accomplish this in a system where the 'ruled' class has most of the votes? I think you presume too much evil, the moustache-twirling 'let's starve the impoverished scum as soon as we get the chance!' types are actually pretty rare. Democracy gives us SOME kind of balance: the elites can't be TOO blatant or we'll deprive them of power. It's in their best interest to at least keep us in bread and circuses.

[Welsh cake]

[The Grand Nudger]

advanced automation will make almost every product much less expensive due to reduced labor costs. It may even put small communities or even individuals in control of their own means of production, where they can make almost anything out of energy and raw materials.

Which makes a prediction of some future government welfare state based upon such advanced automation a non-starter. Who is the government taxing, and what are they taxing (in order to foot the welfare bill) - when anyone could simply create what they required with their own privately controlled means of production? Further, if they have such means - what would the welfare be needed for - even if they had the fund to accomplish it, which, as above...I don't see how they would.

If, just as an example, the government were to tax energy (wondering where the user would get the funds to pay the tax still......)commensurate with a rate that would allow for some basic income to citizens - why not cut out the automated middleman, and just have the people continue to perform those functions and receive that wage for that service?

That sort of automation is not the beginning of a welfare state - but the end of money (possibly even the end of commerce by any means), and thusly the end of any need for welfare. Everybodies all good, the robots have "got this"
(Somebody please say they've read some Ian Banks...lol?)

@Welsh
Automation stands in direct opposition to human welfare at present from the view of the worker at ground level, but only insomuch as we are currently wedded to other principles- which are themselves the ultimate source of the issue to begin with. Automation could lead to other things, it's just that we're currently not interested in (or capable of) pursuing them.

[Jaysyn]