Posts: 7180
Threads: 12
Joined: March 14, 2013
Reputation:
72
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 10:20 am
(August 11, 2014 at 9:54 am)pocaracas Wrote: Drich, you're presupposing that a god exists.
We (and I hope I speak for this thread's atheist repliers) refuse to presuppose that, as we acknowledge it as a fallible method to discover anything. And there are many of us who did presuppose it, and convinced ourselves that we had found god, but eventually realized that we had not. I know that the response to this is that I did not do it correctly (or something similar to that). But that reminds me of the explanations when people want to believe that god always answers prayers.
I think that it relies on the idea that god is not inclined to reveal himself to us. And I never found that to be a satisfying concept. It works against what the bible says he did (revealing himself to people frequently, sometimes with amazing displays of power) and what the bible says he wants (for each of us to find him and be saved). It does not seem sensible to me.
"Well, evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape- like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered."
-Stephen Jay Gould
Posts: 1543
Threads: 40
Joined: April 4, 2014
Reputation:
46
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 10:38 am
(August 9, 2014 at 6:02 pm)Drich Wrote: Then I say A/S/K (ask seek knock) as out lined in luke 11. And you will be given a measure of the Holy Spirit.
You say: bla bla bla, "I did when i; bla bla bla, and got nothing in response. So now I am an atheist."
Then me: if you're not currently seeking you have not A/S/K'ed as outlined in luke 11. Because again the persistent neighbor did not stop knocking till he got what he was looking for..
So if you stopped before you got what you were looking for, you did not follow the outline Christ Gave.
I asked for two years and got nothing, when I couldn't make myself believe anymore. So, you're saying I have to ask for some undetermined number of years until I get the answer you think I should get, and that this somehow counts as proof?
Sounds like an ad hoc assertion to let you move the goal posts around as long as you'd like. I think I'll pass.
Drich, have you ever wondered why your god isn't obvious, and why he must be continually seeked for an unspecified number of years before he can be "found"? Does it ever trouble you when other people find different gods?
Posts: 591
Threads: 13
Joined: July 7, 2014
Reputation:
14
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 10:49 am
You didn't answer my question. I said I knocked, got a response, but that I don't find the response credible due to lack of corroborating evidence. My own personal experiences are subjective and faulty.
What other evidence so you have to indicate that a God does exist? Why should I trust that the answer I got was reliable?
Posts: 335
Threads: 1
Joined: June 17, 2014
Reputation:
8
Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 10:58 am
(August 11, 2014 at 7:13 am)Drich Wrote: (August 10, 2014 at 1:22 pm)Bibliofagus Wrote: I got that from you. You are the guy saying that if I try reaching god he will reveal himself to me right?
Can you provide a link to where I said that and a post number?
Well... It appears to be the point of this thread and what you are saying in basically every post you made in it. But you are probably trying to communicate that you meant something else. All the time.
Which is of course totally okay.
Now to figure out what you did mean...
The thread is titled 'why knocking is important'.
Why is it? What does it accomplish?
Posts: 2658
Threads: 121
Joined: March 19, 2012
Reputation:
27
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 11:12 am
Drich Wrote:Let's say you did have a humble and contrite heart when you asked God to help you find Him or when you genuinely asked for proof of Him. But let's also say you had a really messed up idea of who God is and what He wants from you.
Now if God gave you confirmation that He does indeed exist, it would cement your version of God (flaws mistakes and all) in your mind.
Why can't God confirm He exists *and* teach us about his true self? I mean, c'mon.. the atheist made it this far already by choosing to humble themselves and sincerely search for God. Is God really going to be that tight and still refuse the atheist a chance at being saved based on a technicality?
It makes more sense for God to not exist, than for this benevolent being with a will to be in relationship with us to continually deny us the knowledge of his existence unless the planets align, and we are in this perfect state of mind while knowing precisely the nature of God such that our view of Him isn't flawed.
We're only human, after all.
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it" ~ Aristotle
Posts: 6896
Threads: 89
Joined: January 13, 2013
Reputation:
116
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 11:41 am
If I were to create self aware beings knowing fully what they would do in their lifetimes, I sure wouldn't create a HELL for the majority of them to live in infinitely! That's not Love, that's sadistic. Therefore a truly loving god does not exist!
Quote:The sin is against an infinite being (God) unforgiven infinitely, therefore the punishment is infinite.
Dead wrong. The actions of a finite being measured against an infinite one are infinitesimal and therefore merit infinitesimal punishment.
Quote:Some people deserve hell.
I say again: No exceptions. Punishment should be equal to the crime, not in excess of it. As soon as the punishment is greater than the crime, the punisher is in the wrong.
![[Image: tumblr_n1j4lmACk61qchtw3o1_500.gif]](https://66.media.tumblr.com/5fb74c6d16622fb3dbb358509c9aec03/tumblr_n1j4lmACk61qchtw3o1_500.gif)
Posts: 4344
Threads: 43
Joined: February 21, 2012
Reputation:
64
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 1:12 pm
(This post was last modified: August 11, 2014 at 1:19 pm by Nine.)
Posts: 13392
Threads: 187
Joined: March 18, 2012
Reputation:
48
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 2:49 pm
(August 10, 2014 at 8:30 pm)Ryantology (╯°◊°)╯︵ ══╬ Wrote: Quote:Again that is not my question to answer. God answers all of those who will simply meet Him on His terms. That is like asking a British subject to provide you with proof of the authority of the queen, when you had the ability and access to speak with her directly.
If the British queen was 100% sequestered from all other humans and never directly communicated with the outside world or anybody in it, and the only evidence of her existence came from hearsay and books that made no testable claims, and you were told that you could only hear the queen in your head, and only if you asked her in just the right way, would you accept as absolute truth that there is a queen reigning over Britain?
I honestly do not care who is ruling over Britain. I used the queen as a possiable example for a specific delima that I do not think anyone has addressed yet.
Posts: 19789
Threads: 57
Joined: September 24, 2010
Reputation:
85
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 2:58 pm
(This post was last modified: August 11, 2014 at 3:03 pm by Anomalocaris.)
(August 11, 2014 at 2:49 pm)Drich Wrote: (August 10, 2014 at 8:30 pm)Ryantology (╯°◊°)╯︵ ══╬ Wrote: If the British queen was 100% sequestered from all other humans and never directly communicated with the outside world or anybody in it, and the only evidence of her existence came from hearsay and books that made no testable claims, and you were told that you could only hear the queen in your head, and only if you asked her in just the right way, would you accept as absolute truth that there is a queen reigning over Britain?
I honestly do not care who is ruling over Britain. I used the queen as a possiable example for a specific delima that I do not think anyone has addressed yet.
You should realize you think your god exists only because, as you repeatedly demonstrated, your intellect is too small to encompass the proper spelling, much less the concept, of possible.
Tell you what, you focus on spelling it right, and we will focus on dumbing down the concept further so we can give it to you again in a package closer to your level of comprehension.
Posts: 2471
Threads: 21
Joined: December 7, 2013
Reputation:
43
RE: Why knocking is so important.
August 11, 2014 at 3:07 pm
(This post was last modified: August 11, 2014 at 3:08 pm by ShaMan.)
Hey Drich... Think of how many souls aren't being won by you because you spend your time bashing your head against a wall on AF! ![[Image: bash-head.gif]](https://images.weserv.nl/?url=www.sherv.net%2Fcm%2Femoticons%2Ffighting%2Fbash-head.gif)
How about you stop casting your version of god's pearls at we swine here online? WWJD? He'd have left long ago, and advises you to do so as well.
Matthew 7:6 Wrote:6 “Do not give what is holy to dogs, and do not throw your pearls before swine, or they will trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you to pieces."
You're wasting resources bro....
|
