To explain knowledge of God

[Tonus]

Wait, so did Drich say other religions are the work of Satan's deception?

That seems fairly common for the abrahamic religions. God will reveal himself to his true followers, but Satan will seek to deceive. Therefore, if someone else is convinced that he has come to know god, but his revelation is different from yours, then the only possibility is that he was misled by Satan. You were not misled, because you cannot see how your interpretation of scripture could be any more clear or logical, and you have always been on guard against the wicked machinations of the devil. The only possible explanation is that the other guy is lying or has been lied to.

It's not much different from the way that prayer can be rationalized to always work, or the way that A/S/K can be rationalized so it always works. The most effective trap is the one you set for yourself, sometimes.

[Aoi Magi]

A/S/K, Atheists Seek Knowledge!!!

The atheists are asking, while religion simply pretends to have an answer, so it fails by it's own standards.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Ah, presuppositionalism at its finest!
You presume it must work if it is tried, therefore I either didn't try or didn't do it right.

You always go full circular and you can never see it. Stunningly obtuse.

Your speaking in a past tense, therefore you did not 'do it right.'

I have spoken to hundreds of you personally (over the years and various websites) on what you have done specifically, not one of you has A/S/K'ed as outlined in luke 11. Not once. You all believe it to be about sincerity or checking off items on a check list. Therefore your efforts always have a start point and an end. This method disqualifies you each and every time.

... which is just a wordy way of begging the question.

[DramaQueen]

Is there an evidence that Satan is a bad guy?

Oh sorry, I forgot that he doesn't exist

[downbeatplumb]

Again, 'Free will' is an ancient greek construct and not mentioned in the bible. The bible itself says the oppsite in the we do not have 'free will.' Rather we are slaves that have been given a choice, that choice is redemption and ultimatly freedom from the ties that bind us as slaves.

In short we have been given one real choice in this life. Your christian friends are correct in why God will not violate this choice by provideing undenyable proof from the outset. Our whole purpose in this life is to be give a span of time to proove to ourselves where our hearts lie. (With God or with sin) This life is a prooving ground. If God gave undenyiable evidence from the on set then self preservation would kick in and people would elect heaven for the wrong reason. As it is only those who want to serve God elect salvation.

Am I reading this right? We need to be "willing slaves" in your interpretation!

Well that idea can fuck off.

[DramaQueen]

Submit or go to hell? that's too Islamic for my taste

[Drich]

Wait, so gawd wants to hide and us to find him without even knowing he exists? Is he a freakin 3year old?

So are you unsure whether or not 3 year olds exist?

How about God wants you to proove to yourself that you would indeed do anything to looked upon by him in an approving manner. So that your 'salvation' is less about what God can do for you, and more about what you have been created to do for God.

What most of you dont seem to understand is God is not our servant or a genie that grants wishes. We have been created to serve Him. We have been given this life so as to sift out those who do and those who do not want to serve.

@Drich Also the bible itself has claims of several instances where gawd had tried to prove himself.

Like where?

So since you believe he won't try to prove himself in order to judge our hearts,

Not what I said. I said God does not typically provide what is needed for someone who does not want to believe in God the proof needed to establish and maintain belief. (there are always exceptions to every rule) Once one does believe God reveals has no problem providing a follower everything needed to establish and maintain belief.[/quote]

so were those supposed proofs and miracles were created by the devil? Hmm, so are you sure that the devil didn't create the bible to lure away the followers of the true supreme being, Odin, or Krishna, or Allah, or .....

Who in the bible did God do these miricals for? (Believers or potential followers)

---

So, Muslims and Hindus aren't at fault for being deceived, since they're simply listening to the supernatural (Satan) that is causing their spiritual experience. Does that mean that Muslims and Hindus are getting salvation as well, since it's none of their own fault they haven't sought jesus as that choice was never presented to them? Or does God punish those who had no choice to begin with, as well?

Not all are called by God to worship. What God does with them is completely upto Him. Maybe the being the repersented thems selves as the many hindu gods or as allah has plans for them.

In truth, What does it matter? they are activly seeking and worshiping the gods of thier choice.

---

Yeah. Can't wait to see the justification of sending Muslims to hell if Satan deceived them all, which is apparently not their fault. Satan too powerful for widdle baby God?

No, justification. If person 'A' worship's god 'b' then he is subject to the power and protection that god has to offer. If that God is real, then he is in good shape. If he is not then he is subject to the wrath or mercy of the real God.

so, What the pro'lem is?

This life is our prooving ground. we have been given this measure of time to find God and decide whether or not to worship Him. being born into a religion does not mean one is destined to die as a member of that religion. If one wants to find God then he will test what he knows and will move on till he finds God.

[LostLocke]

God is not a 'feeling'. When I say direction I mean direction. http://atheistforums.org/thread-13378.html When I say protection I mean literal protection:http://atheistforums.org/thread-11671.html post 135 God/The Holy Spirit Is or can be an real time interactive part of your life. To the point there is not questions, or need or interpertation.

The same can be said about those who have 'experienced' other deities.
Unless you're making the claim that only the followers of Jehovah have claimed to have truly experienced their god.

[Drich]

That seems fairly common for the abrahamic religions. God will reveal himself to his true followers, but Satan will seek to deceive.

And if this were true, should it be kept seceret should we not speak of it?

Therefore, if someone else is convinced that he has come to know god, but his revelation is different from yours, then the only possibility is that he was misled by Satan.

If one's revelation does not match what the Holy Spirit left us in the bible we know Satan is indeed misleading people.

You were not misled, because you cannot see how your interpretation of scripture could be any more clear or logical, and you have always been on guard against the wicked machinations of the devil. The only possible explanation is that the other guy is lying or has been lied to.

Which is very appearent when they produce other 'books' that suppliment or arguement the bible.

Doctrinal issues derived from the bible are non-issues for the most part. It's when some special revelation is introduced is when we can know without a doubt the devil is at work.

It's not much different from the way that prayer can be rationalized to always work,

Prayers as per the model Christ left us ALWAYS Work. Supplication is not prayer.

or the way that A/S/K can be rationalized so it always works.

A/S/K works if one follows what has been written in luke 11.
Very simple if you want the treasure you must carfully follow the map.

The most effective trap is the one you set for yourself, sometimes.

This is true.

[Anomalocaris]

Submit or go to hell? that's too Islamic for my taste

Islam learned that from Christianity, but the diligence of the pupil is insufficient to match the breadth and depth of the achievements of the teacher.

I have never met any Muslim who spoke with as much lip smacking relish about sadomesochistic torments of hell, encouragingly detailed and magnified by each advocate's personal overactive and infantile imagination, as is routinely surmonized by followers of the "lamb" of "god" and "prince" of "peace".