Feminism and Gaming

[John V]

I'm given marriage OR celibacy? Can't jerk it? Are you serious?!

You prefer jerking it? To each his own I suppose, but read this:
10 reasons to stop using porn

Maybe X's drawings excite Y! Who fucking cares? Is someone really interested in what sexually arouses X or Y?

Apparently many game makers care, or they'd use wider ranges of body types and more realistic apparel.

[Violet]

and there's certainly no gender division in terms of class or ability.

Is there a reason realism cannot be a part of balance? Women are generally about half as strong as men (strength stat deficit)... but are more dexterous (+x on hit rolls), and have a higher tolerance for pain (endurance stat buff).

They're also very limber in comparison... conferring that is somewhat harder to do (don't want to overbuff female tanks). For D&D in particular: there are at least dozens of different races... and this could potentially be taken into consideration on each.

... A bonus on (nonspell?) hit rolls may alone be significant enough for 1/2 strength to be quith playable... additional endurance may not be necessary, but may as well reflect it. Men can have an agility buff if more balance is needed

[John V]

Is there a reason realism cannot be a part of balance? Women are generally about half as strong as men (strength stat deficit)... but are more dexterous (+x on hit rolls), and have a higher tolerance for pain (endurance stat buff).

They're also very limber in comparison... conferring that is somewhat harder to do (don't want to overbuff female tanks). For D&D in particular: there are at least dozens of different races... and this could potentially be taken into consideration on each.

... A bonus on (nonspell?) hit rolls may alone be significant enough for 1/2 strength to be quith playable... additional endurance may not be necessary, but may as well reflect it. Men can have an agility buff if more balance is needed

I agree. While I support the changes in artwork (there's some really good stuff in the new books), making women as strong as men seems like an over-correction.

[DramaQueen]

I'm looking at gay porn right now

[Zack]

Have you ever actually seen the customization screens for male an female characters? Is their a game in particular? Male/Female Barbs Diablo 3- pre Reaper of Souls, female orcs in WoW from several years ago (haven't played in a bit) What your character looks like is subjective. Once he/she is geared, not much of a difference. I haven't met too many women outraged at their video game caricatures!

[Violet]

I completely agree with everything here. I wonder if there are not more female gamers simply because there's a lower number of females who are sexually attracted to video game characters.

Male characters are often "sexually attractive" along one of a few archetypes...

The princely character. Observe:

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The boy band. Again:

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The alien. Once more:

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The beefcake Losty has certainly not been waiting for:

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The tsundere:

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The dirty old wife beater:

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And the one who's got it on:

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I'm looking at gay porn right now

Muscle march again? May you never put the game down.

[Anomalocaris]

My wife has helped me to understand some of the aspects of modern feminism that eluded me before.

For example, with the idealized-body-type issue I mentioned, women are made to feel insecure about their bodies in our society. As a man, I don't mind the idealized-body-type in fantasy. Even when I was young and if I'd worked out constantly, I could never have developed the kind of body that men typically have in epic fantasy, superhero or other settings. That's OK because it's fantasy. I feel no sense that I'm supposed to live up to that standard.

Is there a way we can change things so women feel at ease with their own bodies vs. the fantasy world and not feeling like it's a standard they have to live up to? As in, "yeah, my character has big tits, long lean legs and 2% body fat but who cares, it's just fantasy."?

The fact that as few men live up to ideal body image as women would suggest the fundamental cause of women being made to feel insecure about their bodies in our society is not the idealized-body-type itself, but the failure to inculcate the appropriate "fuck that" attitude amongst women.

[Zack]

So many people care what their shit looks like before they get geared.

[Violet]

Have you ever actually seen the customization screens for male an female characters? Is their a game in particular? Male/Female Barbs Diablo 3- pre Reaper of Souls, female orcs in WoW from several years ago (haven't played in a bit) What your character looks like is subjective. Once he/she is geared, not much of a difference. I haven't met too many women outraged at their video game caricatures!

I dislike the Double D + Anorexia in WoW. Can't change it... no weight customization. I also dislike the "hunky male mage" thing humans have going on. Means developer doesn't have to force their armor textures to scale (within race)... but WoW's not really a good example as far as customization options go.

On the other hand... Soul Calibers 4 and 5. Rift isn't too bad, but there's no direct breasts to adjust, and the developer *loves* its boob plate/skinhole plate. Some skyrim mods add some serious customizability. Also... Saints Row 2. EVE Online. Champions Online. City of Heros... Miis. There are a lot of good-great character creators out there nowadays.

"Not much of a difference"... sees nearly full DD breast curvature in full plate armor...

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So many people care what their shit looks like before they get geared.

Yes, they do. You don't, but then: you're not who character creation sells to.

Yes, that's right: the casual gamers and artsy-fartsy folk

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It seems female characters are drawn better and fit the environment better than their male counterparts. In my opinion, a male species character tends to be bigger and more noticeable in pvp game environments. I always take the female toon.

Also why healers subconsciously prefer their tanks to be male.

[DeistPaladin]

Why did she help you to understand the body image issue? Does she also contribute to women's unrealistic expectations? If so, why does she do it?

In real life, women are made to feel insecure about their bodies.

This is fantasy. What she draws is fantasy. We both know the difference between fantasy and real life.

Why are you having trouble grasping the distinction?

So, these images contribute to womens' self image problems, and aren't necessary for men to enjoy the game. Seems like case closed to me.

It doesn't to me. It sounds to me like these are two separate issues. One can look at beautiful women without playing a game. One can play a game without looking at beautiful women.

And what you keep missing is that fantasy shouldn't contribute to anyone's self-image problems. Know why? Because it's fantasy.

More like:
Celibacy = awesome, if that capability is given to you. For everyone else:
Marriage = rut like rabbits so that you don't fall into temptation

I'm fairly accustomed to obtuse apologist interpretations to make scripture say what they want it to say.

I read what's there.

What's there is
Celebacy = What you should do
Marriage = OK, if you can't control yourself, that's second best.