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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 2:01 am
(October 30, 2014 at 7:05 pm)Tsun Tsu Wrote: I'm very sorry. In the last post I seem to have not made myself clear. I apologize for this. The information I am compiling is a comparative study on Theistic and Atheistic values and convictions, and their impact on society.
Also since it seems someone took me wrong when I said I wouldn't challenge the belief stated, I guess we can do that in this thread too if you like.
So the question... Does absolute universal moral truth exist? Is there ANYTHING where it can be said that it is morally true universally?
For instance: "Rape is ALWAYS wrong" <<<This would be considered a moral truth. Is it universally true? Is it true even if society deemed that rape was perfectly acceptable?
I would say it always causes suffering when someone's consent or free will is violated. so this is absolute and relative to each person at the same time since everyone has different boundaries.
I saw a similar discussion on whether consent to abuse still counted as abuse or not. And the argument was the physical action is still abusive even if there was consent involved.
So to answer your question, my criteria is the person's consent.
And since it is relative which cases they consent to, that is relative.
But the rule/concept is still absolute.
If people don't agree, then to one person it is consensual
and to another it isn't. But the rule still applies that it's based on consent.
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 2:02 am
(February 19, 2015 at 1:38 am)rexbeccarox Wrote: I really wish I had never looked in on this thread. I'm really, actually, crying right now. The idea that this subject is even debatable is making my chest deflate. I don't think I'll be back to check in.
I agree with you too. What this thread has turned into brings up some bad memories.
If pinkie pie isn't real, then how do you explain the existence of ponies, huh? If ponies are real, then that's proof that Pinkie Pie is real. Checkmate, christians! 
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 2:05 am
(February 19, 2015 at 2:02 am)IanHulett Wrote: (February 19, 2015 at 1:38 am)rexbeccarox Wrote: I really wish I had never looked in on this thread. I'm really, actually, crying right now. The idea that this subject is even debatable is making my chest deflate. I don't think I'll be back to check in.
I agree with you too. What this thread has turned into brings up some bad memories.
Maybe you could share those memories, I talk about what happened to me because I don't want to supress it and have it jump up on me in the future, where it would stuff up my life, and also someone else's life, the one who has to listen to my neurosis.
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 2:06 am
(February 19, 2015 at 1:38 am)rexbeccarox Wrote: I really wish I had never looked in on this thread. I'm really, actually, crying right now. The idea that this subject is even debatable is making my chest deflate. I don't think I'll be back to check in.
Sorry, but I just don't see any point to what seems to be appeal to emotion? Hopefully, you aren't speaking as a mod and only just a regular member with this post. I'd hate to start seeing certain topics being banned for discussion just because it triggers certain members. I think it is ok to debate the moral nature of rape so long as no one is encouraging rape here.
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 2:07 am
(February 19, 2015 at 2:06 am)Irrational Wrote: (February 19, 2015 at 1:38 am)rexbeccarox Wrote: I really wish I had never looked in on this thread. I'm really, actually, crying right now. The idea that this subject is even debatable is making my chest deflate. I don't think I'll be back to check in.
Sorry, but I just don't see any point to what seems to be appeal to emotion? Hopefully, you aren't speaking as a mod and only just a regular member with this post. I'd hate to start seeing certain topics being banned for discussion just because it triggers certain members. I think it is ok to debate the moral nature of rape so long as no one is encouraging rape here.
That was very well said.
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 2:28 am
(This post was last modified: February 19, 2015 at 2:31 am by IanHulett.)
(February 19, 2015 at 2:05 am)psychoslice Wrote: (February 19, 2015 at 2:02 am)IanHulett Wrote: I agree with you too. What this thread has turned into brings up some bad memories.
Maybe you could share those memories, I talk about what happened to me because I don't want to supress it and have it jump up on me in the future, where it would stuff up my life, and also someone else's life, the one who has to listen to my neurosis.
Rape threats, unsolicited requests for sexual activity, being bullied because of my sexual orientation/slightly feminine personality, and non-consensual physical contact. On a public thread, that's as far as I'm comfortable with going.
If pinkie pie isn't real, then how do you explain the existence of ponies, huh? If ponies are real, then that's proof that Pinkie Pie is real. Checkmate, christians!
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 2:52 am
(February 19, 2015 at 2:28 am)IanHulett Wrote: (February 19, 2015 at 2:05 am)psychoslice Wrote: Maybe you could share those memories, I talk about what happened to me because I don't want to supress it and have it jump up on me in the future, where it would stuff up my life, and also someone else's life, the one who has to listen to my neurosis.
Rape threats, unsolicited requests for sexual activity, being bullied because of my sexual orientation/slightly feminine personality, and non-consensual physical contact. On a public thread, that's as far as I'm comfortable with going.
Yes I am homosexual and back when I was young I was very feminine, I think that is why I got piked on. Right from when I was only 12, I realized that there was perverts out there, men who wanted to take advantage of me because of my feminism.
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 3:28 am
(This post was last modified: February 19, 2015 at 3:32 am by Thumpalumpacus.)
(February 18, 2015 at 11:31 pm)whateverist Wrote: There sure is a universal, absolute moral truth if I say there is. Now all I have to do is find a way to enforce it.
I'd suggest threatening someone with eternal cremation ... it seems to be effective.
(February 19, 2015 at 12:29 am)Irrational Wrote: No, no, I didn't ask you what's an alternative for would-be rapist to indulge themselves in instead.
You said rape is wrong no matter what society says ... and your reason was because it affects those who are raped, right? What within the nature of this so-called objective morality dictates that you only consider how the raped feel about this? What is the reason you won't consider the rapist's feelings about rape in spite of you implying that morality is objective (and not subjective)?
Not sure if I'm making sense with my question.
The fact is that if you're justifying an action based on the feelings of one or more of the actors, you are by definition practicing moral subjectivity.
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 3:46 am
(February 19, 2015 at 3:28 am)Parkers Tan Wrote: The fact is that if you're justifying an action based on the feelings of one or more of the actors, you are by definition practicing moral subjectivity.
Exactly what I'm trying to get at.
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RE: Atheists only vote please: Do absolute MORAL truths exist? Is Rape ALWAYS "wr...
February 19, 2015 at 4:40 am
(February 19, 2015 at 1:56 am)psychoslice Wrote: (February 19, 2015 at 1:53 am)Cato Wrote: This logic suggests I cannot comment with any conviction my great dissatisfaction with being on the receiving end of a guillotine unless I've experienced it. You should rethink and amend your post.
Well of course you can have your opinion, I am not saying you can't. but until you have experienced rape, its just an opinion, maybe a good one at that.
Okay, let me dumb this down a level.
What you are saying is that I can't know if murder is right or wrong unless I've been murdered. Do you get it now? Or do I have to dumb it down even more?
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