god has no free will

[IATIA]

You make god sound like an interior decorator.

Actually, we can make god whatever we want. The theists do it all the time.

P.S. (there is no god anyway.)

[Whateverist]

Are you quite certain? Perhaps the woods are full of them but they're all in stealth mode.

[JonDarbyXIII]

Even beyond the issue of free will, God cannot be considered 'creative.' If he 'sat down' and contemplated exactly how he wanted everything to be (should people be green and blue; should the sky be red) then there would have to have been a 'time' before creation when God did not know what he was going to do. On the other hand, if the plan of 'creation' was already established from the beginning, then it can't be considered to be creative. In this case, it's really just following a natural course of events. We call that physics.

Theists just got themselves stuck between a rock and a hard place by that logic.

They had that problem when they tried to claim that 1=3

[Heywood]

But why did god allow his only book the bible to be horribly translated and also why did the people who were inspired by god to create stories that contradict his message. if gods message was so perfect he would have made it easier to understand and translatable. since god in a way allowed his followers to "deface" his original word why doesn't he get or bother someone to fix all of it back to its original content.

Now you are changing the subject to something else entirely. Your Jedi mind trick will not work on me. I don't argue religion.

[FatAndFaithless]

Correct, you simply assert it baldly.

[Heywood]

Even beyond the issue of free will, God cannot be considered 'creative.' If he 'sat down' and contemplated exactly how he wanted everything to be (should people be green and blue; should the sky be red) then there would have to have been a 'time' before creation when God did not know what he was going to do. On the other hand, if the plan of 'creation' was already established from the beginning, then it can't be considered to be creative. In this case, it's really just following a natural course of events. We call that physics.

I view omniscience as knowing all that is knowable. Until God chooses to make the sky red or blue that knowledge does not exist.

---

Correct, you simply assert it baldly.

Negative Fats

I do not assert religion either. I challenge you to find one quote of mine where I asserted a religious belief.....anywhere on this forum.

[dyresand]

But why did god allow his only book the bible to be horribly translated and also why did the people who were inspired by god to create stories that contradict his message. if gods message was so perfect he would have made it easier to understand and translatable. since god in a way allowed his followers to "deface" his original word why doesn't he get or bother someone to fix all of it back to its original content.

Now you are changing the subject to something else entirely. Your Jedi mind trick will not work on me. I don't argue religion.

if god is omniscient why does he let people knowingly mess with his word if there is word to begin with. your bible is the only means of reading gods message and why is there so many sects of a religion if they can't get the same message. you see the what i am trying to get at. either god could fix the issue at hand that makes him imperfect and not all knowing. or he is all knowing and does nothing. Its still a loose loose situation for theists.

[JonDarbyXIII]

I view omniscience as knowing all that is knowable. Until God chooses to make the sky red or blue that knowledge does not exist.

So God is omniscient because he knows everything that he knows. I could use that logic and make a similar claim that I know everything that is knowable. If I don't know it, then that knowledge doesn't exist (for me). Even if you claim that there is someone else that does know it, I don't know that knowledge indeed exists. Maybe the sky was destined to be blue whether God wanted it to be or not, but God didn't know that until he chose that.

[Heywood]

I view omniscience as knowing all that is knowable. Until God chooses to make the sky red or blue that knowledge does not exist.

So God is omniscient because he knows everything that he knows. I could use that logic and make a similar claim that I know everything that is knowable. If I don't know it, then that knowledge doesn't exist (for me). Even if you claim that there is someone else that does know it, I don't know that knowledge indeed exists. Maybe the sky was destined to be blue whether God wanted it to be or not, but God didn't know that until he chose that.

Negative JonDarby

The set of all that is knowable is not necessary the same as the set of knowing everything one knows. I know many things, but I do not know all that is knowable. You have made a straw man argument.

[dyresand]

So God is omniscient because he knows everything that he knows. I could use that logic and make a similar claim that I know everything that is knowable. If I don't know it, then that knowledge doesn't exist (for me). Even if you claim that there is someone else that does know it, I don't know that knowledge indeed exists. Maybe the sky was destined to be blue whether God wanted it to be or not, but God didn't know that until he chose that.

Negative JonDarby

The set of all that is knowable is not necessary the same as the set of knowing everything one knows. I know many things, but I do not know all that is knowable. You have made a straw man argument.

if you say or the bible says god is omniscient he knows everything. so he has to know everything. so your saying he doesn't need to know everything doesn't that mean god is imperfect.