Why so many "anti-feminists" in the atheist community?

[bennyboy]

Here's the thing: atheists, in general, are resistant to dogma. They are resistant to ideas imposed on them, even by a "right-thinking" majority.

I don't think anti-feminism is against females. It's against the impositions of an -ism, and the unbearable rhetoric, hypocrisy and implicit expectations of unconditional compliance. If someone tells me, "You must, always and under penalty of social stigma if you refuse, consider 'X' to be true," the first thing I'm going to do is argue to my death that "X" is not necessarily true. I'll call the social bluff on principal, just because-- fuck you for telling me what I am or am not allowed to think or believe.

[Alex K]

If someone tells me, "You must, always and under penalty of social stigma if you refuse, consider 'X' to be true," the first thing I'm going to do is argue to my death that "X" is not necessarily true.

You must, always and under penalty of social stigma if you refuse, consider it true that the earth is roughly 4.5 billion years old. So there, I got my popcorn ready

[Brian37]

Um, really not sure where this is coming from. First off no one should be surprised that atheists have diverse views like any other label. "Atheist" is a position, and it strictly has to do with god claims, outside that we are not bound to loyalty oaths, nor are we a political party or a religion.

Now as far as the rights of women I look at it this way, it is up to the individual, not the collective. Women are equal to men because it takes both sexes for evolution to occur. But I am not into crap about women telling other women how do dress or what to wear anymore than I like men telling women how to dress or behave. I also don't like men telling other men what defines a man or how they should look or act.

[Bad Wolf]

I think when the atheist youtubers call themselves 'anti-feminist' it doesn't mean, against feminism. They agree with a lot of their goals but don't agree with their methods or their extremists and want to distance themselves from that. And as for them bashing people like anita sarkeesian too much, well someone has to do it, otherwise even more people might agree with her. Stupidity, hate and ignorance needs to be countered wherever it is found, regardless of who or where it comes from.

And as for the extremists not doing much, have we forgotten gamergate? And how about shirtgate?
This guy who had succeeded in the most important mission of his life by landing a probe on an asteroid 3 hundred million miles away, was reduced to tears by the bullying and abuse of extremist feminists who dog piled onto him, for wearing a shirt with skimpily dressed ladies on it. A shirt designed by his friend who was a woman. And then they say things like 'He was asking for it' 'If he didn't want this to happen, he shouldn't have worn that shirt' Sounds familiar doesn't it.
And how about the cesspool that is tumblr and how they are actually doxing people who don't agree with them. That doesn't affect many people but it is illegal and they are getting away with it.

I think these examples and many more instances are the reasons why I and others don't want to be associated with feminists and so instead prefer the 'egalitarian' label.

[Dystopia]

I will just say this - If you are an atheist and you support gender equality, then you are a feminist/pro-feminist, saying you are not is not going to change the fact that you are, just like you are a democract if you support democracy and a republican if you support republic as a form of government (I'm not using republican and democrat referring to the American parties).

I used to be one of those anti-feminist males (the majority of them are male, curiously) until I read some feminist blogs and news sites full of rational positions and evidence to back up claims - I changed my mind. Saying equality has been achieved, specially when the majority of people claiming that are males, is a very naive position to have. The so called extreme feminists or feminazis are a minority in the middle of all pro equality feminists, and many people are surprised upon realizing that they care about Men's problems too (such as, but not only, male rape being made fun of or gender stereotypes that affect men) - Feminism brings advantages to both, as a male feminist ideals bring me less gender stereotyping and don't make my value depend upon archaic concepts of masculinity - It also highlights the importance of reducing sexism in relationships and therefore contributing to ideas that make my relationship much better.

Many of those extreme positions are only propagated by sites like reddit or 9gag, or tumblr, full of angry young men who for some reason think feminism is clearly making their lives a living hell since being nice to girls doesn't entitle them to have sex... I think I'm going to vomit

Calling yourself not a feminist but an eglitarian is like saying "I'm not an atheists, I just don't believe in gods" or saying "I'm not an atheist, just an agnostic", it's just fear of being associated with the word. I think atheists can learn something from feminist extremists - Every wondered why are there so many people who think atheist "fundamentalists" are equally as bad, and that atheists on the internet are bad people or that atheists are becoming as intolerant as fundie theists? Because there are atheists everywhere, from the internet to real life that spend their lives (outside of Atheist Forums) bashing religion and insulting religious people for no other reason than being religions, the kind of people who hear someone say "god bless you" and reply "NO NO I DON'T BELIEVE IN THAT BULLSHIT FUCK YOUR GOD AND BIBLE!" - So I'm asking - Do you think criticism directed towards atheism labelling it as an extreme ideology that equals groups like Islamic terrorists and so on is fair just because there are some douchebags? Probably not, and that's the same line of reasoning we ought to apply to feminism, the minority shouldn't define what the movement actually means

I think the word "feminism" is unpopular and the reason many people don't label themselves as such - If the word had been "equality" or "egalitarianism" from the beginning, most people wouldn't be anti-egalitarian or anti-equality . I think we should use Emma Watson's words that it's not really about the word but the idea behind it.

OP I have an interesting question - Do you think it is rational to be a feminist and religious at the same time or are the two positions not compatible?

Welcome!

---

I don't care for radical feminism. I think making accusations of "rape culture" and "gender genocide" undermines the laudable goal of gender equality. I suspect radical feminists don't really care about gender equality, and that means they will not get my support, and I certainly don't care, as an atheist, to be associated with their message.

Maybe accusations of rape culture would stop coming out if victim blaming and extreme pity people have for rapists stopped existing... Ever heard a comment like Oh she had short clothes, that was a deserved rape.

---

Egalitarianism is defined as gender equality not feminism. Feminism focus is womens right which are being infringed on. Ido support feminist causes but don't classify myself as a feminist. This is because of the extremist who are small but very vocal.

Did you know that feminists care about men's problems too? You probably don't because you're making a generalization of the movement without having met, talked to or read articles from a rational pro-equality feminism.

[No_God]

I don't like extremism, in anything.

[dyresand]

YouTube can, and has, done wonders for the atheist community. It gave free thinkers a place to post videos to help educate the world on the likes of science and dangers of religion. It was YouTubers like CultOfDusty, who I originally subscribed to for his political videos, that helped me come to my senses and denounce my former religion.

But over the past year or so, there's been a trend among popular atheist YouTubers: anti-feminism.

I will admit right now that there are many extreme feminists who I don't agree with. In fact, a lot of the things "anti-feminists" critique, I agree with. But not to the extent that I would ever title myself as an anti-feminist. No, I am not against the movement that fights the Republicans' attempts to limit my reproductive rights, or the movement that points out double standards that still exist (for women and men). I am not against the movement that is working to make gender identification and sexuality and orientation normal things. Why any forward-thinking, self-identifying atheist would be against this movement is beyond me.

I understand these anti-feminists usually support the efforts of feminists in the past, and even the present. After all, TheAmazingAtheist paints his fingernails...if it wasn't for modern feminism, that would be unacceptable. I know that these anti-feminists just get their panties in a knot when they watch videos by extremists like Anita Sarkeesian, you know, that woman that no one likes, save for her following of maybe...40,000 people? Maybe? If that?

Point being, all these extreme feminists are a joke. They don't have power in politics. They have a minimal influence over culture and the population. The only people they're reaching are misandrous cat ladies who would be just as misandrous and just as cat lady with or without a weekly subscription to FemFreq.

But regardless, we all have our opinions and things we're passionate about. I can understand why people, including atheist YouTubers, would want to respond to some of the ridiculous things the extreme feminists spew. But like...why respond to that meaningless bullshit every week? If these extreme feminists are gaining any momentum at all, it's because the anti-feminists are guiding them to their videos!

Tj, TheAmazingAtheist, arguably has the largest following of his peers. That said, he has some considerable power over people, and probably much more so than the big, mean, scary Anita Sarkeesian! Why is he, and so many other YouTubers, wasting that power on beating a dead horse again on a weekly basis?

I get it. It's the Internet and people can do what they want. If making videos mocking these feminists is fun for them, they can do it! But should they?

As an anti-religion atheist, I don't think so.

If atheists want to gain acceptance, see religious laws get removed, and someday live in a world where dogma doesn't exist, we need power. And power comes in number.

Feminists (not the extremists) are a heftily sized group of people that atheists should be working to attract, not piss off. A lot of feminists are areligious because they know that many gender roles and oppression stem from the Bible and Qu'ran and other pieces of religious paraphernalia. I formerly identified more as a feminist until I "went back to being" an atheist. I see religion as the root of several problems in the world, including the problems feminists fight. While I am still a feminist, I tend to talk and get more passionate about the atheists' cause because I think it more or less encompasses all of my beliefs, so to speak. What I'm trying to say is, there are a lot of women out there, who call themselves feminist, that we as atheists should try to "convert".

When even female atheist YouTubers like JaclynGlenn label themselves "anti-feminist", it deters a lot of queer people, trans people, and women in general. How are these people supposed to feel welcome in the atheist community when it's largely composed of men and some women--men and women who say they are against feminism?!

I unsubscribed from TheAmazingAtheist and seldom tune in to JaclynGlenn because I got tired of seeing their anti-feminist videos so often. And they're not the only ones.

Maybe I'm just being the kind of overly-sensitive bitch that Tj and Jaclyn rant and rave about, but I just honestly think their efforts could be put to better use making more videos criticizing the religious bigots in politics and media instead of a handful of ladies crying about cat calls.

I know this post will probably go unread or unanswered both because I'm new, and because I hold a very unpopular opinion. I just have been wanting to get this off my chest for a long time, and I didn't really have a place for it until now. But I'd love to further discus!

If you want a good explanation well... ill give you a video.
Well i am all for the equal rights of both men and women but there is one issue... well here is a video.

[Bad Wolf]

I'm not scared of being associated with the word feminist, I just don't want to be associated with it due to the crazy extremist man hating hypocrites. If they all go away, then I will happily associate myself with feminism.

[Dystopia]

I'm not scared of being associated with the word feminist, I just don't want to be associated with it due to the crazy extremist man hating hypocrites. If they all go away, then I will happily associate myself with feminism.

You are an atheist, and you aren't afraid to be associated with the word just because of the minority of atheists who think religion should be illegal, or that religions people should be executed, or that spend their time insulting religions people and calling them inferiors - So why do the same with feminism? It makes no sense. You shouldn't refuse to be associated with a movement simply because of what others think of it, be honest with yourself... Let's reverse the situations - Would you enjoy it if a woman didn't support equal rights for men just because some men hate women (I'm thinking about religion, about certain countries, about rape statistics and sexual slavery, and so on)... Do you think it would be fair? Of course not, it wouldn't make sense for a female to not support men's rights just because some men harm women, so the same goes for your side

[Bad Wolf]

The last time I checked, there aren't atheists trying to make religion illegal, there are no atheists pushing their agendas in things like video games, there are no atheists invading churches and mosques and synagogues. It is completely different from feminism. Where as we condemn each other constantly when we think we're wrong on issues, feminism doesn't do that. At least christians condemn the westboro baptist church. Where are the feminists condemning the actions of groups like the one in the video above? They will do anything to further their agenda, they don't care about hypocrisy or intellectual honesty or even facts. Whereas atheists do.