I know most of you don’t believe in Heaven, but for the sake of argument, let’s imagine for a moment that we do. Only if there is a Heaven can I take you to the logical conclusion I point out here.
You may have heard Christians convoluted explanation for why their god allows so much suffering in this world. Freewill, they tell us. In order for us to have freewill, god had to allow us to choose evil. To that we might ask why did god think that it was worth all this suffering to give us freewill? To this, they tell us that without freewill, it would be impossible for man to truly love god
DIGRESSION: Is there not something sadistic about a being that would put others in harm’s way just so they can prove their love? Something insecure, you might say? I‘ll not make that argument here, but keep it in mind.
Here, I raise the question will humans have freewill in Heaven? If so then the same possibility of evil and suffering will exist. What will the consequence be for those who sin in Heaven? What were the consequences for the angels that sinned?
If true love and joy could not exist in Eden without freewill and the possibility of sin then it cannot exist in Heaven. In fact, there will not only be the possibility of sin, but it is probable, even inevitable that many humans will sin in heaven.
Every human who goes to Heaven will know at least one person who did not make it. A spouse, a parent, a child, a friend. The book of Revelation tells us the smoke of their torment will go up before the Lord forever. For the humans in Heaven, this will be a constant reminder of something sinister in god. This will be worse than slavery. The African slaves could not choose their actions and were often forced to smile at the most gruesome treatments, but at least they had the privacy of their own feelings and thoughts. In the presence of a god who knows our thoughts before we think them, we wouldn't even have that. We would be like zombies. If we have any freewill at all, we will seek to be free from such mental tyranny.
At this point, Christians will say that we will be so grateful for the sacrifice of Jesus that we won't want to rebel. Sacrifice alone cannot sustain gratitude. If anything, sacrifice with strings of obligation attached to it evokes resentment.
The smoke of the torment of our loved ones will go up as an eternal reminder to us of what will happen if we sin. Gratitude cannot be sustained under threat. Gratitude and love will die and in their place will arise fear and hatred of this massa who cannot be resisted. Our fear and hatred will be known and surely punished. Since there will be no more sacrifice for sin the only punishment will be eternal damnation. The only way god can avoid eventually having to damn the entire human race is to take away our freewill.
It doesn't help to say that we will be perfect beings who won't have a sin nature that can feel fear, resentment and rebellion. The angels who rebelled in Heaven, not just the ones who rebelled with Satan but also the ones who in Jude left their first estate and married human women, were not descendants of Adam and had no sin nature but they did have freewill. Paul tells us we will be like the angels. If the angels could rebel then we will be able to as well.
Again, if god is able to let us have free will but still keep us from sin in Heaven then he could have done it in Eden and he could have kept the angels from rebelling. When Christians resort to the god can do anything answer, they defeat the god had to allow sin answer.
You may have heard Christians convoluted explanation for why their god allows so much suffering in this world. Freewill, they tell us. In order for us to have freewill, god had to allow us to choose evil. To that we might ask why did god think that it was worth all this suffering to give us freewill? To this, they tell us that without freewill, it would be impossible for man to truly love god
DIGRESSION: Is there not something sadistic about a being that would put others in harm’s way just so they can prove their love? Something insecure, you might say? I‘ll not make that argument here, but keep it in mind.
Here, I raise the question will humans have freewill in Heaven? If so then the same possibility of evil and suffering will exist. What will the consequence be for those who sin in Heaven? What were the consequences for the angels that sinned?
If true love and joy could not exist in Eden without freewill and the possibility of sin then it cannot exist in Heaven. In fact, there will not only be the possibility of sin, but it is probable, even inevitable that many humans will sin in heaven.
Every human who goes to Heaven will know at least one person who did not make it. A spouse, a parent, a child, a friend. The book of Revelation tells us the smoke of their torment will go up before the Lord forever. For the humans in Heaven, this will be a constant reminder of something sinister in god. This will be worse than slavery. The African slaves could not choose their actions and were often forced to smile at the most gruesome treatments, but at least they had the privacy of their own feelings and thoughts. In the presence of a god who knows our thoughts before we think them, we wouldn't even have that. We would be like zombies. If we have any freewill at all, we will seek to be free from such mental tyranny.
At this point, Christians will say that we will be so grateful for the sacrifice of Jesus that we won't want to rebel. Sacrifice alone cannot sustain gratitude. If anything, sacrifice with strings of obligation attached to it evokes resentment.
The smoke of the torment of our loved ones will go up as an eternal reminder to us of what will happen if we sin. Gratitude cannot be sustained under threat. Gratitude and love will die and in their place will arise fear and hatred of this massa who cannot be resisted. Our fear and hatred will be known and surely punished. Since there will be no more sacrifice for sin the only punishment will be eternal damnation. The only way god can avoid eventually having to damn the entire human race is to take away our freewill.
It doesn't help to say that we will be perfect beings who won't have a sin nature that can feel fear, resentment and rebellion. The angels who rebelled in Heaven, not just the ones who rebelled with Satan but also the ones who in Jude left their first estate and married human women, were not descendants of Adam and had no sin nature but they did have freewill. Paul tells us we will be like the angels. If the angels could rebel then we will be able to as well.
Again, if god is able to let us have free will but still keep us from sin in Heaven then he could have done it in Eden and he could have kept the angels from rebelling. When Christians resort to the god can do anything answer, they defeat the god had to allow sin answer.
The god who allows children to be raped out of respect for the free will choice of the rapist, but punishes gay men for engaging in mutually consensual sex couldn't possibly be responsible for an intelligently designed universe.
I may defend your right to free speech, but i won't help you pass out flyers.
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.
--Voltaire
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
I may defend your right to free speech, but i won't help you pass out flyers.
Those who can make you believe absurdities, can make you commit atrocities.
--Voltaire
Nietzsche isn't dead. How do I know he lives? He lives in my mind.
