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Dr. Craig is a liar.
RE: Dr. Craig is a liar.
Oh well.
Reply
RE: Dr. Craig is a liar.
There doesn't -have- to be evidence against -any- premise.  That's not how this works.  FFS.  You've just pulled the "prove me wrong" card.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
Dr. Craig is a liar.
(May 11, 2016 at 9:37 pm)SteveII Wrote:
(May 11, 2016 at 9:20 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: Strange...I don't see WLC using any actual scientific evidence (he only gives it a shout out) to support either his grand assertions about the natural laws of the universe, or his responses to scientifically grounded objections.  

All I see here are simplistic, condescending, and childish metaphors that should insult the intelligence of any average, grown adult:  "Well, why don't bicycles just pop into existence, then?"  Really, WLC?

So you think there is scientific evidence against the first premise? If is simplistic, then it should be easy to list defeaters.


Nope. Doesn't work like that

Claim 1: everything that begins to exist has a cause

Claim 2: the universe began to exist

Unless these scientifically grounded claims about the physical laws of the universe can be demonstrated by the claimant, then the entire argument is vapid, and I am free to remain unconvinced and unaffected by its conclusion...a conclusion that you can't even logically explain, btw.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
Dr. Craig is a liar.
(May 11, 2016 at 9:44 pm)Alasdair Ham Wrote: Oh well.


Lol...hang in there Hamster, I'm sure you're next in line! [emoji13]
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
Dr. Craig is a liar.
(May 11, 2016 at 9:44 pm)Rhythm Wrote: There doesn't -have- to be evidence against -any- premise.  That's not how this works.  FFS.  You've just pulled the "prove me wrong" card.


Boy...when I can tell the argument is unraveling, that's when you know it's bad.
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
Dr. Craig is a liar.
(May 11, 2016 at 9:37 pm)SteveII Wrote:
(May 11, 2016 at 9:20 pm)LadyForCamus Wrote: Strange...I don't see WLC using any actual scientific evidence (he only gives it a shout out) to support either his grand assertions about the natural laws of the universe, or his responses to scientifically grounded objections.  

All I see here are simplistic, condescending, and childish metaphors that should insult the intelligence of any average, grown adult:  "Well, why don't bicycles just pop into existence, then?"  Really, WLC?

So you think there is scientific evidence against the first premise? If is simplistic, then it should be easy to list defeaters.


We have a physicist in-house. Should we call him in as an expert witness you think? [emoji6]
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
RE: Dr. Craig is a liar.
I feel the same way about myself.  If a chimp with a keyboard can derail your knockdown "rational justifications" for a god, maybe you don't have any.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
RE: Dr. Craig is a liar.
(May 11, 2016 at 8:15 pm)SteveII Wrote:
(May 11, 2016 at 7:27 pm)Jehanne Wrote: If god become temporal and time began 13.8 billions years ago, then if god is omniscient, then all future events, from god's perspective, constitutes an actual infinite set, correct?

I congratulate you on your campaign to explore every possible angle to arrive at an actual infinite. 

No, future events can never be an actual infinite. There can always be one more event. There is no number of events where adding one more will equal infinity.

I'm talking about god's knowledge of those future events, Steve; are you saying that there are future events that god does not know about??  Or, are you saying that time, even in Heaven, will come to end?
Reply
Dr. Craig is a liar.
[Image: b31877e54dd2a83bf84ad87c727213d9.jpg]

(Sorry; I honestly couldn't stop myself.)
Nay_Sayer: “Nothing is impossible if you dream big enough, or in this case, nothing is impossible if you use a barrel of KY Jelly and a miniature horse.”

Wiser words were never spoken. 
Reply
RE: Dr. Craig is a liar.
(May 11, 2016 at 7:43 pm)SteveII Wrote:
(May 11, 2016 at 5:13 pm)Jörmungandr Wrote: Numbers and relationships don't exist in the natural world.  They are functions of the concept of quantity which itself is a function of the idea of an object.  In the universe at large there is only undifferentiated being.  The desk is a part of the room which also contains the chair.  None of these are distinct objects except in the conception of the mind.  There is nothing special about the substance of the desk which separates it from the air surrounding it.  We impute a distinction by virtue of the way our senses break things down into separate parts.  The parts don't really exist as parts, it's just a function of the way our senses perceive the whole.  We 'break it down' into parts because that is the way our senses work.  If we didn't have this breaking down into distinct objects, we wouldn't have the concept of quantity.  Quantity, numbers, and relationships are artifacts of the granularity of our senses.  As artifact, they don't exist as natural kinds in the universe.  That we break things down into objects and parts when we perceive them isn't grounded in God.  So quantity and number aren't grounded in God.

Would you consider yourself an anti-realist?

That depends on what you mean by an anti-realist.
[Image: extraordinarywoo-sig.jpg]
Reply



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