So, what are we going to do about it?

[lrh9]

Only a technological revolution has a snowball's chance in Hell of eradicating the negative effects of religion or of causing people to abandon religion entirely.

[HeyItsZeus]

There is nothing you can do....yet. First they must all regard atheism with respect (they don't) and then it will become more widely accepted. This is only my opinion anyway.

[tackattack]

Religion isn't the issue I think Dawkins was talking about, it's dogma. It's about not getting arrogant small minded individuals influencing large groups to their tainted view alone. A Church can have an open view of the Bible. I've brought a Koran (translated)and the Talmud into my classrooms for 7 yr olds. I'm non-denominational therfore I teach every denominations views when I can fit all of them in, because we're not about dogma or being right. I form ministries to outreach to people to fill their needs, not what we think they need. If they ask why I might tell them about my faith, but all that's very personal and in no way "You can't get your light bill paid until you come to Church". I don't claim this is the way, because we have Jewish members, homosexual members, evangelical members, orthodox members, protestant members, conservative members, non-believing members (probably he's a diest, oir agnostic, not sure). We're about God and not about the dogma. Annunzi you're way off base with such a broad generalization. Religion doesn't have shit all to do with science (apart from creationism and scientology) and because the rest of the Christian community has found them unbased they're segregated as their own denomination and really fretted over. We had a sister church protest try and go to a creationist protest and talk some peace adn love into them (dind't work). But if a creationist ever came to our church, they'd be welcomed like everyone else. It is fear though I believe, more of a we're taught to fear God, and we're afraid to question our beliefs, so let's try and make up science that coroberates our views. At it's very basest creationism is reactionary to science and therefore probably more rationalizatin than rational by default.

@HeyItsZeus- I respectAtheism, in fact me and 2 of the moderators are going to hang out in a few weeks, maybe have a beer and they're going to try and deconvert me. I'm open to teh experience and have respect for a lot of the atheists in here. Tolerance breeds tolerance and accepting that there's more to life than your own perspective is tantamount to progresing society. Broad generalizations lke thatonly perpetuate intolerant. I'm truly sorry for your experiences with Religion, perhaps though you could at least suspend your judgement a little longer and possibly accept the possibility of another perspective

[Entropist]

I do think that as a consequence of improved economic security religion is made irrelevant. Hence (largely) why religion plays has a much smaller role in more left leaning countries of Europe-- the outlier of developed countries being the US, which is far more conservative than even European conservatives. This is not a coincidence. Religious fervor thrives on fear and insecurity. When life is not so bad, religion becomes irrelevant for most people.

The way to reduce the presence of religion in the world is then done indirectly, by improving people's lives here and now. Karl Marx was correct when he said religion was the opiate of the masses, however he was incorrect insofar as thinking that eliminating religion would lead to better economic conditions. He put the cart before the horse I think.

But-- and this is a big "but": What are we going to do about it?

Me: Nothing. I used to not be so pessimistic, and in the past I've been a big supporter of Amnesty International and other left leaning orgs. Perhaps I am merely burnt out by what I see in the news, and living in the US only despairs me more every day. Idiots out there think global warming is a hoax, and why should we trust scientists? I say let it rot. We have brought ourselves to a point of dependence on things, knowing full and well what the consequences are, but we can't be bothered to change our lifestyle (and yes, I have made some significant changes myself). And that's just the tip of the iceberg (no pun intended).

The vast majority of human beings are stupid. Yes, that's an elitist thing to say, big deal. Historically, human beings have never been convinced through reasoning (good or bad) to any position. Oftentimes they don't even learn from their own mistakes. And when they do learn, it is only because they then realize the ultimate consequences of it. Like an alcoholic, they must hit rock bottom before they think there is a problem to be addressed. And then humans have short attention spans and in no time they find some new idiocy to believe in or support.

Humans are not rational animals. They are animals capable of USING reason, but reason is not inherent in human nature-- it is merely a tool we are capable of putting to use (or abuse). Even when we try our best to be reasonable about things, ultimately in our emotions that our decisions in life are rooted (for good or ill). Our capacity for stupidity is limitless and should never be underestimated. Add to that media, corporate and political organizations spewing out BS to further their own interests at the expense of everyone else.

"Hell is a special favor reserved for those who have asked for it insistently." (Albert Camus)

The only problem is that eventually we will suffer consequences from which humans-- and all other life as well-- may not survive (its amazing we have even made it this far). Whereas I used to think this was something worth fighting, I've simply taken to misanthropy now.

I don't expect anyone else to agree with me (truly, I wouldn't want them to!) and as I said, perhaps this is merely a malaise of my own making. I have inadvertently found myself becoming passive nihilist, sardonically cheering our self-destruction on the sidelines. I'm suffering from the secular equivalent of acedia.

Sorry.