A Nun's Views on Abortion

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Sister Joan Chittister, a Benedictine nun.

"I do not believe that just because you're opposed to abortion, that makes you pro-life. In fact, I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed.

And why would I think that you don't?

Because you don't want any tax money going there.

That's not pro-life.

That's pro-birth.

We need a much broader conversation on what the mortality of pro-life is."

Thought? Comments?

[Catholic_Lady]

I agree with her 100%. I'm pro life, and that encompasses much more than just bring against abortion.

[Minimalist]

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Sister Joan Chittister, a Benedictine nun.

"I do not believe that just because you're opposed to abortion, that makes you pro-life. In fact, I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed.

And why would I think that you don't?

Because you don't want any tax money going there.

That's not pro-life.

That's pro-birth.

We need a much broader conversation on what the mortality of pro-life is."

Thought? Comments?

At least it's a somewhat more nuanced view that we usually hear from the Funny Hat Society.

Boru

[brewer]

I don't understand the "Because you don't want any tax money going there" statement. What the hell does "taxes" have to do with the issue?

Do nuns or the catholic church pay taxes? Oh, wait, someone else should pay. Got it!

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

I don't understand the "Because you don't want any tax money going there" statement. What the hell does "taxes" have to do with the issue?

Do nuns or the catholic church pay taxes? Oh, wait, someone else should pay. Got it!

I think that Sister Chittister is making the point that people who are opposed to abortion are being hypocritical when they decry government funded social aid to the poor. Not being willing for your taxes to go to people who desperately need help isn't exactly being 'pro-life'.

Boru

[brewer]

I don't understand the "Because you don't want any tax money going there" statement. What the hell does "taxes" have to do with the issue?

Do nuns or the catholic church pay taxes? Oh, wait, someone else should pay. Got it!

I think that Sister Chittister is making the point that people who are opposed to abortion are being hypocritical when they decry government funded social aid to the poor.  Not being willing for your taxes to go to people who desperately need help isn't exactly being 'pro-life'.

Boru

And she/the church is not being hypocritical? Why should a nun or the church get any say on how/where taxes are spent?

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Well, the notion that churches pay no taxes is largely a myth. The incomes of people employed by a church are taxed, incomes from church-owned properties are taxable, and churches pay VAT on most of the things they buy. Donations made to a church, however, are not taxable as income.

By way of illustration, let's say I start up the One True Church Of Boru. I'm too busy to conduct the weekly services myself, so I hire someone to do the preaching and pay him $50 000 a year. He pays taxes on that. Running a church is expensive, so I start up a bookstore and a restaurant, the income from both of which are taxable (provided they both realize a profit). I also own a small apartment building - while the income from the rents benefit the church, that income is also taxed. Ever eager to get more money, I organize a bake sale. I have to buy the flour, sugar, eggs, baking pans and so forth to make the baked goods, and all of these purchases are taxed.

At least, that's how it works here.

Boru

[Homeless Nutter]

Sister Joan Chittister, a Benedictine nun.

"I do not believe that just because you're opposed to abortion, that makes you pro-life. In fact, I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed.[...]"

Christians are pro-life. They're just pro-money more.

Let me put this in a way your typical conservative christian might (if they were honest, for once):

Forcing sluts to suffer the consequences of all that sin - that doesn't cost anything. De-funding Planned Parenthood - that even saves money. Feeding, housing and educating the little bastards, so that they may have relatively normal childhood and a fair start in life - that not only would cost money, but also would negate a lot of that punishment-for-f*cking aspect of having children, and take away from the privilege of being raised in a full-income, or double-income family. Can't have that.

Kids of sluts need to go hungry, so that everybody learns a valuable lesson and so that people who don't have sex can feel smug. And all those unwanted, underfed and under-educated children will grow up to be fine members of the under-class, so that white christian children of nuclear families have someone to look down on, without having to accept refugees and other "ausländer" among their midst. It's all pretty well thought out.

Because Jesus said, that you're supposed to help people in need, but only when it's not too much of a hassle, doesn't cost much and you deem them to be worthy...

...

Yeah - christianity is pretty convenient. You can be an uncaring, judgmental, tightfisted bigot and still sit on a high horse, picking few bits from the bible, that suit you, and disregarding the rest.

---

Well, the notion that churches pay no taxes is largely a myth.

---

The incomes of people employed by a church are taxed, incomes from church-owned properties are taxable, and churches pay VAT on most of the things they buy.  Donations made to a church, however, are not taxable as income.

By way of illustration, let's say I start up the One True Church Of Boru.  I'm too busy to conduct the weekly services myself, so I hire someone to do the preaching and pay him $50 000 a year.  He pays taxes on that.  Running a church is expensive, so I start up a bookstore and a restaurant, the income from both of which are taxable (provided they both realize a profit).  I also own a small apartment building - while the income from the rents benefit the church, that income is also taxed.  Ever eager to get more money, I organize a bake sale.  I have to buy the flour, sugar, eggs, baking pans and so forth to make the baked goods, and all of these purchases are taxed.

---

At least, that's how it works here.

Boru

Hmmm... I don't think that's how it usually works over here in Europe. At least - not quite yet.

Italian Catholic Church under pressure to start paying property tax

Campaigners, most prominently parties on the centre left, say it is deeply unfair that Church-owned properties with a commercial function — for instance convents and monasteries that charge paying guests similar rates to four-star hotels — are exempt from property tax.
As the new technocrat government of Mario Monti seeks to slash the nation’s 1.9 trillion euro debt, attention is turning to the estimated 65,000 buildings owned by the Church.
They include around 50,000 cathedrals, churches and chapels — which would retain their tax-free status — but 11,000 schools, universities and libraries as well as nearly 5,000 hospitals, clinics and other commercial properties would face the tax.

[Catholic_Lady]

I think that Sister Chittister is making the point that people who are opposed to abortion are being hypocritical when they decry government funded social aid to the poor.  Not being willing for your taxes to go to people who desperately need help isn't exactly being 'pro-life'.

Boru

And she/the church is not being hypocritical? Why should a nun or the church get any say on how/where taxes are spent?

The catholic church gives more to tje.poor than any other organizarion.

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