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Why would this be so hard to have done?
#1
Why would this be so hard to have done?
Yahweh creates man and woman with the knowledge of good and evil from the start. He speaks to each and every one of them individually every time they ask; he freezes time, as is well within his power, sits down with them, cuddling them in his arms as he can be large enough to make an adult like a baby in his arms. The warmth of that body should make it feel like your heartbeat can't possibly go lower, you're so at peace in the presence. Any question you have, is immediately given an answer, a comprehensive, non-ambiguous, honest answer. There is no devil to frighten or deceive; there are no angels to make humans feel inferior.

The world in which he has created them resembles the one we know but is free of disease, deformity and any other form of ailment and mental disorder. If a person should happen to die they wake up in their bed the next morning; there is no such thing as an orphan. No child is ever conceived except when the parents have in full knowledge sworn to be exclusive to one another and are trying with intent to have a child. There is never a miscarriage, premature birth, ectopic pregnancy or any other form of complication with a woman; the hymen does not exist and does not bring pain and childbirth is uncomfortable but far easier, perhaps newborns are smaller or human flesh is far more stretchy and malleable.

All human needs are met. A fruit tree will spring up out of nothing is anyone is hungry and has no other way of getting food. Money or bartering economies are nonexistent, they are never even conceived of because everyone is equal in the eyes of Yahweh and no one has any reason to feel jealous because Yahweh does not say he favors any of them, or say that he condemns anyone in particular for doing anything he does not approve of. Yahweh is then justifiably more concerned about these humans praising him and being grateful than with their petty human wickedness if they should choose to fornicate, steal (which wouldn't be necessary, or even practically possible to pull off), kill or whatever else Yahweh forbids.

Yahweh constantly reminds everyone that the reward for obedience, reverence and love (after all, with such a close relationship, how can they possibly fail to do something so simple?) is an eternal life, beyond the set limit of 100 years that he has imposed upon them out of fairness. After all, no one gets sick or dies, not until that counter is up. And he always makes sure that you'll feel comfortable and unafraid when the time comes because he cares. He freezes time and holds your hand as your loved ones look on, and as you leave your body, he walks you up to his paradise where knowledge you could not fathom before, travel to the vast reaches of space, the ability to explore through time forward and backward, a grand adventure that you had to earn by largely giving up a few selfish things while on Earth (after all, all your needs are met, there was little to no risk of anything bad ever happening to you) and just knowing your place beneath Yahweh, who is after all unquestioningly benevolent; the worst person on the planet can't possibly find fault with Yahweh, hard as they try.

Yahweh is also merciful. So, you didn't feel gratitude for all Yahweh gave you, and the promise of wonders after your death failed to impress you? So be it. You will live your life over again, with all of your memories, so that when you are reborn, you will know exactly what the reason is for your failure to do what should have been so simple. The world into which you are reborn is ours; a world full of death, disease, and other horrors by comparison, a world forsaken by Yahweh. You call upon Yahweh as loudly as you can, until your lungs collapse, and you hear nothing, feel nothing, see nothing. Because you forsook Yahweh, you now need to earn back his blessing. You will live this life of suffering, knowing full well it's all your fault and ruing every second how foolish it was to ever be so ungrateful and have so little foresight. But, because you know all that, with absolute certainty, and you have no reason to blame Yahweh for this, and you know the solution, the moment you die in this world, if you've done what you failed to the first time, you get your eternity. It just took you a little longer, but you learned something, because Yahweh understands the importance of critical intelligence.

But what if you become bitter? Foolish once again, even more so, you blame Yahweh for coming up with this unpleasant punishment for you, and upon your death, you wake up once again with all memories of your past two lives. You never lose the opportunity to reflect upon the reality of why this is happening, only this next life is in a similarly awful world, but slightly worse than the last, only just slightly. And once again, you fail to learn your lesson. You wake up in your third life, in a world slightly worse than the last. And again, and again, never reaching a world that is truly in any sense 'hell', but always having that chance at redemption. All it takes is one life lived correctly, and you never forget why and how to do that. You've just lost the privilege of having Yahweh holding your hand the whole time. Should have done it right the first time. But then, with such a stacked deck towards being able to do it right, you really have no excuse for failing, especially more than once.





This would be a world where you could consider life a gift. This would be a world where life would never be compared to a test. This is a world where you couldn't get away with being an atheist. This is a world where you couldn't possibly justify thinking of Yahweh as anything but perfect in every way. We don't have that. We don't have anything remotely like that. We don't have any effort being put in by any creator trying to make it more like that. We don't have any reason to think any creator actually knew what they were doing or gave a shit about us if they did. If you can't come up with a god and scenario like the one I outlined above, or acknowledge that anything less than that is unacceptable, please shove your entire ideology up your fucking ass. Your entire worldview is a colossal, pathetic, deplorable, laughable failure.
Religions were invented to impress and dupe illiterate, superstitious stone-age peasants. So in this modern, enlightened age of information, what's your excuse? Or are you saying with all your advantages, you were still tricked as easily as those early humans?

---

There is no better way to convey the least amount of information in the greatest amount of words than to try explaining your religious views.
Reply
#2
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
I don't know, man.  But you reminded me of this quotation.


Quote:War makes rattling good history; but Peace is poor reading.

THOMAS HARDY

Why would anyone bother reading a book like you described?
Reply
#3
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
(June 28, 2017 at 9:18 pm)Astonished Wrote: This would be a world where you could consider life a gift. This would be a world where life would never be compared to a test. This is a world where you couldn't get away with being an atheist. This is a world where you couldn't possibly justify thinking of Yahweh as anything but perfect in every way. We don't have that. We don't have anything remotely like that. We don't have any effort being put in by any creator trying to make it more like that. We don't have any reason to think any creator actually knew what they were doing or gave a shit about us if they did. If you can't come up with a god and scenario like the one I outlined above, or acknowledge that anything less than that is unacceptable, please shove your entire ideology up your fucking ass. Your entire worldview is a colossal, pathetic, deplorable, laughable failure.

How about this scenario: Live a good, moral life, help & love one another; then see what shakes out on the other side?

It might actually be better than dying a hundred times just to hold Yahweh's hand, and find out what a cad you've been.
Quis ut Deus?
Reply
#4
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
Not good enough for xtians.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_fide


Quote:Sola fide (Latin: by faith alone), also known as justification by faith alone, is a Christian theological doctrine that distinguishes most Protestant denominations from the Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, and some parts of the Restoration Movement.

The doctrine of sola fide asserts God's pardon for guilty sinners is granted to and received through faith alone, excluding all "works".
Reply
#5
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
(June 28, 2017 at 10:20 pm)ronedee Wrote:
(June 28, 2017 at 9:18 pm)Astonished Wrote: This would be a world where you could consider life a gift. This would be a world where life would never be compared to a test. This is a world where you couldn't get away with being an atheist. This is a world where you couldn't possibly justify thinking of Yahweh as anything but perfect in every way. We don't have that. We don't have anything remotely like that. We don't have any effort being put in by any creator trying to make it more like that. We don't have any reason to think any creator actually knew what they were doing or gave a shit about us if they did. If you can't come up with a god and scenario like the one I outlined above, or acknowledge that anything less than that is unacceptable, please shove your entire ideology up your fucking ass. Your entire worldview is a colossal, pathetic, deplorable, laughable failure.

How about this scenario: Live a good, moral life, help & love one another; then see what shakes out on the other side?

It might actually be better than dying a hundred times just to hold Yahweh's hand, and find out what a cad you've been.

Brilliant! Now, go to your local shaman and have him communicate that message all the way to the top manager of your particular stripe of xtianity. Deadpan
If you get to thinking you’re a person of some influence, try ordering somebody else’s dog around.
Reply
#6
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
(June 28, 2017 at 10:59 pm)Fireball Wrote:
(June 28, 2017 at 10:20 pm)ronedee Wrote: How about this scenario: Live a good, moral life, help & love one another; then see what shakes out on the other side?

It might actually be better than dying a hundred times just to hold Yahweh's hand, and find out what a cad you've been.

Brilliant! Now, go to your local shaman and have him communicate that message all the way to the top manager of your particular stripe of xtianity. Deadpan

the top manager is where it comes from gov
Quis ut Deus?
Reply
#7
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
(June 28, 2017 at 9:18 pm)Astonished Wrote: Yahweh creates man and woman with the knowledge of good and evil from the start. He speaks to each and every one of them individually every time they ask; he freezes time, as is well within his power, sits down with them, cuddling them in his arms as he can be large enough to make an adult like a baby in his arms. The warmth of that body should make it feel like your heartbeat can't possibly go lower, you're so at peace in the presence. Any question you have, is immediately given an answer, a comprehensive, non-ambiguous, honest answer. There is no devil to frighten or deceive; there are no angels to make humans feel inferior.

The world in which he has created them resembles the one we know but is free of disease, deformity and any other form of ailment and mental disorder. If a person should happen to die they wake up in their bed the next morning; there is no such thing as an orphan. No child is ever conceived except when the parents have in full knowledge sworn to be exclusive to one another and are trying with intent to have a child. There is never a miscarriage, premature birth, ectopic pregnancy or any other form of complication with a woman; the hymen does not exist and does not bring pain and childbirth is uncomfortable but far easier, perhaps newborns are smaller or human flesh is far more stretchy and malleable.

All human needs are met. A fruit tree will spring up out of nothing is anyone is hungry and has no other way of getting food. Money or bartering economies are nonexistent, they are never even conceived of because everyone is equal in the eyes of Yahweh and no one has any reason to feel jealous because Yahweh does not say he favors any of them, or say that he condemns anyone in particular for doing anything he does not approve of. Yahweh is then justifiably more concerned about these humans praising him and being grateful than with their petty human wickedness if they should choose to fornicate, steal (which wouldn't be necessary, or even practically possible to pull off), kill or whatever else Yahweh forbids.

Yahweh constantly reminds everyone that the reward for obedience, reverence and love (after all, with such a close relationship, how can they possibly fail to do something so simple?) is an eternal life, beyond the set limit of 100 years that he has imposed upon them out of fairness. After all, no one gets sick or dies, not until that counter is up. And he always makes sure that you'll feel comfortable and unafraid when the time comes because he cares. He freezes time and holds your hand as your loved ones look on, and as you leave your body, he walks you up to his paradise where knowledge you could not fathom before, travel to the vast reaches of space, the ability to explore through time forward and backward, a grand adventure that you had to earn by largely giving up a few selfish things while on Earth (after all, all your needs are met, there was little to no risk of anything bad ever happening to you) and just knowing your place beneath Yahweh, who is after all unquestioningly benevolent; the worst person on the planet can't possibly find fault with Yahweh, hard as they try.

Yahweh is also merciful. So, you didn't feel gratitude for all Yahweh gave you, and the promise of wonders after your death failed to impress you? So be it. You will live your life over again, with all of your memories, so that when you are reborn, you will know exactly what the reason is for your failure to do what should have been so simple. The world into which you are reborn is ours; a world full of death, disease, and other horrors by comparison, a world forsaken by Yahweh. You call upon Yahweh as loudly as you can, until your lungs collapse, and you hear nothing, feel nothing, see nothing. Because you forsook Yahweh, you now need to earn back his blessing. You will live this life of suffering, knowing full well it's all your fault and ruing every second how foolish it was to ever be so ungrateful and have so little foresight. But, because you know all that, with absolute certainty, and you have no reason to blame Yahweh for this, and you know the solution, the moment you die in this world, if you've done what you failed to the first time, you get your eternity. It just took you a little longer, but you learned something, because Yahweh understands the importance of critical intelligence.

But what if you become bitter? Foolish once again, even more so, you blame Yahweh for coming up with this unpleasant punishment for you, and upon your death, you wake up once again with all memories of your past two lives. You never lose the opportunity to reflect upon the reality of why this is happening, only this next life is in a similarly awful world, but slightly worse than the last, only just slightly. And once again, you fail to learn your lesson. You wake up in your third life, in a world slightly worse than the last. And again, and again, never reaching a world that is truly in any sense 'hell', but always having that chance at redemption. All it takes is one life lived correctly, and you never forget why and how to do that. You've just lost the privilege of having Yahweh holding your hand the whole time. Should have done it right the first time. But then, with such a stacked deck towards being able to do it right, you really have no excuse for failing, especially more than once.





This would be a world where you could consider life a gift. This would be a world where life would never be compared to a test. This is a world where you couldn't get away with being an atheist. This is a world where you couldn't possibly justify thinking of Yahweh as anything but perfect in every way. We don't have that. We don't have anything remotely like that. We don't have any effort being put in by any creator trying to make it more like that. We don't have any reason to think any creator actually knew what they were doing or gave a shit about us if they did. If you can't come up with a god and scenario like the one I outlined above, or acknowledge that anything less than that is unacceptable, please shove your entire ideology up your fucking ass. Your entire worldview is a colossal, pathetic, deplorable, laughable failure.

This life is a test. it is only a test. If this had been your real life, you would have been given instructions on where to go and what to do.

(June 28, 2017 at 11:03 pm)ronedee Wrote:
(June 28, 2017 at 10:59 pm)Fireball Wrote: Brilliant! Now, go to your local shaman and have him communicate that message all the way to the top manager of your particular stripe of xtianity. Deadpan

the top manager is where it comes from gov

Shit flows downhill, payday is on Friday. Got it. If you take direction only from "above", I pity you.
If you get to thinking you’re a person of some influence, try ordering somebody else’s dog around.
Reply
#8
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
(June 28, 2017 at 11:06 pm)Fireball Wrote:
(June 28, 2017 at 11:03 pm)ronedee Wrote: the top manager is where it comes from gov

Shit flows downhill, payday is on Friday. Got it. If you take direction only from "above", I pity you.

I live on the hilltop, payday is actually Saturday. huh? Thanks for your pity! Someone that xares!  Smile
Quis ut Deus?
Reply
#9
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
Wow, that did not have the intended effect at all.

The point being, if you can't claim that your god is at least at that minimum standard of fairness and goodness, fuck the fuck off with your shit beliefs. If they're not as good as that, they're not good at all. Anything less than that is an unworthy god. Period.

I'm not sure if that came across. That's all I was getting at. You want to claim a god is good, let alone ultimately good, you have to paint at least that good of a picture. No one has ever been able to do that. So if you're not offering that or better, stop trying to make claims about ultimate this or best that, you ain't shit and your god ain't shit. I just invented one better than yours, how's that for ultimate?
Religions were invented to impress and dupe illiterate, superstitious stone-age peasants. So in this modern, enlightened age of information, what's your excuse? Or are you saying with all your advantages, you were still tricked as easily as those early humans?

---

There is no better way to convey the least amount of information in the greatest amount of words than to try explaining your religious views.
Reply
#10
RE: Why would this be so hard to have done?
Oh, well, god is a dick as portrayed in the Big Book of Bullshit.  That much is beyond discusssion.
Reply



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