Climate Change and ecological collapse

[Court Jester]

Prove it. If your're not a meteorologist, I'm not convinced. The snow and ice is only melting away in the areas few people ever visit. When I can wear shorts and a tshirt in september and October in Alaska or we start having major droughts throughout the Midwest year over year, I'll start thinking maybe, but I'm betting that won't happen in our life time.

There's always moisture in the air. Some areas have a drought, and some areas have rivers and lakes over flowing. Give it 5 or 10 years and it's reversed. It's natural Mother Nature. Some people are just willing to agree to change their life and pay for it now.

[The Grand Nudger]

Most people -aren't- willing to change their life at all..but some will buy a product that steps in for whatever guilt they feel or that provides whatever virtue signalling they think is appropriate for their social strata - one of those products being climate science denial, none of that changes the data...which you can go research yourself, at your leisure.

Yes, there's always moisture in the air. There's more when it's hotter, barring effects like desertification. Which is -one- of the reasons that having a bunch of warmer, wetter air mixing with cooler dry air produces stronger storms. This is basic shit. I;m sorry that your own anecdotes are turning on you, but that's what happens when you throw your lot in with the doubt monkeys jester. You fail to realize that what you are describing is predicted by climate change. More extremes, more inclement weather, less predictability. That means big snow, too. When the next drought hits..you'll be here with anecdotes about how you haven't seen all that predicted extra rain. This is why it;s pointless to jump through hoops with you. OFC it's "mother nature"......and when you dump a bunch of greenhouse gas into "mother nature" the natural effect is...wait for it, the greenhouse effect.

Go, let wonder lead you to knowledge.

[Fake Messiah]

We, essentially, have to change everything about human civilization.

What do you mean change everything? The main thing would be to replace all coal and oil power plants with thing like TWR. Then the next pollutant are the cars. Now it doesn't mean that everybody should buy new electric car, people could still keep using their old oil cars, locomotives and airplanes that can be tweaked to use ethanol instead of gas and if you had clean energy resource, like TWR, you can produce ethanol artificially from molecules in the air and water. Sure, cars would still release CO2 but you would only circle around CO2 that is already in the air instead taking "new" deposits from deep within underground. At the same time people could be capturing carbon that is in the air and store it back underground.

[Fake Messiah]

China is 100 times worse than anywhere else but we are more “green”er than we’ve been in the past 100 or so years

Actually even China seem to be trying to do it's part
China Cancels 103 Coal Plants, Mindful of Smog and Wasted Capacity
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/18/world...ution.html

If it was that big of a deal, governments around the world would be losing their minds absolutely requiring companies and people to change.

Even if you say that putting 40 billion tons of CO2 in the atmosphere every year is nothing, you can't tell me that you also deny other problems like total destruction of nature. For instance surface mining of tar sands for oil in Alberta, Canada



not to mention other stuff like oil spills or take Virunga, Africa's oldest national park, a UNESCO World Heritage Site and one of the most bio-diverse areas on the planet. For the past three years Non-governmental organizations are busting their ass driving a major international campaign to stop oil companies drilling in Virunga and the surrounding area. I mean if you want to see how serious this is you can watch a documentary and you can see that oil companies are using their money to create disruptions by organizing wars in surrounding areas. And also other political and economical disruptions that come with oil. Billions of petrodollars are annually draining from US economy to the Saudis who have set up more than twenty thousand radical madrassas around the world to indoctrinate young boys with the idea that the way to paradise is to murder Christians, Jews, Buddhists, Taoists, and Hindus. And yet, as you indicated "governments around the world would be losing their minds" since Trump is selling these people weapons. Is he stupid? He is subsidizing war against himself and people that chose him. I mean why isn't Rex Tillerson doing something about it? Is he also stupid? I want to know. Who will explain it to me?

[Court Jester]

Most people -aren't- willing to change their life at all..but some will buy a product that steps in for whatever guilt they feel or that provides whatever virtue signalling they think is appropriate for their social strata - one of those products being climate science denial, none of that changes the data...which you can go research yourself, at your leisure.

Yes, there's always moisture in the air. There's more when it's hotter, barring effects like desertification. Which is -one- of the reasons that having a bunch of warmer, wetter air mixing with cooler dry air produces stronger storms. This is basic shit. I;m sorry that your own anecdotes are turning on you, but that's what happens when you throw your lot in with the doubt monkeys jester. You fail to realize that what you are describing is predicted by climate change. More extremes, more inclement weather, less predictability. That means big snow, too. When the next drought hits..you'll be here with anecdotes about how you haven't seen all that predicted extra rain. This is why it;s pointless to jump through hoops with you. OFC it's "mother nature"......and when you dump a bunch of greenhouse gas into "mother nature" the natural effect is...wait for it, the greenhouse effect.

Go, let wonder lead you to knowledge.

I respect your opinion, but global warming has been a so called issue for decades. Waves are going to get bigger, the storms are going to get stronger, there’s going to be a complete shut down of agriculture as we know it today, societies will die and suffer on a biblical scale.

Entire ecosystems will be whipped out by 1990… okay, my bad…. 1997…. There were some changes and the new calculation is 2005… well all of humanity will see these issues by 2010.. 2012 at the latest…. Ur…uh… we need more money or there will be cataclysmic events occurring by 2015…. No… I’m serious this time… we need hundreds of billions of dollars or everything I said was previously going to happen will really start to occur by 2020. I mean it this time.

Come on man… Really? How gullible has society gotten? The storms are no worse, the weather is no worse, some areas flood as they sometimes do, some areas don’t as they sometimes wont, no whales, fish, or people are boiling from the sun, and I can see a beautiful green tree line and an 85 acre corn field that is booming with zero irrigation.

To each their own, but “Global warming is going to get us all because I read it on the internet” ranks right up there with someone screaming “Repent. Jesus is coming because I read it in this here book.”

[Fake Messiah]

and I can see a beautiful green tree line and an 85 acre corn field that is booming with zero irrigation

Hey, you better enjoy it while you can

[The Grand Nudger]

Most people -aren't- willing to change their life at all..but some will buy a product that steps in for whatever guilt they feel or that provides whatever virtue signalling they think is appropriate for their social strata - one of those products being climate science denial, none of that changes the data...which you can go research yourself, at your leisure.

Yes, there's always moisture in the air.  There's more when it's hotter, barring effects like desertification.  Which is -one- of the reasons that having a bunch of warmer, wetter air mixing with cooler dry air produces stronger storms.  This is basic shit.  I;m sorry that your own anecdotes are turning on you, but that's what happens when you throw your lot in with the doubt monkeys jester.  You fail to realize that what you are describing is predicted by climate change.  More extremes, more inclement weather, less predictability.  That means big snow, too.  When the next drought hits..you'll be here with anecdotes about how you haven't seen all that predicted extra rain.  This is why it;s pointless to jump through hoops with you.  OFC it's "mother nature"......and when you dump a bunch of greenhouse gas into "mother nature" the natural effect is...wait for it, the greenhouse effect.  

Go, let wonder lead you to knowledge.

I respect your opinion, but global warming has been a so called issue for decades. Waves are going to get bigger, the storms are going to get stronger, there’s going to be a complete shut down of agriculture as we know it today, societies will die and suffer on a biblical scale.  

You don't, and it's not my opinion that we're discussing anyway, so?

Entire ecosystems will be whipped out by 1990…

They were.....

okay, my bad…. 1997….

-and again they were.

There were some changes and the new calculation is 2005… well all of humanity will see these issues by 2010.. 2012 at the latest…. Ur…uh… we need more money or there will be cataclysmic events occurring by 2015…. No… I’m serious this time… we need hundreds of billions of dollars or everything I said was previously going to happen will really start to occur by 2020. I mean it this time.

You do realize that ecosystems being annihilated isn't some thing that will happen in the future, it already has and will continue to do so.  That's what happens when environmental conditions change, regardless of the reason for the change.  

Come on man… Really? How gullible has society gotten? The storms are no worse, the weather is no worse, some areas flood as they sometimes do, some areas don’t as they sometimes wont, no whales, fish, or people are boiling from the sun, and I can see a beautiful green tree line and an 85 acre corn field that is booming with zero irrigation.  

Awfully gullible, clearly, here you are....still bitching and moaning about your doubts based upon the snow you saw on a mountain rather than educating yourself.   

To each their own, but “Global warming is going to get us all because I read it on the internet” ranks right up there with someone screaming “Repent. Jesus is coming because I read it in this here book.”

Strange, I don't recall saying that.  Sounds like the kind of straw that doubt monkeys pull out of their ass rather than addressing the issue of climate change.  Can't imagine how that might end poorly.

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We, essentially, have to change everything about human civilization.

What do you mean change everything? The main thing would be to replace all coal and oil power plants with thing like TWR. Then the next pollutant are the cars. Now it doesn't mean that everybody should buy new electric car, people could still keep using their old oil cars, locomotives and airplanes that can be tweaked to use ethanol instead of gas and if you had clean energy resource, like TWR, you can produce ethanol artificially from molecules in the air and water. Sure, cars would still release CO2 but you would only circle around CO2 that is already in the air instead taking "new" deposits from deep within underground. At the same time people could be capturing carbon that is in the air and store it back underground.

I mean that we have to change those things you mentioned above..and yet more still..as in, everything. Our buildings are wasteful, our cities haphazardly planned, our food systems are a nightmare. Our water use.....suicidal. Our environmental management policies and practices a sham. Our manufacturing processes and materials untenable for any length of time. So, in addition to somehow convincing the world to go nuclear or better, and retrofitting every form of transportation we use, and engaging in mass carbon capture..we have to address those as well. It's not exactly a little job, and there's no part of human civilization that it doesn't touch on. Plopping down a nuke and driving a green car might make people feel better, but it;s not a long term plan for human survival on this rock. Just plopping down the nuke and getting green cars out there is likely to take the rest of my natural life. I'll never even see -that- future. We need to be more aggressive.

[Succubus]

If it was that big of a deal, governments around the world would be losing their minds absolutely requiring companies and people to change. There would be no suggestion or recommendation, they would step in and flat require it.

It’s a non-issue and has as much legitimacy as the bible. There’s proof everywhere for people that want to believe it and those that do will always look down on those that don’t.

Preach on preacher.

I’m not convinced that it’s anything more than a money making racquet.

And I'm convinced that you are a fucking idiot.  Go suck Trump's cock or something.

I'm convinced Min's correct.

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If it was that big of a deal, governments around the world would be losing their minds absolutely requiring companies and people to change. There would be no suggestion or recommendation, they would step in and flat require it...

And they would immediately be voted out of office. Why? Because people don't give a fuck. The consequences of CC will not become evident in their lifetimes so the problem is back heeled for future generations to handle, which by then will be too late. As Vorlon points out, ocean acidification is happening now and is easy to measure, and it can't be denied. It's happening.

I agree profiteering is rife, the CC gravy train is fucking huge. For instance, all wind farms built in the UK are foreign owned, not a fucking penny goes back into the UK economy. That complete bastard Chris Huhne Should be hanged from Marble Arch for high treason

[Fake Messiah]

Entire ecosystems will be whipped out by 1990…

They were.....

Yeah during last 40 years population of wildlife more then halved [source], but it's not visible trough his window which is the key.

in addition to somehow convincing the world to go nuclear or better

Actually going nuclear would be really easy if we're talking TWR or Molten salt reactor. Just take a look at this two and a half minute video to see what I'm talking about
https://openload.co/f/PeAVa8PcOWU/salt_react.mp4

and retrofitting every form of transportation we use

Brazil did it in no time. There all vehicles are flexible-fuel (flex-fuel) vehicles that use both gasoline and ethanol, although their ethanol comes from sugar plants and I'm talking about future in which electricity is clean and cheap enough so that ethanol could be made artificially. It is 19th century chemistry and people could perhaps even have ethanol producing devices in their homes, when the time comes.

engaging in mass carbon capture

But we're talking about seeding the oceans with algae that capture carbon.
http://reveal.uky.edu/algae_part1_howitworks

Plopping down a nuke and driving a green car might make people feel better, but it;s not a long term plan for human survival on this rock.

The worst thing is getting too depressed to do anything about it and even live in denial. It is a good beginning but real clean up will probably come when one day people have fusion, but maybe it could be done before.

[Court Jester]

You don't, and it's not my opinion that we're discussing anyway, so?

Oh, but I do. It’s simply the liberal defense mechanism that pops up and points the finger with unfounded personal accusations that helps a liberal feel better about themselves and their argument. It’s a commonly accepted debate tactic among liberals. It’s the “you don’t agree with me so you don’t respect me” us-against- them mentality. But that’s okay. I still respect your opinion. And it is only an opinion.

this Nobel Prize winning scientist would call it simply an opinion. And a bad opinion at that....
http://www.climatedepot.com/2015/07/06/n...l-warming/

This one is actually a really good read too.
http://www.climatedepot.com/2014/09/23/p...l-warming/

Lemmings… lemmings one and all.