Homophobia. A misleading label

[DeistPaladin]

What?? No where in your examples did you list any behaviors that would be considered a 'phobia' in the clinical sense. Even the fella who said he had a fear of being raped by homos, as you pointed out, has rape anxiety, not a fear of the homos themselves.

But he has no such anxiety or obsessions with women sexually assaulting him. It was always the topic of homosexuality that set off such expressions.

Imagine if you will that any time the discussion over guns came up or this guy was in the same room with a gun, he began without being asked to express deep anxiety over being shot and wanted to get away from the gun. I would call that an disproportionate or inappropriate fear of guns. Would you say, "no, no, that's just an inappropriate fear of being shot." This seems a distinction without a difference.

The reactions of all three examples demonstrate inappropriate fears of being sexually assaulted. Even the second example, with his frothing diatribe over how he "doesn't swing that way" when nobody propositioned him or asked him, demonstrates an inappropriate fear.

Phobias cause and are normally associated with dysfunction and unpleasant anxieties. My sexual prejudice does not inhibit my 'function' and causes no anxieties. Uncomfortable in their presence maybe, but a long way from anxiety and not being able to function.

Phobias come in varying degrees of intensity but what distinguishes them from appropriate fears is on how real the danger is. If a gay man is stalking you, it's appropriate to fear for your safety. If you just happen to be in the presence of a gay man, it's not appropriate to have feelings of anxiety. I'm not sure what you mean by "uncomfortable" but that may be just a mild anxiety and therefore, at best, a mild phobia.

I can't read your mind and don't know you like I know the first two examples I mentioned. I will say I'm having trouble understanding what you mean when you say, "not anxiety, just uncomfortable around them" or "I don't hate, I just dislike". Perhaps you could elaborate?

[Skipper]

While knowledge is power, ignorance is strength.

I used to be wary of the gays, then I counseled one. And found he was just like any other guy. Tautological statement is tautological.

I find it amazing that people need first hand proof that "they are like any other guy"! I don't see what people expect, constant groping? Discussions of nothing but interior design? the constant smell of bumming?

I assume you're either from a different country or different era. Same goes to original poster, get over it man, your clear disliking of homosexuals for no reason other than that they are homosexual is exactly what homophobia is, dissect the word as much as you like and try and convince yourself you're not as much as you like but it's a horrible prejudice regardless of what you want to label it.

[Cerrone]

LOL

This thread is hysterical! We're all bisexual, we're all bisexual... we're all bisexual. The world evolved bisexual as a matter of fact.. in countless societies men would fuck other men if they felt like it, and they had wives at the same time to produce children.

What's wrong with that?

Fuck your same-sex friends if you're so inclined, but it doesnt mean you can't still partner up with a member of the opposite sex and spawn some kids.

If you'll notice, it's monogamous marriage and partnerships that cause infinitely more problems than simple gay/straight tension.

Anyways.. as for "mens fear of being gay raped by gays" is as about as ridiculously self-important as a severely ugly woman acting out around men accusing them of "eyeing her or harrassing her" simply to get attention and make herself look better....

(btw i like the 4horsemen pic so much i'm going to include it in this post for no reason whatsoever)

[HeyItsZeus]

I don't give a shit about what goes up another guys ass. I don't care! If your gay...be gay! Screw the holy books.

[Anomalocaris]

Some of the nastiest toughs from history were bisexual or homosexual. The Spartans from perhaps the most pure warrior culture in history conceded the need to procreate, but otherwise deemed hetrosexuality unworthy and homosexuality the only fit orientation for a warrior. Japanese Samurais were very disproportionately homosexual, and so were the Mongols. Part of the terror of the Mongol conquest was the legend that the Mongol sodomized all prisoner of war as matter of policy. Alexander the Great was very much more on the homosexual side of bisexuality. Other than his mother he seemingly dealt with women for political reasons only. Caesar might be more hetrosexual than homosexual, but long before Cleopatra he did not shy from sexual dalliance with a King Mithradates to get what he wanted.

So maybe homophobes are aware of their relative inadaquacies and have good reason to fear homosexuals.

And looking at the behavior descibed in the NT as a whole, I'll be a monkey's uncle if the "son of god" didn't not suffer severely from repressed homosexuality amongst other what might be called emotional issues and sexual deviances.

[Cerrone]

Some of the nastiest toughs from history were bisexual or homosexual. The Spartans from perhaps the most pure warrior culture in history conceded the need to procreate, but otherwise deemed hetrosexuality unworthy and homosexuality the only fit orientation for a warrior. Japanese Samurais were very disproportionately homosexual, and so were the Mongols. Part of the terror of the Mongol conquest was the legend that the Mongol sodomized all prisoner of war as matter of policy. Alexander the Great was very much more on the homosexual side of bisexuality. Other than his mother he seemingly dealt with women for political reasons only. Caesar might be more hetrosexual than homosexual, but long before Cleopatra he did not shy from sexual dalliance with a King Mithradates to get what he wanted.

So maybe homophobes are aware of their relative inadaquacies and have good reason to fear homosexuals.

Hahaha maybe maybe

I can't really think of many Roman or Greek leaders or figures who werent bisexual, but it was very common up until the damn christians spoiled everyones fun by forcing people to committ to pairing off with each other in the long term.

Interesting sidenote though, the Romans considered "lust" for a man to have for a women or for a man to chase after women socially to be an effeminate quality, and was frowned upon. I believe this was the case with the Hellenes as well, although perhaps not the weirdo Athenians.

Anyway, those guys weren't "nasty toughs" they were heroic visionary men, far better examples of humanity than you'd probably see in your entire lifetime.

No 'fence

[DeistPaladin]

We're all bisexual

Depends on how you define that term. I believe, and research has shown, that it's more a matter of bisexual shades of gray, more a scale than two or three different camps.

If you're using a purist definition of heterosexuality, as our society does, then I would agree only a minority would fit that description. How the bell curve would actually look if you could plot the sexual orientations of the entire population is yet to be discovered. Many self-identified heterosexuals may be bisexual. Using the lust-into-envy formula, it's easy for one who's bi to conform to strict heterosexuality and even fool themselves in the process (really easily done, trust me). Our society is going to have to get a lot more comfortable with same-gender affections before we can actually discover the truth of the matter.

Anyways.. as for "mens fear of being gay raped by gays" is as about as ridiculously self-important as a severely ugly woman acting out around men accusing them of "eyeing her or harrassing her" simply to get attention and make herself look better....

I cited two examples of extreme cases of homophobia that I've personally known. It probably won't surprise you that the two are also among the fattest and ugliest guys I've known.

[The Omnissiunt One]

I think I've heard that only about 5% of the population is on either end (totally straight or totally gay). For many men, the homosexual impulse probbly only comes in extreme circumstances, like in prison, when deprived of female contact for a long time.

[Anomalocaris]

I can't really think of many Roman or Greek leaders or figures who werent bisexual, but it was very common up until the damn christians spoiled everyones fun by forcing people to committ to pairing off with each other in the long term.

That is probably true. In many ancient societies, like those of the Romans, Greeks, Japanese, etc, the relationship between a husband and wife is suppose to be purely an arranged platonic partnership designed to help keep house, give birth and tie the interests of respective families together. Hetrosexual orientation and chummy intergender romantics is not needed long as the partners get along and produce children. In fact excessive devotion by men to women was thought to soften men, make women uppity, and generally erode martial virtues of the society. Homosexuality amongst men is thought to preserve purity of martial virtue in much the same way incent is thought to maintain the purity of the royal blood. Homosexuality amongst women is thought to keep women distracted and not nag the men too much.

[Existentialist]

Attack the poster , not the opinion

Sorry. As it happens I know a good old-time remedy for your homophobia, but you must follow the instructions very carefully -

1. Pitch tent
2. Await cowboy

Do this, and I guarantee that within 12 hours your homophobia will be completely cured!