Who do you want to be the Democratic nominee in 2020?

[CapnAwesome]

Simplest explanation is the best.  I'd be annoyed with Warren regardless of who informed me.

Elizabeth's options are 2:

(1) refute Trump, 23 and Me can do it easy enough, I'd even pay for it as I would love to help refute Trumply

Has done.

(2) give the money back, apologize and accept responsibility/consequences

What money....lol?


You....watch.....too....much....Fox. Still love ya though, bro.

She embraced family stories of cherokee heritage..and hey, heritage and tribal citizenship are different things, which she's acknowledged and apologized for..which, honestly..probably means black....nevertheless.....this was literally the rightwing inventing something to be racist shitwads about, lol.

Elizabeth Warren said that she perfered her family story to finding out the truth. I can only hope she doesn't apply that kind of thinking to politics.

[Minimalist]

Any kind of thinking is better than the Orange Shitgibbon's methods.

[Tiberius]

Not positive what he's talking about, but it could be that she's a super white lady pretending to be native American. I think she said she didn't want to take a DNA test to find out the truth because she perfered the story her parents told her.

Now none of that has anything to do with policy, but it does make her seem pretty goofy.

I'm not sure how she's "pretending to be native American". As far as I can recall, she claimed it back in the 90's by registering as a minority in some law school directory. She explained it by saying her family would tell stories about their native American heritage. She doesn't pretend to be native American on a day to day basis, if you asked her she would probably say she was caucasian. It literally never mattered for 20 years until someone dragged it up and made a big deal out of it, which in all honestly it isn't. If she's not claiming it regularly I'm not sure why it even matters.

Vor, you watch too much Fox, lol.

Simplest explanation is the best. I'd be annoyed with Warren regardless of who informed me.

Elizabeth's options are 2:

(1) refute Trump, 23 and Me can do it easy enough, I'd even pay for it as I would love to help refute Trumply

(2) give the money back, apologize and accept responsibility/consequences


Digging in heels and twisting in the wind on this issue is not acceptable. Period.

Can you answer my question? What gaffe, what's this about money? What does she need to apologize and accept responsibility / consequences about? I'm genuinely confused. Senator Warren is my senator and I have literally no idea what you are talking about.

Elizabeth Warren said that she perfered her family story to finding out the truth. I can only hope she doesn't apply that kind of thinking to politics.

Why would she? Personal identity /family history and legislative decision making are entirely different things. At the end of the day, finding out her actual heritage doesn't matter to her, clearly. For some bizarre reason it matters to a load of people who seem to bring it up all the time despite it serving nothing more than a distraction.

[vorlon13]

Seems to be some difficulty amongst the 'right thinking folks' that for Trumply to get 'clobbered' he has to be emasculated to a degree even his ardent supporters will start to waver. Dems keep playing to their base and ignoring the Trumply voters they need to sway instead.

Regardless of the merits or demerits of the odious 'Pocahantas thing' Trump's base laps it up when ever he employs it. Of course the Dems on Warren's side are already convinced the charge is specious. Trump's crew ISN'T, and THEY are the ones needing dissuasion of the notion.

Warren failed, IMO, to nuke the issue early on, either via the profoundly cheap 23 and Me expediency, or acknowledging her error, regardless of how she fell into it, so as to take it off the campaign talking points list of the other side.

I'm concerned playing to their base, a seemingly obvious goof, is damaging Dem candidates when the focus should be on the swing voters and taking accurate points to the Trump camp and rubbing their noses in it, instead of vice versa. Dems don't need to be convinced, the undecided and the Trumply-ites do.

And for folks feeling Trump supporters are beyond redemption/reason, I'm certainly not seeing that around here. At the rural level, Trump placards and signs left up prominenetly after the election are gone, you'd have to really hunt to find a confederate flag anywhere, and even local watering holes are seeing an absence of Trump diehards still spouting off. The inevitability of either a self inflicted presidential disaster, or impeachment, resignation and/or declining to run for re-election is dawning on many now. Trump could claim in the run up to 2020 he has accomplished all he wanted in his first term and endorse Pence, and that would be that. Nice escape hatch, a 'peace with honor' ploy we've seen before, but would still work.

[Tiberius]

Regardless of the merits or demerits of the odious 'Pocahantas thing' Trump's base laps it up when ever he employs it. Of course the Dems on Warren's side are already convinced the charge is specious. Trump's crew ISN'T, and THEY are the ones needing dissuasion of the notion.

Warren failed, IMO, to nuke the issue early on, either via the profoundly cheap 23 and Me expediency, or acknowledging her error, regardless of how she fell into it, so as to take it off the campaign talking points list of the other side.

Do you honestly believe the right would stop using it if she acknowledged her error? No, they'd double down. Heck, even if she is part native, and the test came back positive, they would in all likelihood cry "fake news" and keep going on about it. Where have you been the past 2 years? Truth doesn't matter to these people, winning by any means necessary matters to them. Trump literally just made up a quote from Obama and used it at a rally. He'll do the same thing with any Democratic candidate he faces in 2020.

Dems should focus on the issues that matter to voters.

And for folks feeling Trump supporters are beyond redemption/reason, I'm certainly not seeing that around here. At the rural level, Trump placards and signs left up prominenetly after the election are gone, you'd have to really hunt to find a confederate flag anywhere, and even local watering holes are seeing an absence of Trump diehards still spouting off. The inevitability of either a self inflicted presidential disaster, or impeachment, resignation and/or declining to run for re-election is dawning on many now. Trump could claim in the run up to 2020 he has accomplished all he wanted in his first term and endorse Pence, and that would be that. Nice escape hatch, a 'peace with honor' ploy we've seen before, but would still work.

I'm not sure you can rely on yard signs at this point in a term. He's certainly lost support, but his core remains because he's doing everything to appease them. Unfortunately we won't know exactly how much support he's lost until the 2020 election is over.

[The Grand Nudger]

The ironic bit is that she did acknowledge that heritage and tribal citizenship are not the same thing, and apologized for the gaffe..despite not having received any money or any hiring preference on account of it..ever.

OFC the Trumpsters base laps it up, though.  They're super "economically anxious" about it. The rights actual gripe is with affirmative action in general..and thats what makes the joke funny. Haha, get it, get it?

In any case, I wouldn't put too much stock in missing yard signs and confederate bric a brac..these are people who routinely lied their asses off to pollsters and their spouses, after all.

[Mister Agenda]

I'm always surprised in polls like this when Kamala Harris doesn't even make to one of the specified choices.

[CapnAwesome]

Not positive what he's talking about, but it could be that she's a super white lady pretending to be native American. I think she said she didn't want to take a DNA test to find out the truth because she perfered the story her parents told her.

Now none of that has anything to do with policy, but it does make her seem pretty goofy.

I'm not sure how she's "pretending to be native American". As far as I can recall, she claimed it back in the 90's by registering as a minority in some law school directory. She explained it by saying her family would tell stories about their native American heritage. She doesn't pretend to be native American on a day to day basis, if you asked her she would probably say she was caucasian. It literally never mattered for 20 years until someone dragged it up and made a big deal out of it, which in all honestly it isn't. If she's not claiming it regularly I'm not sure why it even matters.

Simplest explanation is the best. I'd be annoyed with Warren regardless of who informed me.

Elizabeth's options are 2:

(1) refute Trump, 23 and Me can do it easy enough, I'd even pay for it as I would love to help refute Trumply

(2) give the money back, apologize and accept responsibility/consequences


Digging in heels and twisting in the wind on this issue is not acceptable. Period.

Can you answer my question? What gaffe, what's this about money? What does she need to apologize and accept responsibility / consequences about? I'm genuinely confused. Senator Warren is my senator and I have literally no idea what you are talking about.

Elizabeth Warren said that she perfered her family story to finding out the truth. I can only hope she doesn't apply that kind of thinking to politics.

Why would she? Personal identity /family history and legislative decision making are entirely different things. At the end of the day, finding out her actual heritage doesn't matter to her, clearly. For some bizarre reason it matters to a load of people who seem to bring it up all the time despite it serving nothing more than a distraction.

I hope she wouldn't, but likely most people who use a line of thinking for one thing use the same way of thinking for others. She doesn't really strike me as someone who questions her own ideas, but I don't know for certain.

Are you telling me that statement doesn't give you any sort of pause?

[The Grand Nudger]

The Globe did a big writeup about this, not but 10 days ago.

The Globe examined hundreds of documents, many of them never before available, and reached out to all 52 of the law professors who are still living and were eligible to be in that Pound Hall room at Harvard Law School. Some are Warren’s allies. Others are not. Thirty-one agreed to talk to the Globe — including the law professor who was, at the time, in charge of recruiting minority faculty. 

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nation/...story.html

It was a deep enough dive to get around to the issue of why warren become so invested in the stories of her heritage, and why she's really never going to give a shit about what the howler monkeys have to say on the subject.

Warren said she had always identified closely with her mother’s side of the family: a sprawling and rowdy group with scant resources who looked after one another, and who, according to family lore, have Cherokee and Delaware blood.

When her grandmother died in 1969, Warren’s mother and three aunts led the family and further impressed on her their proud Cherokee connection.

Then in the late 1980s, around the time that Warren began identifying professionally as Native American, she began losing them, too. Her aunt Mae Reed Masterson died in October 1989. Her aunt Alice Ann Reed Carnes died in August 1990. That left her mother and her aunt Bess Veneck, (aka Aunt Bee), who lived with Warren and helped her raise her children.

Warren’s “Aunt Bee” — Bess Veneck — moved in with the Warren family and helped raise her children. She’s pictured here on Easter 1981 with Amelia Warren, 9, and Alex Warren, 4.
Warren campaign

“The two women in my life who have always been my guides through the world began to focus even more on the past,” Warren explained.

[DLJ]

Warren is  too old.  So is Sanders, Biden, and Kerry.

Time to stop trotting out these wheezing old war horses.

Over here we just ousted our corrupt oligarchy by electing a 92-year-old. Much rejoicing in the streets.

Bernie's too young for the job.

---

Lol @ Hillary Clinton leading the poll.

Yes, apparently it's not enough that she lost the last two elections. People think she still stands a chance. She couldn't win with the DC propping her up, so how do they expect her to win now?

It's a 'monarchy' mentality.

US politics is a bit like Manchester football. Red or blue.

And those two teams get to set the rules for everyone else. Including who gets anointed queen.

Listening to US political pundits, it's assumed that 'Independents' are somewhere between the two parties. To me it seems like the Indies want to play a different sport.

It's two power-families like York and Lancaster (or Stark and Lannister) or the Montagues and the Capulets

"A plague on both their houses."