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RE: Ecology topic
September 29, 2019 at 12:21 pm
(This post was last modified: September 29, 2019 at 12:29 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
OFC I'm a "nature guy"...but I'm also a realist.
The benefits of fossil fuel consumption are undeniable. There is at least some of that benefit that's non negotiable, yes. It is ludicrous to imagine that the majority of the worlds population, which hasn't fully availed itself of those benefits, won't. It's similarly ludicrous to imagine a government so high minded and selfless as to just pass on those benefits, waiting for some other solution which doesn't exist and will still need to be deployed whenever we come up with it, if ever. While other governments gleefully plow through whatever fossil fuel they can hoover up, ofc.
In the developed world (I hope) fossil fuel consumption is going to be drastically reduced. It will increase in the developing world - partly because of it's utility, and partly because of the greater availability of the resource as we consume a smaller share of it. Unless we can offer them some way to reach those development milestones that we burned through oil for - this will all be well meaning hypocrisy in the face of real human need. I think we need to understand that. To temper our expectations to reality. All we have planned now, is shuffling patterns of consumption around. I suppose, in our dreams, of being able to say "Wasn't us, we didn't do it, we stopped!".
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Ecology topic
September 29, 2019 at 3:35 pm
(This post was last modified: September 29, 2019 at 3:36 pm by Fake Messiah.)
(September 29, 2019 at 12:21 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: It's similarly ludicrous to imagine a government so high minded and selfless as to just pass on those benefits,
Well, maybe that government doesn't have the money to pay for oil subsidies. The thing is that oil is not so beneficial, I mean on page 2 of this topic you have an article how oil subsidies cost $5.2 trillion in just one year and then add all the wars for oil, and that gas and oil enrich and give power to countries like Saudi Arabia and Russia.
Plus it may be beneficial to you but what about all the people who get dumped on by your plastic garbage? Shouldn't you be at least actively advocating for the solution?
(September 29, 2019 at 12:21 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: waiting for some other solution which doesn't exist and will still need to be deployed whenever we come up with it, if ever.
And is the right way what Trump's administration is doing by actively going against the progress?
I'm not saying that everything should stop until 'that new thing arrives' but rather that governments suffice or meet with the progress. Like perhaps how China made a deal with Gates, why couldn't someone else do it too? Or I guess in ideal world government would develop TWR technology like they did the atom bomb and radar invisible technology and similar.
I mean if innovation is left to private sector and these kind of technologies cost a lot to develop and then they need someone to sell it to, then it rather seems like a vicious circle, especially with oil lobbies going around that even gas emissions regulations seem "controversial".
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Ecology topic
September 29, 2019 at 6:59 pm
(This post was last modified: September 29, 2019 at 7:01 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
An ideal world would do many things differently than this one. Are we discussing how an ideal world would handle climate change, or how this world will handle climate change?
(I'd love to advocate for a solution, just as soon as what I'm working on is a credible solution rather than a niche marketing program. You'll never hear the end of it, lol. )
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Ecology topic
September 30, 2019 at 11:28 am
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Ecology topic
September 30, 2019 at 11:50 am
(This post was last modified: September 30, 2019 at 11:56 am by The Grand Nudger.)
I'm not sure we're having the same conversation. I'm talking about addressing climate change, not just shifting patterns of consumption in the first world, and turning the sahara into a rain forest explodes into your mind as a credible thing that we could get anyone to do? If we irrigated the sahara (we wont), we would turn it into cropland. Even more probably livestock.
In any case, by all means, get into a business based on the tech that you think is cool. That's how this gets fixed. That's the takeaway, for me, about our less than serious response to climate change.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Ecology topic
September 30, 2019 at 12:30 pm
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RE: Ecology topic
September 30, 2019 at 3:10 pm
(This post was last modified: September 30, 2019 at 3:16 pm by Succubus.)
It's amazing 'science' always seems to 'find' whatever it is funded for, and never the oppsite. Drich.
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RE: Ecology topic
October 9, 2019 at 7:47 am
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Ecology topic
October 9, 2019 at 8:51 am
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RE: Ecology topic
October 11, 2019 at 4:30 pm
Since forests are burning down maybe this is our only hope
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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