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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 12:51 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 12:43 pm)LastPoet Wrote: Well, they are. If they believe in a god that's theism. Even if its an impersonal not meddling god. I refer you to the second law of thought as in:
Deists believe in a god.
Deists are not theists. Theists are the general definition of god believers of any kind.
P -> ~P
Yeah weird one. I think Avicenna was the one that said to those that defy the second law: "I shall punch you in the face and not punch you in the face to know the difference" 
ETA: its like someone saying "I am an atheist and believe in god.
If your definition of theism is a belief in any kind of god, then deists are a type of theist.
Though, I really think that arguing definitions is beside the point. Unless we're all pretending to be unclear on what one another is talking about, we know what comes to mind when we think of "theist" and "deist." Usually, they're two quite different pictures. Arguing semantics can get pretty silly. Soon enough we'll be arguing the definition of the word 'definition.'
If you're frightened of dying, and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away. But if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the Earth.
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 1:16 pm
(This post was last modified: September 19, 2019 at 1:16 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Nope. Believing in a god is not theism. Theism requires that you believe in more than just a god.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 1:20 pm
Yep.
"Theism is broadly defined as the belief in the existence of the Supreme Being or deities"
If you're frightened of dying, and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away. But if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the Earth.
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 1:20 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 1:16 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Nope. Believing in a god is not theism. Theism requires that you believe in more than just a god.
I tend to disagree, but I don't care enough to discuss the topic.
So, carry on...
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 1:23 pm
Same. Arguing the definitions is beside the point.
The vast majority of us get a different picture in our heads when we hear 'theist' than when we hear 'deist.'
But gae really likes to argue. I'm sure that doesn't affect his personal life at all. Lol.
If you're frightened of dying, and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away. But if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the Earth.
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 1:23 pm
You can disagree....but it's just a matter of accuracy.
Some people believe in a god. Other people believe in a personal god who intervenes.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 5:26 pm
As a theist, I would define my theism specifically as a belief in a transcendent and immanent creative force(s) for the universe. My Christianity is a more specific definition and doesn't relate to the conversation. Please, continue, don't mind me.
"There ought to be a term that would designate those who actually follow the teachings of Jesus, since the word 'Christian' has been largely divorced from those teachings, and so polluted by fundamentalists that it has come to connote their polar opposite: intolerance, vindictive hatred, and bigotry." -- Philip Stater, Huffington Post
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 5:29 pm
(This post was last modified: September 19, 2019 at 5:29 pm by The Grand Nudger.)
Your christianity relates, very much..but ok, fuck it, whatever...... Your chrisatianity is trivial.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 6:34 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 10:54 am)Gae Bolga Wrote: Good catch, I didn't see that. Plainly wrong, but I can understand why a catholic would get that item wrong in that way.
I'm curious what you mean by this, exactly.
If theism requires faith, and atheism is a lack of faith: deists claim to acknowledge a causally necessary being with no faith or revelation, so on that score, it isn't a kind of theism but a kind of atheism, unless atheism means more than just a lack of faith.
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RE: Why not deism?
September 19, 2019 at 6:44 pm
(This post was last modified: September 19, 2019 at 6:46 pm by chimp3.)
Inqwizitor:
"If theism requires faith, and atheism is a lack of faith: deists claim to acknowledge a causally necessary being with no faith or revelation, so on that score, it isn't a kind of theism but a kind of atheism, unless atheism means more than just a lack of faith."
Atheism is a lack of belief in god(s). Atheists could still have faith in something, faith being a belief unsupported by evidence. Not all atheists are sceptics.
God thinks it's fun to confuse primates. Larsen's God!
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