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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 2:59 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 12:20 pm)Lek Wrote: (September 19, 2019 at 9:24 am)zebo-the-fat Wrote: No, it's a simple question, where was he/she/it?
God existed as an immaterial being at that point and then "became" the universe. I'm relating this as I understand the pantheists' point of view to be.
Ok, god existed as an immaterial being (whatever that means) but it does not answer the question of where it existed
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 3:05 pm
Well, I asked a question and I received many answers. My reasons and evidence are not what you're looking for. I think you're all living in a little box, which you feel secure in, but it won't allow to explore the entirety of existence. I don't have any other evidence that you will accept so okay.
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 3:09 pm
Is that what you think? Good for you.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 3:23 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote: ...it won't allow to explore the entirety of existence. Being pompous does not make up for a lack of arguments 
Cetero censeo religionem delendam esse
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 3:25 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote: . I think you're all living in a little box, which you feel secure in,
Yeah a real perpetual Christmas morning that atheism is. I mean in one post theists accuse us to be depressed because of atheism, but in another they declare atheism to be safe and comfortable place.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 3:26 pm
(This post was last modified: September 19, 2019 at 3:38 pm by Objectivist.)
(September 19, 2019 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote: Well, I asked a question and I received many answers. My reasons and evidence are not what you're looking for. I think you're all living in a little box, which you feel secure in, but it won't allow to explore the entirety of existence. I don't have any other evidence that you will accept so okay.
Lek,
A rational person would not expect anyone to accept what you've presented as evidence. Evidence has to be verifiable. If it isn't it's not evidence. You should seriously check your premises and ask yourself if you have any intellectual right to use the concepts reason and evidence. Or truth. What fundamental premises do these ideas rest on and what does your own philosophy's position on these fundamentals amount to? Is there a conflict? You seem to want to lash out at us for not accepting your "evidence" as if the problem is with us and not what you've presented. But that is just a rationalization.
(September 19, 2019 at 2:33 pm)Gae Bolga Wrote: Why is it a stolen concept? Because the concept "evidence" rests logically on the axioms of existence, consciousness and identity and their corollary the primacy of existence. The notion of a God is a wholesale rejection of these truths. It's like standing on the 6th floor of a building while demolishing the foundation and expecting the sixth floor to remain standing apart from its foundation. It can't be done.
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 3:45 pm
Human beings have a major superiority complex. They imagine themselves important. Surely then, if humans are so fucking special, then they must have a purpose. That purpose must have been drawn out by the ultimate power in existence. Therefore god did it.
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 4:34 pm
(This post was last modified: September 19, 2019 at 6:15 pm by Simon Moon.)
(September 19, 2019 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote: Well, I asked a question and I received many answers. My reasons and evidence are not what you're looking for. I think you're all living in a little box, which you feel secure in, but it won't allow to explore the entirety of existence. I don't have any other evidence that you will accept so okay.
Yes, we are looking for the same kinds of evidence you probably also ask for, in all other aspects of your life. Demonstrable evidence and reasoned argument.
If you have cancer, would you accept medicine that is only supported by the feelings of the person selling it to you, that they really, really feel it works? Or would you require evidence?
I am willing to accept the truth of any claim that meets its burden of proof. My mind is open. I am fully willing to explore all of existence. How is that living in a box?
Funny thing is, those that believe in: astrology, homeopathy, crystal healing, Tarot card reading, aura reading, energetic healing, bigfoot, Chupacabra, etc, etc, might accuse you of living in a box, for the same reasons you are accusing us of same.
You'd believe if you just opened your heart" is a terrible argument for religion. It's basically saying, "If you bias yourself enough, you can convince yourself that this is true." If religion were true, people wouldn't need faith to believe it -- it would be supported by good evidence.
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 5:00 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote: Well, I asked a question and I received many answers. My reasons and evidence are not what you're looking for. I think you're all living in a little box, which you feel secure in, but it won't allow to explore the entirety of existence. I don't have any other evidence that you will accept so okay.
Okay, wow.
What exactly makes you think that you having personal revelation from god should be considered convincing enough for us to accept that as credible evidence for god?
You know what's interesting about people claiming to communicate with god? It's always religious people who claim to do so. Isn't that strange? It would be one thing if all over the world, regardless of race, religion, family background, age or gender, people were just constantly having revelations from "god." This might be something we would want to look into, and might help us shape a more coherent idea about what god is and how it operates. Might.
But one guy named Lek on the internet? C'mon. You don't really buy your own argument, do you?
If you're frightened of dying, and you're holding on, you'll see devils tearing your life away. But if you've made your peace, then the devils are really angels, freeing you from the Earth.
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RE: Evidence for Believing
September 19, 2019 at 6:07 pm
(September 19, 2019 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote: Well, I asked a question and I received many answers. My reasons and evidence are not what you're looking for. I think you're all living in a little box, which you feel secure in, but it won't allow to explore the entirety of existence. I don't have any other evidence that you will accept so okay.
That's as maybe. Personally, I don't insist on evidence for God. I'd be perfectly happy with a convincing argument (although I don't hold out much hope for that, either).
Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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