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[Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
#1
[Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
This verse from the Quran is very well known,


Quote:Sura 2, The Quan:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#...rans=en_sh

( 256 )   There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.

Taghut = disbelief

The verse can't be clearer: isn't this identical to the secular rule that prevents the enforcing of belief on anybody?

Freedom of belief is guaranteed in Islam under the protection of this verse. The Quran is God's word; so no Muslim has the right to cross it.
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#2
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
Freedom to be a second class citizen, at best..and you know this. So, no, it's not identical to our secular rules. Back to the drawing board with your barbaric superstitions.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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#3
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
(March 11, 2020 at 3:37 am)WinterHold Wrote: Freedom of belief is guaranteed in Islam under the protection of this verse. The Quran is God's word; so no Muslim has the right to cross it.
Thats why jews and christians always were second class citizens in the islamic world?
Thats why they had to pay extra taxes? "You are free to believe whatever you want.....if you can afford it, of course"
Cetero censeo religionem delendam esse
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#4
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
(March 11, 2020 at 4:30 am)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Freedom to be a second class citizen, at best..and you know this.  So, no, it's not identical to our secular rules.  Back to the drawing board with your barbaric superstitions.

No. The verse is super clear.
Imperialistic racist phrases like "first and second class citizens" don't belong to what the Quran teaches; but to what European imperialism brought and spread -and the proxies of it-.

(March 11, 2020 at 5:16 am)Deesse23 Wrote:
(March 11, 2020 at 3:37 am)WinterHold Wrote: Freedom of belief is guaranteed in Islam under the protection of this verse. The Quran is God's word; so no Muslim has the right to cross it.
Thats why jews and christians always were second class citizens in the islamic world?
Thats why they had to pay extra taxes? "You are free to believe whatever you want.....if you can afford it, of course"

Where do you bring your information from ? Disney's Aladin ?

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#5
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
Some of us get it from the Quran:

'Fight those who believe not in God and in the Last Day, and who do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden, and who follow not the Religion of Truth among those who were given the Book, till they pay the jizyah with a willing hand, being humbled.' (9:29)

Jizyah here is clearly intended to humiliate non-Muslims.  Further, it makes it obvious that the tax isn't really paid 'with a willing hand' as Muslims are enjoined to fight non-Muslims until they pay up.

In other cultures, it's referred to as a 'protection racket'.

'No compulsion in religion', my bony Irish arse.

Boru
‘Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.’ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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#6
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
The real question here, is why a faithful muslim is trying to purchase secular goods.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
#7
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
(March 11, 2020 at 5:40 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Some of us get it from the Quran:

'Fight those who believe not in God and in the Last Day, and who do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden, and who follow not the Religion of Truth among those who were given the Book, till they pay the jizyah with a willing hand, being humbled.' (9:29)

Jizyah here is clearly intended to humiliate non-Muslims.  Further, it makes it obvious that the tax isn't really paid 'with a willing hand' as Muslims are enjoined to fight non-Muslims until they pay up.

In other cultures, it's referred to as a 'protection racket'.

'No compulsion in religion', my bony Irish arse.

Boru

No; this was said the context of sura 9, which spoke clearly about the war that broke out between Muslims and the polytheists along with the Christian and Jewish tribes that were allies with the polytheists against Mohammed.

This is not a general verse like the one in the OP.

On the other hand, here is a general verse:

Quote:Sura 2, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#...rans=en_sh

( 190 )   Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.


Humiliation of enemies belongs to those who say "torture works" on T.V, or those who use waterboarding to humiliate their enemies.
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#8
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
Retconning your religion and it's employment by the faithful. Go right ahead. Is islam just not good enough as it is and was? Does it need your improvement, or the improvement of secular values?

I would obviously agree, but I wonder if you even realize that this is what you're doing?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
#9
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
(March 11, 2020 at 6:05 am)WinterHold Wrote:
(March 11, 2020 at 5:40 am)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: Some of us get it from the Quran:

'Fight those who believe not in God and in the Last Day, and who do not forbid what God and His Messenger have forbidden, and who follow not the Religion of Truth among those who were given the Book, till they pay the jizyah with a willing hand, being humbled.' (9:29)

Jizyah here is clearly intended to humiliate non-Muslims.  Further, it makes it obvious that the tax isn't really paid 'with a willing hand' as Muslims are enjoined to fight non-Muslims until they pay up.

In other cultures, it's referred to as a 'protection racket'.

'No compulsion in religion', my bony Irish arse.

Boru

No; this was said the context of sura 9, which spoke clearly about the war that broke out between Muslims and the polytheists along with the Christian and Jewish tribes that were allies with the polytheists against Mohammed.

This is not a general verse like the one in the OP.

On the other hand, here is a general verse:

Quote:Sura 2, The Quran:
https://quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en#...rans=en_sh

( 190 )   Fight in the way of Allah those who fight you but do not transgress. Indeed. Allah does not like transgressors.


Humiliation of enemies belongs to those who say "torture works" on T.V, or those who use waterboarding to humiliate their enemies.

The lengths you go to in order to show that Quran doesn't mean what it says makes me think you might be a closet Christian.  You're certainly behaving like one.

Boru
‘Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted.’ Ralph Waldo Emerson
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#10
RE: [Quranic Reflection]: There shall be no compulsion in the acceptance of religion
Meh, the way forward for Islam for now is for them to cherry pick the nice verses out of their scriptures the way most Jews and Christians do theirs. Moderation is a step in the right direction. I wish WinterHold the best when attempting to get other Muslims to agree with him. I'd love to see him discuss this with Kloro.
I'm not anti-Christian. I'm anti-stupid.
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