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God plays games
#21
RE: God plays games
(October 8, 2020 at 5:42 pm)runewell Wrote:
(October 7, 2020 at 3:58 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Excellent, and since I don't belong to god, he can fuck right off.  That's how that works, right?

Non-sequitur alert Smile

By all means, tell us how it does work.  

Drich says I don't belong to god.  I think that if god has no claim on me it can fuck right off.  What part of that do you think is a non-seq?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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#22
RE: God plays games
(October 8, 2020 at 6:10 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote:
(October 8, 2020 at 5:42 pm)runewell Wrote: Non-sequitur alert Smile

By all means, tell us how it does work.  

Drich says I don't belong to god.  I think that if god has no claim on me it can fuck right off.  What part of that do you think is a non-seq?

Belonging to God is equivalent to being a child of God.  Just because you are not a child of God, that doesn't preclude you from being subject to His judgment.  The bible says that the alternative is "Your father, the devil" but I seem to recall him losing his powers near the end of Revelations...  

You can deny him all you want, claim you were a good person under rules of your own making.  If He turns out to be real, there will still be hell to pay.
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#23
RE: God plays games
Quote:Belonging to God is equivalent to being a child of God. 

Well that's disturbing as children don't belong to anyone 


Quote: Just because you are not a child of God, that doesn't preclude you from being subject to judgment.

This doesn't follow 


Quote: The bible says that the alternative is "Your father, the devil" but I seem to recall him losing his powers near the end of Revelations...
Not being aligned with one sky tyrant does not mean your in league with another

Quote:You can deny him all you want, claim you were a good person under rules of your own making. 
No one needs to claim he is a good person by any reasonable standard .And to deny something it first has to be demonstrated to exist in the first place


Quote: If He turns out to be real, there will still be hell to pay.
If hell is real then god is a monster for punishing good people .
“The sun from far gives life. But get close to it and it burns anything down to ashes”

[Image: flag-ukraine_1f1fa-1f1e6.png]  Heart [Image: canada-google.png]        

 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
–SHIRLEY CHISHOLM


      
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#24
RE: God plays games
(October 8, 2020 at 6:47 pm)runewell Wrote:
(October 8, 2020 at 6:10 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: By all means, tell us how it does work.  

Drich says I don't belong to god.  I think that if god has no claim on me it can fuck right off.  What part of that do you think is a non-seq?

Belonging to God is equivalent to being a child of God.  Just because you are not a child of God, that doesn't preclude you from being subject to His judgment.  The bible says that the alternative is "Your father, the devil" but I seem to recall him losing his powers near the end of Revelations...  

You can deny him all you want, claim you were a good person under rules of your own making.  If He turns out to be real, there will still be hell to pay.

That would be a point of doctrinal disagreement, not a non-seq.  

At any rate, there's no real need for me to deny your god, as I couldn't be a christian even if it existed.  If that means that this god is going to burn me (or whatever you prefer hell to be) then that's what's going to happen. Nothing about any of that changes my position on the matter.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
#25
RE: God plays games
The non-seq was also meant as a bit of humor, does B really follow from A the way you've phrased it.

> as I couldn't be a christian even if it existed
> If that means that this god is going to burn me (or whatever you prefer hell to be) then that's what's going to happen

What does that mean?
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#26
RE: God plays games
Pretty straightforward. Assume that your god exists. Assume that it's going to punish me for not being a christian. Neither of these things compels me toward christianity. The first is irrelevant, and the latter is repulsive.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
#27
RE: God plays games
(October 7, 2020 at 3:57 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
Quote:if you hear the literal voice of God how would you distinguish it from any one else? the only way we can be certain that it is God speaking is if what is said correlated with the bible.

This, without a doubt and beyond question, is the most STUNNINGLY perfect circular argument I've ever heard in my life.
Thanks, Drich.  I was having a rough morning, and I need that laugh.  ROFLOL
Boru

again.. if you heard the voice of God, how would you know it is god? any thing besides an appeal to an authoritative guidance to define who and what God is,  foolish speculation. because again how would you who knows nothing of God then be able to identify him?

(October 7, 2020 at 5:35 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
(October 7, 2020 at 5:14 pm)runewell Wrote: >A god that is capable of doing absolutely anything is speaking directly with you? Seriously?

Well, that would seem to be one reason for creating us

>If god knows how the atheist mind works, why is he only communicating with you?

You don't seem interested?

>Why isn't god doing what a god can do and inform everyone of his existence?

What would you know about being a god?  

>Because he doesn't fucking exist.

Who's making unprovable claims now?


So, an ineffable, perfect Being, created humans so he would have someone to talk to? Why?
Servants and family.
Quote:I can’t speak for other atheists, but I’d be extremely interested in talking to God.
again how would you know if you were? if god met you on your level, then how would yo be able to identify him if your understanding of God failed/IE lead you to atheism?
Quote:I know a lot about being a god. I’ve read everything Terry Pratchett ever wrote. 

Everyone makes unprovable claims, there’s no shame in it. 

Boru
just ask seek and knock
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#28
RE: God plays games
That's a question you might more properly ask of yourself. Boru doesn't claim to hear a gods voice, you do.

If the voice you heard claimed to be ganesh, and was what you as a ganesh cultist expected to hear from ganesh, would you then be certain that the voice was from ganesh? Likely so, if the process you describe is how you certify the voices inside your head. As comical as it is falling from your lips, it's probably an accurate assessment of alot of peoples ideas about how to certify divine whatsits. This is the problem. All of you can be convinced by this process that you are right, but you can't all actually be right, and you could all be wrong.

Diving straight down the rabbit hole, if an atheist found themselves in the situation you pretend to be in, they'd likely end up coming up with any number of loony non-god explanations for the voices they hear. They could use this same process. In fact we do, demonstrably. The intensity and effect of a delusion is strongly correlated with the expectations of the person suffering it.

It's rare that a person who hears voices and gets visited by apparitions calmly and soberly decides that they have a problem.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
Reply
#29
RE: God plays games
(October 8, 2020 at 7:26 pm)The Grand Nudger Wrote: Assume that it's going to punish me for not being a christian. 

Already people have taken issue with the label, so why don't we do away with it. 
The punishment will be for having sinned (for having rebelled against God and broken his commandments.)
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#30
RE: God plays games
Modern humans roughly 200,000 years old.
Sin is roughly 2,000 years old.

I guess those that exist prior, just weren't special enough.
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