Top 10 Reasons Why Jesus is Not God

[Godscreated]

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Also since you agree with Godschilds' assessment that I missed that Christianity is about others when I went to church, I'm going to go ahead here and respond to both of you. Although, I'm pretty sure I've talked to Godschild about these matters already.

1. Studied scripture plenty, recited biblical stories verbatum since I could talk.
2. Attended Christian schools for years, homeschooled on Christian curriculum for years. One mandatory subject, called BIBLE, I excelled in. Another mandatory requirement: Reading the bible from front to back.
3. My dad gave the money out of his pocket--all of it-- and still does to this day, when he meets someone he feels would benefit from it in the name of god. For the recod, he's the one whose passively suicidal. I literally had to call the police to find him 2yrs ago because he told me he was going to stop drinking and eating and crawl in a hole and die. He, unlike me, studies the word of god every single day. And I do credit that fact to his not committing suicide directly. I also credit the bible with being his inspiration for not seeking treatment for his mental and physical maladies.
4. My mom lives her life for others, every day. She takes care of blind, deaf, mute all in one patients who live life from morning to night, vomitting on themselves and choking on their own sputum. She is their reason for waking up every morning, she sings to them and gives them that feeling of being taken care of that they so desperately need.
5. I myself grew up helping others in any way I could. My mom's clients, I helped her care for. The sickest of the sick I was able to bring smiles to their faces and happiness to their lives. In middle school I prevented a suicide. In elementary school I was strong enough to stop a horrific family wide curse in the form of telling my mom and the police what they're doing to all the women in my family when I found out it wasn't just me being victimized. Then I forgave that person 2yrs later on their deathbed from a quadruple by-pass and went to them. They didn't die. I still have a relationship with them to this day.
In highschool I volunteered every single night after school from 4pm-11pm in the nursing home, aiding my mom with her duties as a CNA. I bathed, changed, and fed the elderly, called them grandma and grandpa, held the hands of those for hours who decided it was time to stop eating, etc. Sometimes I could get them to eat, but they would die eventually. I'd sing to them. In church I would feel like those there didn't have any connection to god and that the pastor didn't have any connection to the things that I'd seen and experienced in my life thusfar, so I'd go volunteer in the nursery to escape it.

When I turned 18 I was so angry at god for so many things that I disowned him, and did all those things a free-willed teenager is going to do. Okay, no, I was on the extreme of that spectrum. I became a stripper for a little bit, I did drugs, I lived life day to day for me myself and I. I partied more than I didn't. But I still held a FT Job at mortgage company and as lead teller at a bank. I walked to work until I could afford myself a car. I was 19. I also continued with my enrollment in college, got a full ride for my grades, and was pre-med from then on with the plan of doing doctors without borders since I'd taken french in HS for four years towards that goal of aiding Africa.
And that's when I was hit with my first official 'flare' in a hereditary auto-immune disease that almost killed me. Numerous times.
I lost everything that year, my life that I'd worked so hard for on my own: my home, my car, my classes, a baby, everything. So I turned to god.
And I spent the next 6yrs in absolute hell being treated with cytoxan (mustard gas derivitive) chemotherapy. My entire family converted to god based on my faith kept during my illness. I had such trust in god that I did as my pastor and family told me to, and I decided to allow god to do his healing work on my body without the intervention of the chemotherapy medications which were not working. I got my forehead anointed with oil, and I refused treatment for six months, and I gave god my full faith like that of a child. That's when my body took a nose dive. The doctors themselves almost killed me a couple times during this time. For instance, with a chest port that was put in too deeply in my heart creating a clot on top of the fact that I was bleeding internally from the effects of my disease. Needless to say this caused an ICU visit for me for a couple days.
Laying there listening to codes that you know are life and death calls and hoping to god you don't get one of those, praying for those fights as they happen.. Crying when you find out the result. It makes you think about whether you're alone or not. I was disallusioned the moment my body gave out on me and I needed ICU revival. I'd always been told that god would be there, and he wasn't. That one fact didn't dissuade me from my faith but I never forgot it. I paid attention after that, and did as my family told me to do. I prayed for answers for four years. FOUR YEARS. And got none.

I still live my life for others to this day. And I read the bible every day too. You know when you put bible verses up? I look them up. Then I scoff because
I'm not the one who needs a reality check.

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You did not share all this with me, I do feel for you and can not imagine what you've endured. I'm not judging you here, please know this. I'm making an observation, ok? 1 and 2 are things many people have done without finding God, I've seen it before, being a Christian is far more. 3 and 4 are about your Mom and Dad not yourself. Doing things for others does not necessarily make one a Christian, my brother does for others and he is not a Christian, so I've experienced this within my own family. It's a good thing that your parents are so caring, but like I said it's not you.
5 This is you and the one thing you keep saying is I, I did this, I did that. I commend you on what you did do, but by your own words God is not mentioned. My wife has worked with the dying and mentally and physically challenged for years, she includes God in this work, she says this is what God wants me to do, she allows Him to work through her. You also say that you rejected God then became ill and returned to God, again I see this as using God for yourself. Then when you nearly died and prayed for several years and did not hear from God you gave up on Him. You have been wishy washy with God and you expect Him to jump when you say, it doesn't work that way. You never said, not once, that you had turned you life over to Christ as your savior, you never said you let Christ work in and through your life, you did not say you walked in a relationship with Him. These are important things one must do if you expect to hear from God, yet He has poured out His grace on you, you are still alive. You seem to rely on and listen to everyone except God, doing for others is great, allowing God to work through you for others is the greatest. In this He is glorified and you are blessed in many different ways, will he completely restore your health, I do not know, He hasn't for me but that's ok, He has a reason and I accept this. What I do know, I have a viable relationship with God and it brings peace and blessings to me all the time. Please do not get angry as I said it's not a judgement, I'm just pointing out thing you said and the things I have experienced in my Christian walk. One thing I should have said in an earlier post was, allowing God to work through you for others is what Christianity is about, being a Christian means for the most part giving up the I in ones life.

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I bet like myself he sees what God does for others and rejoices in them, this is what Christianity is about, others. You must have missed that when you went to church

I shared in the fellowship of mass delusion, but thankfully I was not so far gone that my mind was completely lost to the fantasy of falsities.

You should have put your heart into it, things might have been very different and better than you could imagine.

[Mr_Dew7]

Revival meeting. I looked it up for the definition in order to find out what denonimation you may be talking about that I attend, and here's the first video I found.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BhC9lYVnOZA

Honestly, I'd rather shoot myself in the foot. Do you have any videos that portray what it is you think I might gain from attending such a meeting?
If someone is "healed" in a meeting, do you take it as assumed proof that they are healed, or do you follow up after they've confirmed with the doctors that their malady is no longer present?

Also since you agree with Godschilds' assessment that I missed that Christianity is about others when I went to church, I'm going to go ahead here and respond to both of you. Although, I'm pretty sure I've talked to Godschild about these matters already.

1. Studied scripture plenty, recited biblical stories verbatum since I could talk.
2. Attended Christian schools for years, homeschooled on Christian curriculum for years. One mandatory subject, called BIBLE, I excelled in. Another mandatory requirement: Reading the bible from front to back.
3. My dad gave the money out of his pocket--all of it-- and still does to this day, when he meets someone he feels would benefit from it in the name of god. For the recod, he's the one whose passively suicidal. I literally had to call the police to find him 2yrs ago because he told me he was going to stop drinking and eating and crawl in a hole and die. He, unlike me, studies the word of god every single day. And I do credit that fact to his not committing suicide directly. I also credit the bible with being his inspiration for not seeking treatment for his mental and physical maladies.
4. My mom lives her life for others, every day. She takes care of blind, deaf, mute all in one patients who live life from morning to night, vomitting on themselves and choking on their own sputum. She is their reason for waking up every morning, she sings to them and gives them that feeling of being taken care of that they so desperately need.
5. I myself grew up helping others in any way I could. My mom's clients, I helped her care for. The sickest of the sick I was able to bring smiles to their faces and happiness to their lives. In middle school I prevented a suicide. In elementary school I was strong enough to stop a horrific family wide curse in the form of telling my mom and the police what they're doing to all the women in my family when I found out it wasn't just me being victimized. Then I forgave that person 2yrs later on their deathbed from a quadruple by-pass and went to them. They didn't die. I still have a relationship with them to this day.
In highschool I volunteered every single night after school from 4pm-11pm in the nursing home, aiding my mom with her duties as a CNA. I bathed, changed, and fed the elderly, called them grandma and grandpa, held the hands of those for hours who decided it was time to stop eating, etc. Sometimes I could get them to eat, but they would die eventually. I'd sing to them. In church I would feel like those there didn't have any connection to god and that the pastor didn't have any connection to the things that I'd seen and experienced in my life thusfar, so I'd go volunteer in the nursery to escape it.

When I turned 18 I was so angry at god for so many things that I disowned him, and did all those things a free-willed teenager is going to do. Okay, no, I was on the extreme of that spectrum. I became a stripper for a little bit, I did drugs, I lived life day to day for me myself and I. I partied more than I didn't. But I still held a FT Job at mortgage company and as lead teller at a bank. I walked to work until I could afford myself a car. I was 19. I also continued with my enrollment in college, got a full ride for my grades, and was pre-med from then on with the plan of doing doctors without borders since I'd taken french in HS for four years towards that goal of aiding Africa.
And that's when I was hit with my first official 'flare' in a hereditary auto-immune disease that almost killed me. Numerous times.
I lost everything that year, my life that I'd worked so hard for on my own: my home, my car, my classes, a baby, everything. So I turned to god.
And I spent the next 6yrs in absolute hell being treated with cytoxan (mustard gas derivitive) chemotherapy. My entire family converted to god based on my faith kept during my illness. I had such trust in god that I did as my pastor and family told me to, and I decided to allow god to do his healing work on my body without the intervention of the chemotherapy medications which were not working. I got my forehead anointed with oil, and I refused treatment for six months, and I gave god my full faith like that of a child. That's when my body took a nose dive. The doctors themselves almost killed me a couple times during this time. For instance, with a chest port that was put in too deeply in my heart creating a clot on top of the fact that I was bleeding internally from the effects of my disease. Needless to say this caused an ICU visit for me for a couple days.
Laying there listening to codes that you know are life and death calls and hoping to god you don't get one of those, praying for those fights as they happen.. Crying when you find out the result. It makes you think about whether you're alone or not. I was disallusioned the moment my body gave out on me and I needed ICU revival. I'd always been told that god would be there, and he wasn't. That one fact didn't dissuade me from my faith but I never forgot it. I paid attention after that, and did as my family told me to do. I prayed for answers for four years. FOUR YEARS. And got none.

I still live my life for others to this day. And I read the bible every day too. You know when you put bible verses up? I look them up. Then I scoff because
I'm not the one who needs a reality check.

You know, it sounds like you've had it pretty rough. That is alot for one person to have to endure. I haven't had to deal with the pain and anguish of physical disease and chemotherapy. For me growing up, it was sort of like a bad b movie, if you know what I mean. The first thing was violence. The constant violence and anger that I was subjected to as a young child made lasting impressions, and that generational sin turned me into a very angry individaul. Then, I found out what porn was! Bleh! And then my parents told me why they rolled up their dollar bills so tightly... Shortly after I learned how to roll a joint. That night I couldn't sleep for hours because my body wouldn't stop vibrating! When I was 12, my parents thought it was a good idea to let me have some R&R whiskey! 7 shots to a my tiny body was hell. But beer wasn't so bad... I learned that stealing isn't that hard, if you know how to act. When I was 15, I would try to go out into the farms where I lived to see if I could find shrooms under cow dung! One time I was so desperate to quench my cleptomanic thirst that I stole a mini-cooler full of pepsi out of an astro van! Silly I know. So when I met my wife, I was living at a flop house with 10 other teenagers. We all lived on ramen noodles, suffice it to say no one was over weight. When I met her, I was living there, with a meth lab in the garage, addicted to pain relievers, alcohol, and marijuana. Oh and lets not forget duster! I survived just to get high. Not kidding. We did nothing but hurt others and hurt ourselves. I was a worthless P.O.S. Good for nothing but stealing and hurting. I was 17 years old. My favorite thing to listen to was Twizted, ICP, Tech N9NE, KMK, ABK, and all of that bullshit. I had two best friends, one was a psychopath, the other was a passive, I was inbetween in my thinking, actions, and outbursts of anger. I met my wife 2 years after I went out on my own. We fell in love the moment we met, and have been in love since. Not that there weren't huge gaping chasms filled with crap since we married in 2008 when we were still 17. I feel horrible for the things I have done to her, and she feels that way for the things she has done to me. We were both physically and verbally abusive to one another, and to any who had a problem. Again I say, I was a P.O.S. But since last april, when I found God, or maybe He found me, my life has completely changed. God said I couldn't be a child anymore, or I would lose everything, which was the next logical step in the chain of events that I was following at the time. I can't describe how happy I am now, and how happy my wife is as well. We've been married nearly 5 years, and this last year has been the best of all of them. God fulfilled His promises to me and mine, and has since then shown me more than I need to see to believe in Him. My grandmother, for one, with no medical hope and no other option at the time, was miraculously cured of Hep. C after our entire family prayed for a couple of weeks. No liver transplantation required, it simply disappeared. In any case, I am sorry to hear that you had to go through all of those things. But I can say this for certain, nothing, absolutely nothing in my life changed until I completely and totally gave my life to Jesus Christ and began to live by His word.

[Silver]

You should have put your heart into it, things might have been very different and better than you could imagine.

I prefer that my heart remain healthy by being free of drivel.

[Mystical]

@Godschild

If you had any idea what you're talking about, you'd know that all of that was assumed in what I was talking about based on content of the subject matter. You obviously don't know how far down the road I had traveled, since your diagnosis is substantially wrong. It merely shows lack of belief and understanding on your part, not mine.

Just getting to the point of giving up your faith in anything besides god to heal you while you're dying and are given two options: faith, or medicine-- is a long path of which you obviously know nothing about. Do you take pills for something? Blood pressure, cholesterol, diabetes? Would you stop taking those today and give your healing up to god? Then DO IT. You trust god, you think you have faith like that of a child? DO IT.
Or are you wishy washy?

Actually, I guarantee you won't and obviously because I'm a caring individual I'd advise you don't. Not only is it ridiculous (pull up the christian afloat at sea who turns away boats saying god will save them joke), but you don't have the faith to do so, because you still have cockiness in you. You're a cocky guy, which makes you proud. You haven't endured the full tearing down of your will and replacement of gods' will, based on the attributes that I've observed in you since I've encountered you on these forums.

Since you require it out of my mouth instead of assuming that since I was raised with believing parents who taught me biblical verse since before I can speak: I was baptised twice. Once at 12 when I gave my entire life up for god and dedicated myself to his will. That night I dedicated myself to what he wanted for me, whatever it was I would be his instrument in this life and hopefully the next. This carried on throughout my childhood; every 'battle' I faced, I turned to him for guidance. I had a shitty ass life, but I was the kind of person that would turn my face up to the sky and thank Jesus for the life I had.
I didn't go to church with my believer parents then do whatever I wanted when I got home, I lived for him and abstained from things that weren't spiritually relevant, in his name. I'd go to work with my mom and spend time with gods' angels, as opposed to playing with friends and getting into trouble. I was the most narrow walking Christian you could imagine. Even when I disowned god I believed in him. I wasn't an atheist. I merely wanted to shove every bit of my hell filled life in his face as being his fault. Everyone has a point at which they break, except for JOB, a fictional character apparently.
The second baptism, after I got deathly ill and turned back to god (apparently that's USING god?! Don't go around saying that at church, I wouldn't advise it) at which time I sought forgiveness for my sins and a renewal of my being in him. In my posts, note that I don't capitalize god. It's for a reason. You know the reason, don't you? Does it hurt your 'spirit' every time I say god without the G? I'm genuinely not being sarcastic here, I am saying this so that you can see that I honestly have thought as you do.
My parents were caring people, and still are. But I made it clear in my post that they did that in the name of god, they raised me in Christian upbringing, and I stated clearly my dad does what he does for god. Obviously I'm not them, I didn't say I was.

I said I so much (and yes I was aware you'd bring [that] point up if you were a talker not a walker and/or a petty asshole) because of viewpoint. I look back on my life and I see what I did alone, without god. That does not mean that my entire life I didn't live every breath in his name, for his glory. Nor should I be required to prove the depth of my devotion to anyone, the least of which being you. Nor did I feel I'd need to if you actually knew the depth of what I was talking about. Obviously, you know not.

As for this gem:

Then when you nearly died and prayed for several years and did not hear from God you gave up on Him. You have been wishy washy with God and you expect Him to jump when you say, it doesn't work that way.

It's unimaginably disillusioning to be lying in a bed that you know you probably won't be leaving unless it's dead-- wondering where my Father is and whether I displeased Him and that's why He isn't there? One day you'll get there, and you'll be equally as unprepared as I was, for that moment. I waited 4 years (1/6 of my lifetime) for an answer, not for him to "jump". I did everything you say I should have done, I was pure in every form I knew how to make myself, in order to receive that message. And no message was there to be found.

As for him pouring his "graces" out upon me and that's why I'm alive: take a long hike, bud. I'm here because of real life, physical things. Like cathedars, and transfusions, and doctors and nurses and my sheer will to live. My strength to wake up and face another 24hrs of torment. My will to overcome the obstacles put in my path. MY will. Note the MY. I did all those things in his name, but that is all. He didn't help me through any of that, he wasn't there patting me on the back while I vomitted nonstop for days. My family was there, I was there. He definitely wasn't. And yet I gave him the glory.


Now what?

What do you have to say about my last post now, since all of that which you've spoken I did and was?

[fr0d0]

Sounds like you're still struggling a lot with all of that miss c.

It sounds like you thought you should somehow have a right to good things no matter what. We all know that's not how it works. That's the point of the Job story. It rains equally on the good and the bad.

And now you're recovered and happy suddenly it's all your own doing.

If you had the tiniest amount of faith you could move a mountain.... meaning all people have very little faith. Unless you're saying your ex fellow Christians were an exception?

If what you're relating about what Christians advised you is true, and I believe you, I'd like to come there and shout at them a bit. WBC seem an attractive alternative.

[Mystical]

Struggling with it? Sure. I'm angry, actually. I'm upset that I had to get to the point of death to find out that heaven isnt real and that all that willful martyrdom tricked others into thinking that there was. At least now when I die if I'm aware of it when I do, I wont be scared out of my mind with the thought of what is or isnt to come. At least I wont live my life with the expectation that what isnt done in this life can be done in the next. I dont cry about my ailments in the shower to that song "I'm coming home." Not sure where the entitlement idea sits in relation to me unless I failed to communicate here, which happens. To be clear though: I never thought I deserved anything, fr0d0. that was the problem with me. that is why I turned my head the other way when I was wronged. that is why I forgave those who never apologized, that is why I didnt question my impoverishment. that is why I gave every cent I had to others: because I felt they were more deserving in gods eyes, since I was his and what was mine was his. The reason i wanted to do doctors without borders was because I believed it was the path he showed me was that way. Personally i wanted to be a veterinarian and living in Africa wouldve been extremely difficult for me with the symptoms of disease I'd been living with my whole life. And yes I realized that that probably wasnt the path he had in mind for me. back when god existed in my mind. I was so undeserving I put other peoples needs above mine and that ended with unhealthy relationships in friends and family. I had absolutely no self worth; i would've died at any time for anyone. Anything I could do to improve someones life I DID in the lords name, mostly anonymously. I didnt care about having things I needed, and I certainly didnt feel entitled in any way for anything from god. until I opened my eyes and realized that he isnt there, and asked for him to show me in any way that he was. Mister Drew I have a reply for you too, just not tonight..

[KichigaiNeko]

It sounds like you thought you should somehow have a right to good things no matter what. We all know that's not how it works. That's the point of the Job story

.
So what are you trying to advocate here fr0d0? We are to roll over and accept second best? A second-hand religion and a second hand life with no incentive to better ourselves?

It rains equally on the good and the bad.

Very good, you have discovered climate and weather.

And now you're recovered and happy suddenly it's all your own doing.

And why not? You can have the best physicians in the world but it is up to YOU if you recover.

If you had the tiniest amount of faith you could move a mountain.... meaning all people have very little faith.

Nah I don't think so. IF that was the case then all the deserts of the world would be in bloom by now


Sorry to jump in on you conversation here....

[fr0d0]

So what is it you're moaning about miss c? He didn't miraculously heal you, and you didn't expect it.

[KichigaiNeko]

So what is it you're moaning about miss c? He didn't miraculously heal you, and you didn't expect it.

You really aren't reading well tonight are you fr0d0?

[fr0d0]

Morning here kitch. This isn't your only mistake ... I'll answer your points later. No time, or capability on this phone now k.