Immigration Agents Whipping Hatian Migrants?

[Anomalocaris]

Nope, they have no such right. Human rights override all those supposed rights. It's pure irrational xenophobia and it's not just selfish it's evil.

Actually human right will ultimately become totally meaningless in any practical sense, and  even its form will collapses  into flaming wreckage if it is not implicitly understood to be subservient to many other “supposed” rights.

Ideal does not override the reality of consequences.   It can only struggle to temporarily appear to do so, and such can only struggle come at its own long term cost.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Actually human right will ultimately become totally meaningless in any practical sense, and  even its form will collapses  into flaming wreckage if it is not implicitly understood to be subservient to many other “supposed” rights.

Nope if there are no human rights then no other rights matter 

Ideal does not override the reality of consequences.   It can only struggle to temporarily appear to do so, and such can only struggle come at its own long term cost.

Without ideals a society has nothing

[Anomalocaris]

Actually human right will ultimately become totally meaningless in any practical sense, and  even its form will collapses  into flaming wreckage if it is not implicitly understood to be subservient to many other “supposed” rights.

Nope if there are no human rights then no other rights matter 

Ideal does not override the reality of consequences.   It can only struggle to temporarily appear to do so, and such can only struggle come at its own long term cost.

Without ideals a society has nothing

That is bullshit.    Many other completely practical rights as asserted practically by power mattered as far back as social hierarchy came first into being,  before humans were even humans, much less ever there were any inklings of the totally artificial ideal of human rights    These practical previligeg gained and maintained by power remain supreme due to their practical material nature no matter how loftily one might fantasizes about how high an imaginary artificial ideal to be.     

It is the society that had already been something for a very, very long time that first spawned the artificial ideal of human rights.   So ” Without ideals a society has nothing“ is but a meaningless chant that attempt to deny reality.

[The Architect Of Fate]

That is bullshit.    Many other completely rights matter Long before ever there were any inklings of the totally artificial ideal of human rights It is the society that was already something that first spawned the artificial ideal of human rights.

All civilizations had some concept of human rights. They were limited often to certain groups or even to a single group. But they were human rights all the same. And I repeat a society without ideals has nothing.

[Anomalocaris]

That is bullshit.    Many other completely rights matter Long before ever there were any inklings of the totally artificial ideal of human rights It is the society that was already something that first spawned the artificial ideal of human rights.

All civilizations had some concept of human rights. They were limited often to certain groups or even to a single group. But they were human rights all the same. And I repeat a society without ideals has nothing.

Yes, all societies have concepts of that certain groups have certain prerogatives, but hardly is human right meaningful if no prerogative is considered universal to all, or most humans.

An I repeat.   Human right is a luxury made up ideal, far from really important, much less vital, to the basic practical functioning of human society.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Yes, all societies have concepts of that certain groups have certain prerogatives, but hardly is human right meaningful if no prerogative is considered universal to all, or most humans.

Nope human rights are merely the recognition of humanity all civilizations had this our modern concept is just an extension of that. If there were no human rights . What would be giving rights to? Rocks? 

An I repeat.   Human right is a luxury made up ideal, far from really important, much less vital, to the basic practical functioning of human society.

Nope, human rights are a necessity without them you don't have a functioning society.

[Anomalocaris]

Yes, all societies have concepts of that certain groups have certain prerogatives, but hardly is human right meaningful if no prerogative is considered universal to all, or most humans.

Nope human rights are merely the recognition of humanity all civilizations had this our modern concept is just an extension of that. If there were no human rights . What would be giving rights to? Rocks? 

An I repeat.   Human right is a luxury made up ideal, far from really important, much less vital, to the basic practical functioning of human society.

Nope, human rights are a necessity without them you don't have a functioning society.

Bull.

Humanity is an artificial concept.    If there were no humans, of course there would be no right, because some humans made The whole thing up.     But if there were no right, there would still be humans, as there had been humans before humans made up the thing called right.    That all humans constitute a broadly equivalent body sharing substantively more than the ability to interbreed and produce fertile offspring, and thus forming a “humanity”, is also a artificial, and far from universal, concept.    In fact humans existed for 99% of its tenure on earth without any concept equivalent to human rights or some practical equality in privilege or parogative with those biologically of the same species but well outside immediate kin or tribal group.    For most of human existence, society followed ad hoc and mutable conventions that seems best for navigating each particular social or group interaction.

So the gist is right is an agreed upon convention.   You have no right in practice that other people do not agree to let you have.

To assert that some hypothetical right trumps what most other people with the power to affect events thinks is essential for their own most practical interests is, shall we say, delusional?

[The Architect Of Fate]

Bull.

Truth 

Humanity is an artificial concept. 

Humanity is a biological concept that all civilizations have accepted in one way or another and is the foundation of any rights with are the foundation of society and civilization. Without them we would be a little better than a troop of chimps.

   If there were no humans, of course there would be no right, because some humans made The whole thing up. 

Yup and with no rights no society could function 

But if there were no right, there would still be humans, as there had been humans before humans made up the thing called right. 

No society or civilization could exist without human rights of some kind. Humans could exist but not as we are now.

   That all humans constitute a broadly equivalent body sharing substantively more than the ability to interbreed and produce fertile offspring, and thus forming a “humanity”, is also a artificial, and far from universal, concept.    In fact humans existed for 99% of its tenure on earth without any concept equivalent to human rights or some practical equality in privilege or parogative with those biologically of the same species but well outside immediate kin or tribal group.    For most of human existence, society followed ad hoc and mutable conventions that seems best for navigating each particular social or group interaction.

Human rights from the earliest tribes onward have existed in some fashion we wouldn't have been able to build civilizations without them and we certainly couldn't run the modern world without them. So you're simply wrong.

So the gist is right is an agreed upon convention.   You have no right in practice that other people do not agree to let you have.

Nope rights have been a vital component of humanity's rise and social organization and we would be fucked as species without them and people who trample on them are only fucking society over.

To assert that some hypothetical right trumps what most other people with the power to affect events thinks is essential for their own most practical interests is, shall we say, delusional?

To assert human rights which are fundamental to civilization have the power to affect events and are essential to practical intreats is anything but delusional. The contrary is the case.