Russia and Ukraine

[Irreligious Atheist]

Indeed considering Russia has no right to invade Ukraine nor was there any law it was enforcing. This was simply Putin living out his fantasy of territorial expansion and empire-building and blew up in his face.

Speaking of whataboutism, which you accuse me of. Back to the point of "Putin bad". Pretty sure no one here has said otherwise. That doesn't make it ok for NATO to attack Russia's nuclear triad and escalate that much closer to WWIII.

[The Architect Of Fate]

Something can be both self defense and an escalation, no?

It can but this isn't. This is defense plain and simple.

Why are you pretending that it's either one or the other?

He's not pretending it literally is one. The only escalating anything is the Russians 

It is a NATO attack because the war is being funded by NATO countries and NATO is supplying weaponry, and NATO countries didn't draw any red lines about cutting off funding if Ukraine attacked Russia's nuclear triad directly.

No, it's not acting in a supporting role of Ukrainian forces that does not make it a NATO attack and there is no need for a red line and the lack of one does not make this a Nato operation. 

You don't have to converse with me. You can stop if you'd like, and you're going to be whiny. 

And you don't have to repeat the same refuted talking point over and over and make terrible arguments ....

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen.

Or you could actually come up with some new talking points....

[Deesse23]

"I have no evidence, therfore i am right"

The creed of every bullshitter and conspiracy nut around. You are just the sad and pathetic end of a fucking long conga line.

The mob boss having the undercover snitch killed is a crazy conspiracy theory, since it can't 100 % be proven. Must've been a random coincidence, and we should give the mob boss the benefit of the doubt. That's what you sound like. And Jeff Epstein killed himself too.

tl;dr:

You
have
no
evidence

But why keep embarrassing yourself?

[The Architect Of Fate]

Speaking of whataboutism, which you accuse me of. Back to the point of "Putin bad". Pretty sure no one here has said otherwise.

Ah, so a strawman when did I say you didn't believe Putin was bad? .....

That doesn't make it ok for NATO to attack Russia's nuclear triad and escalate that much closer to WWIII.

Do you mean NATO defending another country from Russia? Who will never use its Nuclear Arsenal if it even still has a functional one? WW3 isn't happening...

[Irreligious Atheist]

Something can be both self defense and an escalation, no?

It can but this isn't. This is defense plain and simple.

Why are you pretending that it's either one or the other?

He's not pretending it literally is one. The only escalating anything is the Russians 

It is a NATO attack because the war is being funded by NATO countries and NATO is supplying weaponry, and NATO countries didn't draw any red lines about cutting off funding if Ukraine attacked Russia's nuclear triad directly.

No, it's not acting in a supporting role of Ukrainian forces that does not make it a NATO attack and there is no need for a red line and the lack of one does not make this a Nato operation. 

You don't have to converse with me. You can stop if you'd like, and you're going to be whiny. 

And you don't have to repeat the same refuted talking point over and over and make terrible arguments ....

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen.

Or you could actually come up with some new talking points....

I'm not repeating the same talking points. I came into the thread to talk about the NATO attack on Russia's nuclear triad which happened fairly recently, but people brought it back to "Putin bad, self defense, etc", which I agree with. Putin is bad, and the attack on the base is self defense and in a vaccuum it is entirely justifiable, but the world doesn't operate in a vaccuum, and therefore I consider that point moot.

So a nuclear attack from Russia is just as likely whether Ukraine attacks Russia's nuclear triad or not? It doesn't even escalate things a thousandth of a percent and Russia is just shrugging this off like any other attack? Is that what I am to believe?

[Irreligious Atheist]

The mob boss having the undercover snitch killed is a crazy conspiracy theory, since it can't 100 % be proven. Must've been a random coincidence, and we should give the mob boss the benefit of the doubt. That's what you sound like. And Jeff Epstein killed himself too.

tl;dr:

You
have
no
evidence

But why keep embarrassing yourself?

Did you read my link? Boris Johnson, publicly against any peace deals with Russia. Former US officials confirm peace deal was in place and ready to move forward. Bori Johnson then has a meeting with Zelenskyy, and the peace deal immediately falls apart following the meeting. Put 2 and 2 together, my friend. Is Cosby innocent? Are you still waiting for 100 % proof to come in. Am I a tin foil hatter for thinking that most of those women are probably telling the truth? What can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence, amirite, or the world doesn't always quite work that way? Jarred Kushner's billions of dollars deal with the Saudis is not corruption either, right? I mean, Jarred Kushner has not been criminally charged with anything, so stop being a conspiracy theorist tin foil hatter, am I right? I don't need to see Kushner behind bars or to have 100 % proof to see that he's as corrupt or worse than other elites. You keep waiting for that prosecution though, and in the time being, you can give Kushner the benefit of the doubt all you'd like, but I prefer not to go through life wearing a blindfold.

[Deesse23]

Dayum, that was easy to make you pedal back, wasnt it?


The only nation culpable for this war is the one who started it. But that seems to be way over your head.

My grandma would be a bike, if she had wheels.
Unfortunately (for a moron like you), grandma erm Russia does not even hold the position to be at war with Ukraine, let alone NATO, remember?
God, you are so stupid.

Puh-leaze
NATO attacked nothing. But guess who attacked, annexed and invaded stuff. Lets wait and see if you get it. But i am not holding my breath.

Tensions were bad enough before... Russia annexed Crimea, tensions were bad enough before it invaded Ukraine

Why are you doing this to yourself? Why do you actively participate in getting so publicly humiliated? Is that a kink of yours?

Where did I backtrack? I was asking a question when I questioned the US' involvement in the attack on the base, not making a declarative statement.

Everything you posted is irrelevant. We know Russia invading Ukraine was bad, for the millionth time. Ukraine attacking the nuclear triad is an awful escalation when you think that the war on the ground is already won by Ukraine. Why escalate such a massive degree when you are already winning?

You are still arguing countries should let other countries invade and just roll over, for the sole reason the invader is supposed to be stronger. Ironically enough, what we currently see is that the russian army is not able to defeat the ukrainian one. None brings nuclear war to the table, but cowards / idots like you. You want Ukrainians to give up everything because your pants are brown up to your neck!? Tough shit.
If your house would be in a country that was invaded, if your freedom, culture and life would be at stake you wouldnt pontificate this bullcrap.

Fuck you, hypocrite.

[Deesse23]

tl;dr:

You
have
no
evidence

But why keep embarrassing yourself?

Did you read my link? Boris Johnson, publicly against any peace deals with Russia.

Boris Johnson saying stuff publicly is evidence for which conspiracy exactly?  
Which part of "Boris Johnson isnt NATOS spokesperson" didnt you parse when Thump told you?`Which part of that do you want me to explain?

Former US officials confirm peace deal was in place and ready to move forward. Bori Johnson then has a meeting with Zelenskyy, and the peace deal immediately falls apart following the meeting. Put 2 and 2 together, my friend.

I am not your friend, and i leave connecting dots to dolts like you.

Jarred Kushner's billions of dollars deal with the Saudis is not corruption either, right?

And you are telling me that my replies are irrelevant?  

[Deesse23]

It can but this isn't. This is defense plain and simple.



He's not pretending it literally is one. The only escalating anything is the Russians 


No, it's not acting in a supporting role of Ukrainian forces that does not make it a NATO attack and there is no need for a red line and the lack of one does not make this a Nato operation. 



And you don't have to repeat the same refuted talking point over and over and make terrible arguments ....



Or you could actually come up with some new talking points....

I came into the thread to talk about the NATO attack on Russia's nuclear triad
So a nuclear attack from Russia is just as likely whether Ukraine attacks Russia's nuclear triad or not?

Stop masturbating over Russias nuclear triad. You are leaving smelly stains on the forum carpet.

[The Architect Of Fate]

I'm not repeating the same talking points.

Yes, you are these are the same ideas we already went over. 

I came into the thread to talk about the NATO attack on Russia's nuclear triad which happened fairly recently, but people brought it back to "Putin bad, self defense, etc", which I agree with. Putin is bad, and the attack on the base is self defense and in a vaccuum it is entirely justifiable, but the world doesn't operate in a vaccuum, and therefore I consider that point moot.

Accept NATO has not attacked the nuclear triad and this is just a repeat of blaming NATO and raving about a nuclear apocalypse that's never happening. No, it's self-defense and Putin is a monster whether in a vacuum or not therefore it's not a moot point it's the only relevant point.

So a nuclear attack from Russia is just as likely whether Ukraine attacks Russia's nuclear triad or not? It doesn't even escalate things a thousandth of a percent and Russia is just shrugging this off like any other attack? Is that what I am to believe?

I repeat Russia never going to use its Nuclear arsenal even if Ukraine launched attacks into Russian territory. It's never going to happen even assuming Russia still has the capability to do it.