Job

[The Grand Nudger]

Having amoral (or even immoral) gods isn't indicative of an unsound theology. If anything, it tries to capture the reality of the situation in ways that the good guy gods simply cannot. It might be important to remember that the people who wrote the story of job did not, in fact, believe their god was omnibenevolent. It didn;t always do nice shit, and it;s punishing you was not in any sense believed to be linked to earning some reward. Additionally, when you were dead - god was done with you.

The beliefs we see, today, are product of pagan syncretism both in their founding and now in their reformation.

[The Architect Of Fate]

We back on to the whole thing where...If somebody hit you in the mouth, then gave you a lollipop..no harm no foul?

I mean, it's like they never hit you in the mouth at all, right?

So eternal paradise is being compared to a tootsie pop? Would if Johnny Depp wanted to punch you in the face and then give you a private Island? I don't know about you but I would be willing to endure that brief amount of suffering in exchange for such a rich reward.

Follow up question, have you ever been to the gym?

If Johnny Depp punched me id kick him in the nuts and tell him he can keep his island. I don't take bribes. no, I don't go to the Gym because Gyms are a scam. If you want to get fit go swimming.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

So eternal paradise is being compared to a tootsie pop? Would if Johnny Depp wanted to punch you in the face and then give you a private Island? I don't know about you but I would be willing to endure that brief amount of suffering in exchange for such a rich reward.

Follow up question, have you ever been to the gym?

If Johnny Depp punched me id kick him in the nuts and tell him he can keep his island. I don't take bribes. no, I don't go to the Gym because Gyms are a scam. If you want to get fit go swimming.

To carry his silly-arsed analogy even further, it isn’t enough that Depp gives you a beating and then an island. You’ll need to appreciate the beating, thank Johnny for beating you, and admit that you deserved to be beaten (and never told the reason for the beating). Furthermore, you’ll need to go through all this physical and emotional torture and humiliation without any expectation that there’ll be an island at the end of it.

Boru

[The Grand Nudger]

Completely idiotic as an analogy, but perfectly illustrative of whatever passes for moral character in our new friends immanently bribable constitution.

A moral stand™ amounts to undeserved reward as a sop for unjust punishment. Beliefs such as this, and their societal extensions, will eventually destroy the western world.

[h311inac311]

So eternal paradise is being compared to a tootsie pop? Would if Johnny Depp wanted to punch you in the face and then give you a private Island? I don't know about you but I would be willing to endure that brief amount of suffering in exchange for such a rich reward.

Follow up question, have you ever been to the gym?

If Johnny Depp punched me id kick him in the nuts and tell him he can keep his island. I don't take bribes. no, I don't go to the Gym because Gyms are a scam. If you want to get fit go swimming.

Well I for one would let Mr. Depp kick me in the nuts for different reasons, but that's besides the point. Also, thank you for saying the first thing that I can actually agree with, yes swimming > lifting.

[The Grand Nudger]

Then there you go. Johhny Depps wife is suing the dogshit out of him because nothing shes actually gotten from him is worth being hit - but you, A Christian, would sell your soul for less - on credit.

I'm never going to be able to stop giggling if I, personally..wake up in heaven....and find no christians there.

[GUBU]

They didn't go to heaven, that was c 700 years away from being invented at the time this part of the bible was written.

Have you considered that getting away from Job might be a version of heaven?

Well there is that, though I don't know what the jews would have called it.

[GUBU]

Our picture of the afterlife in the Old Testament is fairly minimal, however what I do know is that God would ultimately be the one to decide what to do with their souls.

The book of Enoch does shed some light on heaven as well as the afterlife, I'm not sure but I think that before Jesus died on the cross those who were counted as righteous before God got to enter a lower-layer of heaven that acted as a waiting room until Jesus opened the gates for all who would accept him. This is more or less just a theory I have because for the most part our Biblical image of the afterlife is murky at best.

My point is simple though, if we're judging this story through the lense of the religion in which it is based then when God decides to kill a life he helped to create their soul is under his authority. He will decide their final resting place. Also, God is above men, the lesson of Job is not that we should try to be like the God whose ways are far above ours, but instead that we should be like Job and keep our morals and our faith even during times of harsh unjust suffering.

Jesus is our ultimate example of how a man should act here on Earth.

You do realise that the christian concept of the soul came from Hellenistic philosophy and not Israelite religion? Judaism had no concept of the soul until some Hellenes converted, and the idea didn't become more than fringe until after it became a central tenet of christianity.

[vulcanlogician]

You do realise that the christian concept of the soul came from Hellenistic philosophy and not Israelite religion?  Judaism had no concept of the soul until some Hellenes converted, and the idea didn't become more than fringe until after it became a central tenet of christianity.

It's disputable though. The Jews had a concept of "the breath" and may have treated it like, "the soul" in certain writings. But the Greek notion of the soul, as something immaterial, is way different than that. There's no doubt.

And so, after Hellenistic influence, it's more probable that those prevailing Hellenistic theories influenced Christianity. This is way more probable than "apocalyptic Judaism suddenly developed a 'Greek' concept of soul."

Christianity's soul concept resembles the Greek concept more than the Hebrew concept. But it's not the consensus of scholars that the Christian concept is totally in line with the Greek concept and not the Hebrew concept. There is some ambiguity there, and some overlap in concepts from both traditions.

[GUBU]

You do realise that the christian concept of the soul came from Hellenistic philosophy and not Israelite religion?  Judaism had no concept of the soul until some Hellenes converted, and the idea didn't become more than fringe until after it became a central tenet of christianity.

It's disputable though. The Jews had a concept of "the breath" and may have treated it like, "the soul" in certain writings. But the Greek notion of the soul, as something immaterial, is way different than that. There's no doubt.

And so, after Hellenistic influence, it's more probable that those prevailing Hellenistic theories influenced Christianity. This is way more probable than "apocalyptic Judaism suddenly developed a 'Greek' concept of soul."

Christianity's soul concept resembles the Greek concept more than the Hebrew concept. But it's not the consensus of scholars that the Christian concept is totally in line with the Greek concept and not the Hebrew concept. There is some ambiguity there, and some overlap in concepts from both traditions.

Again, I have no meas for biblical scholarship, given that it's completely captured by the christian religion and thus prefers the christian prejudice over evidence in all cases.