Is modern era comfortable, but empty?

[Macoleco]

Thanks for the deep insight. Very modern.

Look, fullness of life depends on what you fill your life with.   In any of the past ages there were far less with which to fill anyone’s life, and yet far more people had far less access to even what had been available, compared to now.   This you in your self pitying funk willfully ignore.

You live in an age where there are far more with which to fill any life, and you have access to far more of what is available.     Yet instead of proactively filling your life with more you just bitch and moan about how empty you’ve left your life,  and by way of justifying the effete fruitless self pity you stand up some fantasy idealized vision of the age past that ridiculously generalizes what perhaps 1/10000 of 1% of those who live then had been able to achieve. 

Well, make yourself into an apple so you can compare apples to apples.   Be the modern version of that 1/10000 of 1% of the people, and i guarantee your life will not be empty.

You are completely missing the point. Nowadays from the start since the education, everything is designed into shaping how you think, how you do, and what you will do for the rest of your life. People are less likely to think by themselves, imagine and explore because everything is already “set on stone”. Add to that all the meaningless entertainment that surrounds us every day, and you end up with robots.

You only talk about resources, and I agree that nowadays we have more. I even acknowledged it on the OP. But it is not only about the resources, is what we do with our time, and what we consume. You mentioned illiteracy, yet what do people read nowadays? Reddit, Facebook posts?

Just because we have more nowadays does not mean our thoughts and lives are more free. To the contrary, we may be less free. Companies monitor our behavior 24/7 through our phones.

Also stop attacking me saying things like “self-pity”. As hominem. Grow up

[The Grand Nudger]

Why do you think that human life has ever been some other way? Do you think that the tribal people of wherever/whenever didn't shape the thoughts of their children and prepare them for the tedious humdrum of whatever their lives, by necessity..caste..or class, would be? That things were...somehow, less set in stone then, than now, and the world was filled with more opportunity for those people than it is for people today?

I don't personally think that our lives are more comfortable and more empty today, no. If you do, though, I'd suggest trading some comfort for some meaning..if that's how things work? If that's not possible for you, today, imagine how much more difficult it would be to trade comfort for meaning if you had much less comfort to trade in the first place.

[Macoleco]

Why do you think that human life has ever been some other way? Do you think that the tribal people of wherever/whenever didn't shape the thoughts of their children and prepare them for the tedious humdrum of whatever their lives, by necessity..caste..or class, would be? That things were...somehow, less set in stone then, than now, and the world was filled with more opportunity for those people than it is for people today?

I don't personally think that our lives are more comfortable and more empty today, no. If you do, though, I'd suggest trading some comfort for some meaning..if that's how things work? If that's not possible for you, today, imagine how much more difficult it would be to trade comfort for meaning if you had much less comfort to trade in the first place.

Indeed there has always been indoctrination on our society. Up to what level I guess it depends on the situation.

But my point goes beyond this. Take for example renting nowadays. You have to hire a real state agent, who will then contact the landlord, and then you will have to pay a bunch of fees you don’t even know what they are about. So after paying for the scam (do you have other option?), you end up living in an apartment which design was not decided nor chosen by you. All this according to the capacity that your salary allows it. Through this whole process you as individual have had no input on any of the process besides paying the fees.

Wouldn’t it be better if I could choose where to live, and choose the design of my house? Yes, maybe hundreds years ago I would’ve died of cold, or be murdered by a thug, but at least I had the freedom to choose where to live.

[Aegon]

Lately I have been thinking about the kind of lives that most people lead nowadays, and can’t help but thinking that we are living in such a way that is fundamentally incompatible with our nature.

Nowadays most of our necessities are satisfied, and there is a lot of entertainment available, nowadays pretty much 24/7 thanks to our phones. Work is another factor that comes into play, since we spend most of our day, and perhaps life, working usually meaningless jobs.
Add to that an education that only exists to brainwash us, and teach us a lot of meaningless things.

I think this environment has made us forget what is of most importance in life, and stops us from exploring ourselves, and the world around us. There is more to life than this.

Now I am not romanticizing the past. I know there was a lot of awful stuff around. But those who managed to live (and not be slaves), many lived very fulfilling and adventurous lives, achieved great things. And I think that living through hardships leads to a more fulfilling life and wisdom than scrolling through Tik Tok or Instagram.

Many examples can be mentioned. Writers such as Dante Alighieri, Miguel de Cervantes, scientists such as Galileo, artists such as Da Vinci, philosophers such as Spinoza, and the list goes.

Nowadays too many institutions control how we live, the state and companies together dictate how we live, how we socialize, how we think, where we work, where we live, etc.

Yes modern medicine and anestesia is nice. But there must be more to life than the avoidance of pain (which in some cases is still not possible nowadays).

I will stop the trend of mercilessly shitting on you and say you have a point. We are living in an age of luxury and indulgence, yet rates of depression and anxiety are absurdly high. I think there are a great many issues with the way we've structured modern society.

I've recently listened to a podcast with Dr. Anne Lembke (and subsequently ordered her book, which I should receive in about a week). She's a clinical psychiatrist and professor of psychiatry at Stanford. Her theory is that the way we've structured modern society is relentlessly fucking with our dopamine levels, and being surrounded by instant gratification -  social media, internet porn, junk food with high sugar content, etc etc. - is causing us more anguish than joy. I think it's a great point and I agree with her, especially speaking as a young person who spends so much of my time staring at screens.

I don't think living in the past before modern medicine and clean drinking water is necessarily better than modern society, but the incessant assaults on our dopamine receptors is a serious problem that needs addressing ASAP.

[The Grand Nudger]

Why do you think that human life has ever been some other way?  Do you think that the tribal people of wherever/whenever didn't shape the thoughts of their children and prepare them for the tedious humdrum of whatever their lives, by necessity..caste..or class, would be?  That things were...somehow, less set in stone then, than now, and the world was filled with more opportunity for those people than it is for people today?

I don't personally think that our lives are more comfortable and more empty today, no.  If you do, though, I'd suggest trading some comfort for some meaning..if that's how things work?  If that's not possible for you, today, imagine how much more difficult it would be to trade comfort for meaning if you had much less comfort to trade in the first place.

Indeed there has always been indoctrination on our society. Up to what level I guess it depends on the situation.

I wasn't talking about our society.  We've been engaged in the items you mentioned for far, far longer than our society has existed.  We didn't come up with the idea, it was a continuation of what we were already doing.  To some extent, it's a necessary part of the organization of any group of people no matter the size, time, or circumstances.  We prepare ourselves for the roles we'll play, these roles largely not having been chosen by ourselves.  

But my point goes beyond this. Take for example renting nowadays. You have to hire a real state agent, who will then contact the landlord, and then you will have to pay a bunch of fees you don’t even know what they are about. So after paying for the scam (do you have other option?), you end up living in an apartment which design was not decided nor chosen by you. All this according to the capacity that your salary allows it. Through this whole process you as individual have had no input on any of the process besides paying the fees.

Sure, you have plenty of other options.  There is no law - here at least, stating that you have to do any of that, nor is that the only way to find a place to rent, as you note in the very next sentence, then shifting your ire to the design of a rented place.  There's a way to live in a place you design.  You build it, or have it built.  Yes, you'll have to pay for that to be done, unless you choose to learn how to do some part of it - which many people do...most often to cut costs on the build.  What's the alternative? Hereby order it to be built with other peoples skills and labor...for free?

Wouldn’t it be better if I could choose where to live, and choose the design of my house? Yes, maybe hundreds years ago I would’ve died of cold, or be murdered by a thug, but at least I had the freedom to choose where to live.

You can do both things, and.... unless you're incarcerated, you also get to choose where you live. You may imagine there was some time where you could just plop your ass down in the dirt somewhere..and if you dial the clock far enough back that may be so. OFC, someone would just come along and murder you for having squatted in their territory, but them's the breaks. I think you may be suffering from the myth of a golden age, in addition to some novel ideas about what a golden age would look like. Have you considered life as a hobo? You could do that if you wanted, and still have less risk of being murdered or being eaten by a wild animal. There are things like soup kitchens and homeless shelters to get you through rough spots. You could have the percieved benefits of that life without many of the historic risks of the same.

Would this bring meaning to your life?

[Angrboda]

Lately I have been thinking about the kind of lives that most people lead nowadays, and can’t help but thinking that we are living in such a way that is fundamentally incompatible with our nature.

Nowadays most of our necessities are satisfied, and there is a lot of entertainment available, nowadays pretty much 24/7 thanks to our phones. Work is another factor that comes into play, since we spend most of our day, and perhaps life, working usually meaningless jobs.
Add to that an education that only exists to brainwash us, and teach us a lot of meaningless things.

I think this environment has made us forget what is of most importance in life, and stops us from exploring ourselves, and the world around us. There is more to life than this.

Now I am not romanticizing the past. I know there was a lot of awful stuff around. But those who managed to live (and not be slaves), many lived very fulfilling and adventurous lives, achieved great things. And I think that living through hardships leads to a more fulfilling life and wisdom than scrolling through Tik Tok or Instagram.

Many examples can be mentioned. Writers such as Dante Alighieri, Miguel de Cervantes, scientists such as Galileo, artists such as Da Vinci, philosophers such as Spinoza, and the list goes.

Nowadays too many institutions control how we live, the state and companies together dictate how we live, how we socialize, how we think, where we work, where we live, etc.

Yes modern medicine and anestesia is nice. But there must be more to life than the avoidance of pain (which in some cases is still not possible nowadays).

These are vapid generalizations. Tolstoy has said that, "All happy families are alike, but every unhappy family is unhappy in its own way." In a similar way, meaningfully lived lives tend to share a lot of commonalities, but the specific ways in which the opportunity to live a meaningful life is squandered are unique and idiosyncratic. Generalizing that people on average live less meaningful lives is both hard to justify, but also overlooks the fact that it is at best a gross generalization which is honored more in the breach than anything.

What we can say is, with the exception of the last decade or so, people live longer lives today than they did in the times that you idealize. So which is worth more, a short but meaningful life, or a long life with less import? Regardless of which way you respond, your answer isn't a rational, objective reality but simple a conclusion based upon your perspective and your subjective reality.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Nowadays most of our necessities are satisfied, and there is a lot of entertainment available, nowadays pretty much 24/7 thanks to our phones.

Entertainment comes in many forms, many if not most of which aren't vectored through our phones. I get entertainment and satisfaction from playing my guitar, or going on a hike, for instance. Where and what we choose to entertain ourselves with is a personal decision, so it's fair to point out, I think, that many folks who feel empty from modern entertainment might wish to reappraise their choices in that aspect.

Work is another factor that comes into play, since we spend most of our day, and perhaps life, working usually meaningless jobs.

No argument there, many of us are stuck in empty careers. The trick is to find fulfillment aside from labor, perhaps?

Add to that an education that only exists to brainwash us, and teach us a lot of meaningless things.

That depends on what and how one chooses to find education, though, doesn't it? If you're talking about public schooling, sure, you'd be right. But that is not the only education we can or should receive. I read up on things that interest me, for instance, things that aren't taught in schools. I listen to other people and their experiences and hope to glean some education that way. I observe the world and how it works, and that too is educational assuming I draw useful conclusions. There are many different avenues for education aside from factory-schooling.

I think this environment has made us forget what is of most importance in life, and stops us from exploring ourselves, and the world around us. There is more to life than this.

Now I am not romanticizing the past. I know there was a lot of awful stuff around. But those who managed to live (and not be slaves), many lived very fulfilling and adventurous lives, achieved great things. And I think that living through hardships leads to a more fulfilling life and wisdom than scrolling through Tik Tok or Instagram.

Social media is to entertainment what cotton-candy is to healthy eating. But some folks, they just like eating candy, and hate vegetables.

Many examples can be mentioned. Writers such as Dante Alighieri, Miguel de Cervantes, scientists such as Galileo, artists such as Da Vinci, philosophers such as Spinoza, and the list goes.

And that's where self-education and interests come into play. We can choose to read them, we can choose to play a video game, we can choose to learn a musical instrument and write songs, we can choose to take up sport, whatever. The cool thing about modern tech is that it opens up these avenues for us that were much harder to arrive at even in my youth only a scant forty years ago. Nowadays, if I want to learn how to play death metal on my guitar, or understand the equations for gravity, or read Spinoza, I can log on and search it out rather easily, in most cases.

Nowadays too many institutions control how we live, the state and companies together dictate how we live, how we socialize, how we think, where we work, where we live, etc.

Institutional control has been a thig since loooooooong before the arrival of smart tech. Whether we allow it to control how we think, how we socialize, or where we work or live is a different matter, and much more dependent on the individual, I think.

Yes modern medicine and anestesia is nice. But there must be more to life than the avoidance of pain (which in some cases is still not possible nowadays).

Of course. And nothing's stopping you.

[The Architect Of Fate]

You are completely missing the point. Nowadays from the start since the education, everything is designed into shaping how you think, how you do, and what you will do for the rest of your life. 

Considering for most of human history people didn't get an education period and a good portion of the world's population couldn't even read. I would say we're freer than ever.

People are less likely to think by themselves, imagine and explore because everything is already “set on stone”. Add to that all the meaningless entertainment that surrounds us every day, and you end up with robots.

Yeah because doing back-breaking field labor or later on working in one of the satanic mills was so meaningful and people had so much free time to explore... 

You only talk about resources, and I agree that nowadays we have more. I even acknowledged it on the OP. But it is not only about the resources, is what we do with our time, and what we consume. You mentioned illiteracy, yet what do people read nowadays? Reddit, Facebook posts?

People read more now than they did when they couldn't read and really who are you to say what's worthy of reading? 

Just because we have more nowadays does not mean our thoughts and lives are more free. To the contrary, we may be less free. Companies monitor our behavior 24/7 through our phones.

Ah no you are freer than 90% of the human beings who have ever lived. You are not a slave or a serf. I'll take a government that simply watches to one that comes over and breaks my legs because I was late with my tribute.

Also stop attacking me saying things like “self-pity”. As hominem. Grow up

No this sounds like self-pity and the whining of someone who doesn't get how good they have it. Like a spoiled child who's been given chocolate cake every day and whines that they are being given chocolate muffins.

[BrianSoddingBoru4]

Lately I have been thinking about the kind of lives that most people lead nowadays, and can’t help but thinking that we are living in such a way that is fundamentally incompatible with our nature.

Nowadays most of our necessities are satisfied, and there is a lot of entertainment available, nowadays pretty much 24/7 thanks to our phones. Work is another factor that comes into play, since we spend most of our day, and perhaps life, working usually meaningless jobs.
Add to that an education that only exists to brainwash us, and teach us a lot of meaningless things.

I think this environment has made us forget what is of most importance in life, and stops us from exploring ourselves, and the world around us. There is more to life than this.

Now I am not romanticizing the past. I know there was a lot of awful stuff around. But those who managed to live (and not be slaves), many lived very fulfilling and adventurous lives, achieved great things. And I think that living through hardships leads to a more fulfilling life and wisdom than scrolling through Tik Tok or Instagram.

Many examples can be mentioned. Writers such as Dante Alighieri, Miguel de Cervantes, scientists such as Galileo, artists such as Da Vinci, philosophers such as Spinoza, and the list goes.

Nowadays too many institutions control how we live, the state and companies together dictate how we live, how we socialize, how we think, where we work, where we live, etc.

Yes modern medicine and anestesia is nice. But there must be more to life than the avoidance of pain (which in some cases is still not possible nowadays).

The number of great achievers in any period of history has never been more than a minuscule fraction of the human population. The idea that great achievements aren’t being realized in the modern era is simply not supportable. A brief Google will turn up massive current advancements in science, the arts, and philosophy.

Your moaning kind of boils down to a lack of awareness.

Boru

[The Architect Of Fate]

Lately I have been thinking about the kind of lives that most people lead nowadays, and can’t help but thinking that we are living in such a way that is fundamentally incompatible with our nature.

Then that's a very silly way of thinking 

Nowadays most of our necessities are satisfied, and there is a lot of entertainment available, nowadays pretty much 24/7 thanks to our phones. Work is another factor that comes into play, since we spend most of our day, and perhaps life, working usually meaningless jobs.
Add to that an education that only exists to brainwash us, and teach us a lot of meaningless things.

Considering any formal at all and our jobs are a hell of a lot easier and no less meaningless than it ever was for most people this statement is silly.

I think this environment has made us forget what is of most importance in life, and stops us from exploring ourselves, and the world around us. There is more to life than this.

Considering for most of history most people never left the immediate area they lived in and didn't have time to do "exploring " because they were too busy trying to not fucking die. This statement is silly.

Now I am not romanticizing the past. I know there was a lot of awful stuff around. But those who managed to live (and not be slaves), many lived very fulfilling and adventurous lives, achieved great things. And I think that living through hardships leads to a more fulfilling life and wisdom than scrolling through Tik Tok or Instagram.

The people living in that hardship I imagine would disagree and would happily have taken to Tik Tok or the million other things you as a modern human get to do.

Many examples can be mentioned. Writers such as Dante Alighieri, Miguel de Cervantes, scientists such as Galileo, artists such as Da Vinci, philosophers such as Spinoza, and the list goes.

Yup a bunch of people from reasonably well-off families get to be the poster boys and not the millions who lived short brutal miserable lives who would have called what we have heaven.

Nowadays too many institutions control how we live, the state and companies together dictate how we live, how we socialize, how we think, where we work, where we live, etc.

Lol yeah because the government and religious institutions and the community were so hands-off in the past ...

Yes modern medicine and anestesia is nice. But there must be more to life than the avoidance of pain (which in some cases is still not possible nowadays).
1 kudos given by: Aegon

A man who lost all his children to typhus would likely disagree.