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Why didn't JB join JC?
#11
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(January 27, 2023 at 9:48 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote:
(January 27, 2023 at 4:50 pm)GUBU Wrote: Because Jesus didn't exist, so his inventors used the extant (but dwindling) cult of John to give their cult a false legitimacy.

Well, that's a good Doylist explanation.

A Watsonian explanation would likely point out that this little event got in the way of John and Jesus doing much.
[Image: 424px-Giovanni_di_Paolo_-_The_Beheading_...roject.jpg]

When I think about the stranger parts in the Bible, I tend to look for both explanations, if only because it makes shit more interesting.

And, yes, I did choose that one specifically because it belongs to my local, The Art Institute, which also has a few other paintings by the same artist covering the whole beheading saga.

Again we're dependent on the bible for that description of John the baptist's death, and as is well established, the bible is total fiction.
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#12
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
The writers of the Bible really weren't very good. It's all fiction and makes no sense because they couldn't stay with a plotline. One of those books that should have immediately gone to the clearance table.
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#13
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(January 28, 2023 at 3:18 pm)GUBU Wrote:
(January 27, 2023 at 9:48 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Well, that's a good Doylist explanation.

A Watsonian explanation would likely point out that this little event got in the way of John and Jesus doing much.
[Image: 424px-Giovanni_di_Paolo_-_The_Beheading_...roject.jpg]

When I think about the stranger parts in the Bible, I tend to look for both explanations, if only because it makes shit more interesting.

And, yes, I did choose that one specifically because it belongs to my local, The Art Institute, which also has a few other paintings by the same artist covering the whole beheading saga.

Again we're dependent on the bible for that description of John the baptist's death, and as is well established, the bible is total fiction.
 And its being fiction is literally the point of the Watsonian/Doylist paradigm that I talked about.
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#14
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(January 28, 2023 at 3:22 pm)arewethereyet Wrote: The writers of the Bible really weren't very good.  It's all fiction and makes no sense because they couldn't stay with a plotline.  One of those books that should have immediately gone to the clearance table.
Wasn't their fault.  They never knew each other.  I'd like to say we've gotten better at anthologies but you're never more than one anthology away from being proven wrong there, you know?
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#15
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(January 26, 2023 at 4:57 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: But he was not killed immediately, and when he was alive he was in his cult and even had a successor by some legends.
Before his head was chopped of, he was in prison.

Two major prophets can't exist at the same time and never have, hence why John stated "He must increase, but I must decrease."

also Jesus and John the Baptist were cousins.
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#16
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(January 28, 2023 at 3:18 pm)GUBU Wrote:
(January 27, 2023 at 9:48 pm)Rev. Rye Wrote: Well, that's a good Doylist explanation.

A Watsonian explanation would likely point out that this little event got in the way of John and Jesus doing much.
[Image: 424px-Giovanni_di_Paolo_-_The_Beheading_...roject.jpg]

When I think about the stranger parts in the Bible, I tend to look for both explanations, if only because it makes shit more interesting.

And, yes, I did choose that one specifically because it belongs to my local, The Art Institute, which also has a few other paintings by the same artist covering the whole beheading saga.

Again we're dependent on the bible for that description of John the baptist's death, and as is well established, the bible is total fiction.
*Flavius Josephus has entered the chat*
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#17
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(February 7, 2023 at 1:55 pm)Huggy Bear Wrote:
(January 28, 2023 at 3:18 pm)GUBU Wrote: Again we're dependent on the bible for that description of John the baptist's death, and as is well established, the bible is total fiction.
*Flavius Josephus has entered the chat*

Josephus and the NT give very different accounts of the reasoning behind Herod’s execution of John. Which would you say is wrong?

Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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#18
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
Quote:Before his head was chopped of, he was in prison.

Two major prophets can't exist at the same time and never have, hence why John stated "He must increase, but I must decrease."

also Jesus and John the Baptist were cousins
That is some gold medal mental gymnastics
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#19
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(February 7, 2023 at 1:48 pm)Huggy Bear Wrote:
(January 26, 2023 at 4:57 pm)Fake Messiah Wrote: But he was not killed immediately, and when he was alive he was in his cult and even had a successor by some legends.
Before his head was chopped of, he was in prison.

Two major prophets can't exist at the same time and never have, hence why John stated "He must increase, but I must decrease."

also Jesus and John the Baptist were cousins.

Then either Jesus and John were not ‘major prophets’ or they didn’t live at the same time. Which way will you have it?

Boru
‘I can’t be having with this.’ - Esmeralda Weatherwax
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#20
RE: Why didn't JB join JC?
(February 7, 2023 at 1:48 pm)Huggy Bear Wrote: also Jesus and John the Baptist were cousins.

Yeah, Luke makes John and Jesus cousins, and yet somehow Luke’s John still manages to doubt Jesus, exactly like Matthew’s does, Luke 7:19-24

he sent them to the Lord to ask, “Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?”

When the men came to Jesus, they said, “John the Baptist sent us to you to ask, ‘Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?’”

At that very time Jesus cured many who had diseases, sicknesses and evil spirits, and gave sight to many who were blind. So he replied to the messengers, “Go back and report to John what you have seen and heard: The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor. Blessed is anyone who does not stumble on account of me.”

After John’s messengers left, Jesus began to speak to the crowd about John: “What did you go out into the wilderness to see? A reed swayed by the wind?
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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