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Islam owns atheism with a single verse
#11
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
Kind of weak, right? I seek to live my life with in a way have no “forgiveness” to seek… and when I fail at that…I own it.

Pass.
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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#12
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
(July 8, 2023 at 5:45 pm)Loaded dice Wrote:
(July 8, 2023 at 5:34 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: If I were to convert to Islam, would I have to supply my own sword for hand-chopping, or will one be provided?

Boru

You're obviously not being serious, that's a bad start

I’m extremely serious. If I’m expected to lop bits off of people it seems only fair for the necessary gear to be provided.

Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
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#13
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
(July 8, 2023 at 5:49 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote:
(July 8, 2023 at 5:45 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: You're obviously not being serious, that's a bad start

I’m extremely serious. If I’m expected to lop bits off of people it seems only fair for the necessary gear to be provided.

Boru

What are you talking about
Reply
#14
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
(July 8, 2023 at 5:18 pm)Loaded dice Wrote: Hello members of the forum

Hello Klor.
teachings of the Bible are so muddled and self-contradictory that it was possible for Christians to happily burn heretics alive for five long centuries. It was even possible for the most venerated patriarchs of the Church, like St. Augustine and St. Thomas Aquinas, to conclude that heretics should be tortured (Augustine) or killed outright (Aquinas). Martin Luther and John Calvin advocated the wholesale murder of heretics, apostates, Jews, and witches. - Sam Harris, "Letter To A Christian Nation"
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#15
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
allah is without a doubt, completely make believe.

Just because your tiny, tiny, little mind can't wrap itself around the fact life does not need magic of any sort to justify it, doesn't make your sad case for your pathetically sad imaginary friend any more valid.
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#16
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
(July 8, 2023 at 5:52 pm)Loaded dice Wrote:
(July 8, 2023 at 5:49 pm)BrianSoddingBoru4 Wrote: I’m extremely serious. If I’m expected to lop bits off of people it seems only fair for the necessary gear to be provided.

Boru

What are you talking about

I’m talking about the islamidiot practice of mutilating criminals. Aloha snack bar!

Boru
‘But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods or no gods. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg.’ - Thomas Jefferson
Reply
#17
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
I'm confused.
We know Islam took the Arabic moon god "Sin" and re-worked that god into Al-Ilah, ... the crescent phase of the moon, and called it Allah,
and took many of the ancient customs (such as the Haj) from the Arabic religion and put them into Islam.
We know Allah was one of the (about) 250 gods in the Kabbalah pre Islam ?
We know that many of the ancient Arabic myths and put them into the Quran.
Why is this human-invented religion any different than any other.
Why did Islam originally accept any god from their conquered peoples as long as it was monotheistic.
Why does Islam these days deny the history everyone knows is true.
Why does Islam claim Yahweh of the Jews is the same god they worship when the Bible say to stop worshipping the god Sin, multiple times ?
Why do Islamists not know anything about their real history ?
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell  Popcorn

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist 
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#18
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
(July 8, 2023 at 5:59 pm)no one Wrote: allah is without a doubt, completely make believe.

Just because your tiny, tiny, little mind can't wrap itself around the fact life does not need magic of any sort to justify it, doesn't make your sad case for your pathetically sad imaginary friend any more valid.

Magic isn't like religion, you're lying again.

(July 8, 2023 at 6:10 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote: I'm confused.
We know Islam took the Arabic moon god "Sin" and re-worked that god into Al-Ilah, ... the crescent phase of the moon, and called it Allah,
and took many of the ancient customs (such as the Haj) from the Arabic religion and put them into Islam.
We know Allah was one of the (about) 250 gods in the Kabbalah pre Islam ?
We know that many of the ancient Arabic myths and put them into the Quran.
Why is this human-invented religion any different than any other.
Why did Islam originally accept any god from their conquered peoples as long as it was monotheistic.
Why does Islam these days deny the history everyone knows is true.
Why does Islam claim Yahweh of the Jews is the same god they worship when the Bible say to stop worshipping the god Sin, multiple times ?
Why do Islamists not know anything about their real history ?

Allah means God in Islam, that's it, no overthinking. Your theories about the etymology of the word Allah are unsupported nonsense.
Reply
#19
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
(July 8, 2023 at 6:20 pm)Loaded dice Wrote:
(July 8, 2023 at 5:59 pm)no one Wrote: allah is without a doubt, completely make believe.

Just because your tiny, tiny, little mind can't wrap itself around the fact life does not need magic of any sort to justify it, doesn't make your sad case for your pathetically sad imaginary friend any more valid.

Magic isn't like religion, you're lying again.

(July 8, 2023 at 6:10 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote: I'm confused.
We know Islam took the Arabic moon god "Sin" and re-worked that god into Al-Ilah, ... the crescent phase of the moon, and called it Allah,
and took many of the ancient customs (such as the Haj) from the Arabic religion and put them into Islam.
We know Allah was one of the (about) 250 gods in the Kabbalah pre Islam ?
We know that many of the ancient Arabic myths and put them into the Quran.
Why is this human-invented religion any different than any other.
Why did Islam originally accept any god from their conquered peoples as long as it was monotheistic.
Why does Islam these days deny the history everyone knows is true.
Why does Islam claim Yahweh of the Jews is the same god they worship when the Bible say to stop worshipping the god Sin, multiple times ?
Why do Islamists not know anything about their real history ?

Allah means God in Islam, that's it, no overthinking. Your theories about the etymology of the word Allah are unsupported nonsense.


It's not MY theory. There are multiple proofs and references for what I said. Multiple. I will post them, and YOU will be the cause of the scandal.
Allah no likey that shit.
The fact you are totally ignorant of the history of Islam is of no import. Totally utterly ignorant. 
The fact is, Muhammad never existed. 



Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell  Popcorn

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist 
Reply
#20
RE: Islam owns atheism with a single verse
Originally, Allah had 3 daughters, and Muhammad commanded they be worshiped, and later said he had made a mistake. Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat. ->
http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-allahs-daughters.htm Later the Prophet rejected these, as work of the devil, (see the Satanic Verses).
Yahweh had no daughters. Sin had THE SAME 3 daughters. It is incontrovertible PROOF. SIN IS ALLAH.

Many stories in the Qur'an were "borrowed" from surrounding cultures, and well known circulating myths, and cultural historians know exactly where they came from :

1. Moses and the Fish, (came from Babylon/Ugarit/the El myths),
2. Solomon listening to the ants, common fairy tales, existing all over the Ancient Near East,
3. Jinns, (genies) working for Solomon, both common fairy tales, existing all over the Ancient Near East,
4. Mary in the temple, (stolen from one of the proto gospels),
5. Jesus talking in the crib, (from the known Proto Gospel after Jacob)
6. The Egyptian child stories, (from the Arab Child Gospel, and The Thomas' Child Gospel), both just made up fairy stories.
7. Jesus making birds from clay, (known source, .."The Child Gospel after Thomas vs 1-4),
8. Mary and the Palm, was taken from the Proto Gospel of Matthew, Chapter 20.
9. Mo's Night Journey to Heaven, taken from either the Hebrew Merebah, or the well known Gnostic "Enoc's Journey to Heaven", which is identical to to Ibn Ishaq’s story after Abu Said al-Chudri)
10. The Sleepers in the Cave, straight from the fairy story from Ephesus, (Mo got the dates wrong, but the story is right),
11. Alexander the Great, (Surah 18), (straight plagiarism), AND there was NO place in the world with enough iron blocks to close off a whole valley in 330 BC.
12. The myth about Ad. Straight from Arab folk tales.
13. Thamud – same as 12.
14. Median – copied from Arab folk tales.

1. Archaeology and location. The cult of Yahweh flourished to the North and West, of the sites where the Sin was prevalent.The artifacts are different. The "consorts", (wives) are different. Sin had mythological children. Yahweh did not. They cannot be the same god.

2. Scholarly consensus.

"Allah is found ... in Arabic inscriptions prior to Islam" (Encyclopedia Britannica, I:643)

"The Arabs, before the time of Mohammed, accepted and worshiped, a supreme god called allah" (Encyclopedia of Islam, eds. Houtsma, Arnold, Basset, Hartman; Leiden: E.J.Brill, 1913, I:302)

"Allah was known to the pre-Islamic Arabs; he was one of the Meccan deities" (Encyclopedia of Islam, ed. Gibb, I:406)

"Ilah ... appears in pre-Islamic poetry ... By frequency of usage, al-ilah was contracted to allah, frequently attested to in pre-Islamic poetry" (Encyclopedia of Islam, eds. Lewis, Menage, Pellat, Schacht; Leiden: E.J.Brill, 1971, III:1093)

"The name Allah goes back before Muhammed" (Encyclopedia of World Mythology and Legend, "The Facts on File", ed. Anthony Mercatante, New York, 1983, I:41)

The origin of this (Allah) goes back to pre-Muslim times. Allah is not a common name meaning "God" (or a "god"), and the Muslim must use another word or form if he wishes to indicate any other than his own peculiar deity" (Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics, ed. James Hastings, Edinburgh: T & T Clark, 1908, I:326)

Scholar Henry Preserved Smith of Harvard University stated:
"Allah was already known by name to the Arabs" (The Bible and Islam: or, the Influence of the Old and New Testament on the Religion of Mohammed, New York: Charles Scribner's Sons, 1897, p.102)

Dr. Kenneth Cragg, former editor of the prestigious scholarly journal Muslim World and an outstanding modern Western Islamic scholar, whose works were generally published by Oxford University, comments:
The name Allah is also evident in archaeological and literary remains of pre-Islamic Arabia" (The Call of the Minaret, New York: OUP, 1956, p.31)

Dr. W. Montgomery Watt, who was Professor of Arabic and Islamic Studies at Edinburgh University and Visiting Professor of Islamic Studies at College de France, Georgetown University, and the University of Toronto, has done extensive work on the pre-Islamic concept of Allah. He concludes:
"In recent years I have become increasingly convinced that for an adequate understanding of the career of Muhammad and the origins of Islam great importance must be attached to the existence in Mecca of belief in Allah as a "high god". In a sense this is a form of paganism, but it is so different from paganism as commonly understood that it deserves separate treatment" (Mohammad's Mecca, p.vii. See also his article, "Belief in a High God in pre-Islamic Mecca", Journal of Scientific Semitic Studies, vol.16, 1971, pp.35-40)

Caesar Farah in his book on Islam concludes his discussion of the pre-Islamic meaning of Allah by saying:
"There is no reason, therefore, to accept the idea that Allah passed to the Muslims from the Christians and Jews" (Islam: Beliefs and Observations, New York: Barrons, 1987, p.28)

According to Middle East scholar E.M.Wherry, whose translation of the Qur'an is still used today, in pre-Islamic times Allah-worship, as well as the worship of Baal, were both astral religions in that they involved the worship of the sun, the moon, and the stars (A Comprehensive Commentary on the Quran, Osnabrück: Otto Zeller Verlag, 1973, p.36).
"In ancient Arabia, the sun-god was viewed as a female goddess and the moon as the male god. As has been pointed out by many scholars as Alfred Guilluame, the moon god was called by various names, one of which was Allah (op.cit., Islam, p.7)
"The name Allah was used as the personal name of the moon god, in addition to the other titles that could be given to him.
"Allah, the moon god, was married to the sun goddess. Together they produced three goddesses who were called 'the daughters of Allah'. These three goddesses were called Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat.
"The daughters of Allah, along with Allah and the sun goddess were viewed as "high" gods. That is, they were viewed as being at the top of the pantheon of Arabian deities" (Robert Morey, The Islamic Invasion, Eugene, Oregon, Harvest House Publishers, 1977, pp.50-51).

The Encyclopedia of World Mythology and Legend records:
"Along with Allah, however, they worshiped a host of lesser gods and "daughters of Allah" (op.cit., I:61).

The Encyclopedia of Religion says: "'Allah' is a pre-Islamic name ... corresponding to the Babylonian Bel" (ed. James Hastings, Edinburgh, T. & T. Clark, 1908, I:326).

It is a well known fact archaeologically speaking that the crescent moon was the symbol of worship of the moon god both in Arabia and throughout the Middle East in pre-Islamic times. Archaeologists have excavated numerous statues and hieroglyphic inscriptions in which a crescent moon was seated on the top of the head of the deity to symbolize the worship of the moon-god. Interestingly, whilst the moon was generally worshiped as a female deity in the Ancient Near East, the Arabs viewed it as a male deity.

In Mesopotamia the Sumerian god Nanna, named Sîn by the Akkadians, was worshiped in particular in Ur, where he was the chief god of the city, and also in the city of Harran in Syria, which had close religious links with Ur. The Ugaritic texts have shown that there a moon deity was worshiped under the name yrh. On the monuments the god is represented by the symbol of the crescent moon. At Hazor in Palestine a small Canaanite shrine of the late Bronze Age was discovered which contained a basalt stele depicting two hands lifted as if in prayer to a crescent moon, indicating that the shrine was dedicated to the moon god.

The worship of stellar deities, instead of Yahweh, was always a temptation faced by the Israelites (Dt.4:19; Jer.7:18; Am.5:26; Ac.7:43). But Yahweh is at the zenith of the heavens (Job 22:12).

"The Quraysh tribe into which Mohammad was born was particularly devoted to Allah, the moon god, and especially to Allah's three daughters who were viewed as intercessors between the people and Allah.

"The worship of the three goddesses, Al-Lat, Al-Uzza, and Manat, played a significant rôle in the worship at the Kabah in Mecca. The first two daughters of Allah had names which were feminine forms of Allah."The literal Arabic name of Muhammad's father was Abd-Allah. His uncle's name was Obied-Allah. These names reveal the personal devotion that Muhammad's pagan family had to the worship of Allah, the moon god" ( Morey, p.51).

History proves conclusively that before Islam came into existence, the Sabbeans in Arabia worshiped the moon-god Allah who was married to the sun-goddess. We have also seen that it was a matter of common practice to use the name of the moon-god in personal names in Muhammad's tribe. That Allah was a pagan deity in pre-Islamic times is incontestable. And so we must ask ourselves the question: why was Muhammad's God named after a pagan deity in his own tribe?

It is an undeniable fact that an Allah idol was set up at the Kabah along with all the other idols of the time. The pagans prayed towards Mecca and the Kabah because that is where their gods were stationed. It made sense to them to face in the direction of their god and pray since that is where he was. Since the idol of their moon god, Allah, was at Mecca, they prayed towards Mecca.

As we have seen, and as is acknowledged amongst all scholars of Middle Eastern religious history, the worship of the moon-god extended far beyond Allah-worship in Arabia. The entire fertile crescent was involved in moon-worship. The data falls neatly in place and we are able therefore to understand, in part, the early success Islam had amongst Arab groups that had traditionally worshiped Allah, the moon-god. We can also understand that the use of the crescent moon as the symbol of Islam, and which appears on dozens of flags of Islamic nations in Asia and Africa, and surmounts minarets and mosque roofs, is a throwback to the days when Allah was worshiped as the moon-god in Mecca.

Nabonidus (555-539 BC), was the last king of Babylon, and he built Tayma, Arabia as a center of Moon-god worship. Segall stated, "South Arabia's "stellar religion" has always been dominated by the Moon-god in various forms" (Some scholars have also noticed that the Moon-god's name "Sin" is a part of such Arabic words as "Sin-ai," the "wilderness of Sin," etc.) Mecca was built as a shrine for the Moon-god. This is what made it the most sacred site of Arabian paganism. In 1944, G. Caton Thompson revealed in her book, "The Tombs and Moon Temple of Hureidha", that she had uncovered a temple of the Moon-god in southern Arabia. The symbols of the crescent moon and no less than twenty-one inscriptions with the name Sin were found in this temple. An idol which may be the Moon-god himself was also discovered. This was confirmed by other well-known archeologists.

In 1944, G. Caton Thompson revealed in her book, The Tombs and Moon Temple of Hureidah, that she had uncovered a temple of the moon-god in southern Arabia (see map above). The symbols of the crescent moon and no less than 21 inscriptions with the name Sîn were found in this temple (see above left). An idol which is probably the moon-god himself was also discovered (see above right). This was later confirmed by other well-known archaeologists (See Richard Le Baron Bower Jr. and Frank P. Albright, Archaeological Discoveries in South Arabia, Baltimore, John Hopkins University Press, 1958, p.78ff; Ray Cleveland, An Ancient South Arabian Necropolis, Baltimore, John Hopkins University Press, 1965; Nelson Gleuck, Deities and Dolphins, New York, Farrar, Strauss and Giroux, 1965).

Worship of the Moon god continued in the Christian era. Evidence gathered from both North and South Arabia demonstrate that Moon-god worship was clearly active even in Muhammad's day and was still the dominant cult. According to numerous inscriptions, while the name of the Moon-god was Sin, his title was al-ilah, i.e. "the deity," meaning that he was the chief or high god among the gods. As Dr. Coon pointed out, "The god Il or Ilah was originally a phase of the Moon God." The Moon-god was called al-ilah, i.e. the god, which was shortened to Allah in pre-Islamic times. The pagan Arabs even used Allah in the names they gave to their children. For example, both Muhammad's father and uncle had Allah as part of their names. The fact that they were given such names by their pagan parents proves that Allah was the title for the Moon-god even in Muhammad's day. Prof. Coon goes on to say, "Similarly, under Mohammed's tutelage, the relatively anonymous Ilah, became Al-Ilah, The God, or Allah, the Supreme Being."

The word "Allah" comes from the compound Arabic word, al-ilah. Al is the definite article "the" and ilah is an Arabic word for "god", i.e. the god. We see immediately that (a) this is not a proper name but a generic name rather like the Hebrew El (which as we have seen was used of any deity; and (b) that Allah is not a foreign word (as it would have been if it had been borrowed from the Hebrew Bible) but a purely Arabic one. It would also be wrong to compare "Allah" with the Hebrew or Greek for God (El and Theos, respectively), because "Allah" is purely an Arabic term used exclusively in reference to an Arabic deity.
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell  Popcorn

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist 
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