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I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
#61
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 4:11 pm)Lek Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 4:06 pm)Angrboda Wrote: It wasn't originally inhabited.
I guess you're right there. If things happen, they just happen. That's one way to look at it.

Things don't just happen. 
Order arises spontaneously in this universe, (see Chaos Theory), 
Evolution is a fact. Natural selection is a fact. It's not "chance" on that level. 
Random mutation IS by chance.
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell  Popcorn

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist 
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#62
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
Quote:Explain your answer.
What's there to explain?
"Change was inevitable"


Nemo sicut deus debet esse!

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 “No matter what men think, abortion is a fact of life. Women have always had them; they always have and they always will. Are they going to have good ones or bad ones? Will the good ones be reserved for the rich, while the poor women go to quacks?”
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#63
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 5:45 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 4:11 pm)Lek Wrote: I guess you're right there. If things happen, they just happen. That's one way to look at it.

Things don't just happen. 
Order arises spontaneously in this universe, (see Chaos Theory), 
Evolution is a fact. Natural selection is a fact. It's not "chance" on that level. 
Random mutation IS by chance.
Of course I agree with you. I was just being facetious because the person said things just happen and we just deal with them. What kind of process do you think the universe works through to maintain order. Is it inherent in the makeup from the beginning? Does the universe have a brain and causes these things to happen because of chemical reactions in that brain?
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#64
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 7:38 pm)Lek Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 5:45 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote: Things don't just happen. 
Order arises spontaneously in this universe, (see Chaos Theory), 
Evolution is a fact. Natural selection is a fact. It's not "chance" on that level. 
Random mutation IS by chance.
Of course I agree with you. I was just being facetious because the person said things just happen and we just deal with them. What kind of process do you think the universe works through to maintain order. Is it inherent in the makeup from the beginning? Does the universe have a brain and causes these things to happen because of chemical reactions in that brain?

It's complicated. See this, and if it doesn't explain it, I might be able to assist. 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory
https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/ear...0processes.
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell  Popcorn

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist 
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#65
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 7:38 pm)Lek Wrote: What kind of process do you think the universe works through to maintain order. Is it inherent in the makeup from the beginning? Does the universe have a brain and causes these things to happen because of chemical reactions in that brain?

I think it's inherent - matter and energy interacting in consistent ways because of things like atomic structure.
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#66
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 7:57 pm)Astreja Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 7:38 pm)Lek Wrote: What kind of process do you think the universe works through to maintain order. Is it inherent in the makeup from the beginning? Does the universe have a brain and causes these things to happen because of chemical reactions in that brain?

I think it's inherent - matter and energy interacting in consistent ways because of things like atomic structure.
Thanks. It's too complicated to absorb in one reading, but I'll study it some more.
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#67
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 3:51 pm)Lek Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 3:44 pm)Helios Wrote: If the universe wasn't planned for us it's highly likely it would be a hostile environment

Explain your answer.

The fucking audacity to demand explanations from others for their views, but offering none for your own.
Thief and assassin for hire. Member in good standing of the Rogues Guild.
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#68
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 2:04 pm)h4ym4n Wrote: Why would creator of everything create murder and make it joyful?

god could have written it on everyone’s heart that murder is a very unpleasant thing to do.  And rape would be another thing it could have programmed us not to want to do and get us to believe it is a free will desire not to rape or murder.

Don’t you think Lek?
I haven't figured that out yet. While we're at it, I also have a question for you. Why would a universe that just happens to be here be so hostile to it's inhabitants?


It's not. Millions of species evolved and thrived for many millions of years.
Evolution doesn't care about individuals. It promotes survival of species.
We are indoctrinated with the notion of "individualism".
It hasn't always been that way. Individualism came from Greece in about 500-300 BC to the Levant.
It's actually why during that period, the Jewish prophets began to insist on monotheism, an individual deity.
Before that, Israel was polytheistic.
Before that, "immortality" consisted in the continuity of the male line.
That changed with individualism.
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell  Popcorn

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist 
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#69
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 8:22 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 3:05 pm)Lek Wrote: I haven't figured that out yet. While we're at it, I also have a question for you. Why would a universe that just happens to be here be so hostile to it's inhabitants?


It's not. Millions of species evolved and thrived for many millions of years.
Evolution doesn't care about individuals. It promotes survival of species.
We are indoctrinated with the notion of "individualism".
It hasn't always been that way. Individualism came from Greece in about 500-300 BC to the Levant.
It's actually why during that period, the Jewish prophets began to insist on monotheism, an individual deity.
Before that, Israel was polytheistic.
Before that, "immortality" consisted in the continuity of the male line.
That changed with individualism.
Most of those species that survived got wiped out.
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#70
RE: I literally cannot avoid sinning; so, why...
(July 22, 2023 at 8:57 pm)Lek Wrote:
(July 22, 2023 at 8:22 pm)Bucky Ball Wrote: It's not. Millions of species evolved and thrived for many millions of years.
Evolution doesn't care about individuals. It promotes survival of species.
We are indoctrinated with the notion of "individualism".
It hasn't always been that way. Individualism came from Greece in about 500-300 BC to the Levant.
It's actually why during that period, the Jewish prophets began to insist on monotheism, an individual deity.
Before that, Israel was polytheistic.
Before that, "immortality" consisted in the continuity of the male line.
That changed with individualism.
Most of those species that survived got wiped out.

Not for a long long time. Maybe their jobs were accomplished.
You are correct, ... I may have heard 98% are now extinct. 
There are now 8.7  million species still alive. Evolution doesn't care.
Humans *need* to find meaning. It's very understandable. It promotes survival. Growing up means that's not always possible.
Every religion is true one way or another. It is true when understood metaphorically. But when it gets stuck in its own metaphors, interpreting them as facts, then you are in trouble. - Joseph Campbell  Popcorn

Militant Atheist Commie Evolutionist 
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