Do humans have souls?

[athoughtfulman]

I reckon there is an energy in everything, I can't really say why, and I'm not saying it's a fact, merely an opinion.

As to what it is, I have no idea. But I like the idea that science still has a long way to go to find out everything, if it ever would. It seems the more we learn, the more there is to learn. There will never be an end to discovery (hopefully), and I think we'll be in for a few surprises as science advances.

[fr0d0]

I think the soul could also be described as your God spot. The part of you that can accommodate God. If he isn't there, you can fill it with other stuff like shopping, materialism, greed etc etc, which are all negative and bring you down. Not saying that being a Christian is the only way to be healthy, but it makes clear & simple guidelines to stop the rot.

I so want to say to you that that is just "b#llocks" but I won't ... instead I will simply say that you've made a number of assertions. Now justify them.

How exactly? Those are common observations of people's idea of what the soul is. I suspect that you don't accept the soul as existent, so of course to you this is meaningless. The ideas ask you to step outside of your own understanding and consider other peoples.

Well it seems pretty clearly the opposite of the meaning of soul to any dictionary definition I've ever seen. Can you show me a definition that would remotely suggest an actual physical object?

Can you show us anything that is pretty much universally agreed to exist for which there is no evidence?

I'll take that as a no.

Gravity isn't a physical object, yet there is evidence of gravity.

I was asking for a definition of the soul to support your interpretation.

[Giff]

No, humans don't have souls. We have brains

[Kyuuketsuki]

Can you show us anything that is pretty much universally agreed to exist for which there is no evidence?

I'll take that as a no.

And I'll take that as you being unable to answer the question.

BTW, the answer to your first question is that there are plenty of definitions or understandings for soul that imply a link to the real world such as this from Wikipedia:

In many religions and parts of philosophy, the soul is the immaterial part of a person. It is usually thought to consist of one's thoughts and personality, and can be synonymous with the spirit, mind or self.

This is self-evident rubbish because personality and emotion (self if you like) can change massively in the event of mental damage of various kinds.

Kyu

[fr0d0]

@ Kyu

What I asked Adrian was: Show me a description of the soul as a physical object

To which your answer is: "In many religions and parts of philosophy, the soul is the immaterial part of a person. It is usually thought to consist of one's thoughts and personality, and can be synonymous with the spirit, mind or self."

???

So, back to your question: "Can you show us anything that is pretty much universally agreed to exist for which there is no evidence?"

So taken in context, what I think you're asking is: As the soul isn't a physical object, can it exist? As I've said very many times now, spiritually perfect definitions require there to be no proof.

You may need proof, but I'm afraid it is a ridiculous pursuit, as I've shown. That you choose to remain obstinately narrow minded of the subject is your position. Until that position changes, a lot of the world isn't going to make sense to you.

[Kyuuketsuki]

What I asked Adrian was: Show me a description of the soul as a physical object

To which your answer is: "In many religions and parts of philosophy, the soul is the immaterial part of a person. It is usually thought to consist of one's thoughts and personality, and can be synonymous with the spirit, mind or self."

???

For the umpteenth time I have to ask, are you being deliberately obtuse?

If the soul is the seat of personality and emotion then it CANNOT be affected negatively or positively by changes in the body or, more specifically, the brain. The fact that changes to the brain (as a result of malfunction/damage) does affect (sometimes significantly) both personality and emotion means that the soul, if it exists, CANNOT be the seat of such things. Also, to claim that the soul is the seat of things that are very evidently affected by the biological malfunction IMPLICITLY states that the soul is physical or has a physical component. In other words your implied claim that the soul is immaterial or even real is just your usual rubbish/wishful thinking.

So, back to your question: "Can you show us anything that is pretty much universally agreed to exist for which there is no evidence?"

So taken in context, what I think you're asking is: As the soul isn't a physical object, can it exist? As I've said very many times now, spiritually perfect definitions require there to be no proof.

You have SHOWN nothing of the sort and any attempt to separate the soul (or your god) from the established rules of evidence and criticism is nothing more than SPECIAL PLEADING on your part.

I reiterate the example of the teapot in orbit between Earth & Mars ... it's there, most definitely, regardless of whether you can see it or not.

You may need proof, but I'm afraid it is a ridiculous pursuit, as I've shown. That you choose to remain obstinately narrow minded of the subject is your position. Until that position changes, a lot of the world isn't going to make sense to you.

In your eyes perhaps but then, since you routinely engage in wishful thinking and subsequent beliefs/claims that things of the imagination are real, your view is laughable.

A lot of what world? The warped one you exist in or the one that I, as most science adherents, choose to believe (with reason) is inherently explainable and governed by physical laws that make sense? Thanks but no thanks ... I think I'll continue to inhabit the world of the rational.

EDIT: And if you look at the replies below you'll see that, whilst my style is uncompromising, they all say pretty much the same thing as I am. To claim that something needs no evidence is bad enough, to claim it can't have evidence is worse but to claim that the utter lack of evidence is not onloy expected but proof of such things is, to my mind (and I suspect of others here), self evidently ludicrous.

Kyu

[Edwardo Piet]

And no proof is a good reason to believe in a soul?

Because there are many other things without proof.

Having no proof and having to base your belief in a soul 'on faith' is completely baseless really...

There are many other things that lack evidence to believe in....

So why believe in a soul? What reasons do you have? There are plenty unprovable things that lack evidence and therefore 'require faith'...

Is something being unprovable and lacking evidence (requiring faith) a GOOD reason to be believed in in your eyes?

EvF

[Eilonnwy]

As I've said very many times now, spiritually perfect definitions require there to be no proof.

Of course, define something so it's out of the reach of logic and evidence so you can keep your supernatural beliefs in a tiny little box that no one else can touch.

I still find it ridiculous that you come to this forum, assert there is no proof but tirelessly spew circular arguments. It would be like me saying Unicorns exist, there's no evidence of them, but even without evidence I know they are pink and travel in groups of 4. You can't claim something has no evidence then in the next breathe claim to know anything about that which has no evidence.

[Edwardo Piet]

"There is no evidence of invisible, intangible, inaudible spearmint flavoured Goblins...so belief in them requires faith....I have strong faith in them and this is a good reason to believe they exist...so they probably do - at least to me personally if it's NOT true for others - then it's at least true for me!"

Lol.

EvF

[Tiberius]

Gravity isn't a physical object, yet there is evidence of gravity.

I was asking for a definition of the soul to support your interpretation.

No, you wanted me to find a definition of a soul as a physical object. I never said a soul was a physical object, I said I wanted evidence ("show me a soul and I'll believe in a soul").

We can see physical objects, and we can see the effects of the non-physical (forces such as gravity). Whether the soul is physical or non-physical, it shouldn't matter. There still should be evidence.