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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 20, 2011 at 11:35 pm
Here's a quote from Ben Franklin (at least in 1776 form) about this very subject:
A rebellion is always legal in the first person, such as "our rebellion." It is only in the third person - "their rebellion" - that it becomes illegal.
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 20, 2011 at 11:47 pm
As far as secession goes, the states are all volunteers in the union and have the right to 'unvolunteer'. This is not the same as the colonists that were here under British rule.
"No taxation without representation", which meant they wanted a 'say so' in the government, was reason enough to declare independence. And as Min said, "You lost the war. Get over it.". So, whether or not it was legal, (and it was not), it is now a moot point.
What of the legality of taking the American Indians land? The British government has their fair share also of illegal conquests.
Once the war is over, the fat lady has sung.
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 12:02 am
At this point, can I just ask if any of the remarks on this thread are directed at me? I know I'm probably being too sensitive, I apologise I can feel my mood is on a downward spiral as I type, so I'm trying not to write anything I'll have to retract later if I'm still around. I just want to point out that the BBC article, its connotations and the opinions it expresses are not my own, I simply tossed in the link to feed the board so I apologise if I caused any offence. It wasn't my intention at all.
But of course you all already knew that and I'm just being stupid. Please forgive me and pay me no further mind. I think I'll have to take another leave of absence for a while.
Sorry again.
At the age of five, Skagra decided emphatically that God did not exist. This revelation tends to make most people in the universe who have it react in one of two ways - with relief or with despair. Only Skagra responded to it by thinking, 'Wait a second. That means there's a situation vacant.'
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 12:11 am
(This post was last modified: October 21, 2011 at 12:12 am by IATIA.)
All this happened over two hundred years ago. Who cares now except a bunch of bored lawyers. Besides, we won. Na na na na boo boo. 
(Psst ... Hey, wanna try again?)
You make people miserable and there's nothing they can do about it, just like god.
-- Homer Simpson
God has no place within these walls, just as facts have no place within organized religion.
-- Superintendent Chalmers
Science is like a blabbermouth who ruins a movie by telling you how it ends. There are some things we don't want to know. Important things.
-- Ned Flanders
Once something's been approved by the government, it's no longer immoral.
-- The Rev Lovejoy
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 12:18 am
(This post was last modified: October 21, 2011 at 12:59 am by DeistPaladin.)
(October 20, 2011 at 7:59 pm)Stimbo Wrote: Courtesy of BBC News:
Is the US Declaration of Independence illegal?
So if we can settle this out of court, do we get our country back?
Hmmmm, excuse me. I'm going to think about this for a moment.
Universal health care
Great arts community, if London is any indication
Multiple political parties
Great comedy
Less religion
OK, you've got my attention.
Quote:Oh well, we could evict the tenants;
Presumably you refer to the knuckle-dragging, slope-brow, inbred, Fox-watching, Tea-bagging, red-neck dumbasses that keep electing Republicans and wrecking things in my country.
Hmmmm.
(singing) "God save our noble queen..."
Oh, by the way, another piece of historical trivia:
Our Constitution isn't legal either, according to the original Articles of Confederation.
American history books sometimes gloss over this point but our founder's first attempt at creating a nation was a dismal failure. We feared a central government and the power of the executive so much we created an ineffectual loose knit confederation of states. The union between states was so tenuous that at one point, two of them very nearly went to war with each other.
in 1787, several years after we were recognized by Britain as independent, our founders hit the "do over" button and created what we now know as our Constitution. This was technically not a legal document, since the Articles of Confederation required unanimous consent by the 13 states. As I remember, we were one state short at that time.
Sorry for the lack of details. I'm going by memory of my college course from 23 years ago.
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 1:12 am
Quote:our founder's first attempt at creating a nation was a dismal failure. We feared a central government and the power of the executive so much we created an ineffectual loose knit confederation of states.
Another thing that these tea-bagging shitheads have forgotten...or never knew.
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 8:52 am
@The OP: Yes, lol, several. We make it work for us though right?
I am the Infantry. I am my country’s strength in war, her deterrent in peace. I am the heart of the fight… wherever, whenever. I carry America’s faith and honor against her enemies. I am the Queen of Battle. I am what my country expects me to be, the best trained Soldier in the world. In the race for victory, I am swift, determined, and courageous, armed with a fierce will to win. Never will I fail my country’s trust. Always I fight on…through the foe, to the objective, to triumph overall. If necessary, I will fight to my death. By my steadfast courage, I have won more than 200 years of freedom. I yield not to weakness, to hunger, to cowardice, to fatigue, to superior odds, For I am mentally tough, physically strong, and morally straight. I forsake not, my country, my mission, my comrades, my sacred duty. I am relentless. I am always there, now and forever. I AM THE INFANTRY! FOLLOW ME!
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 10:58 am
(October 21, 2011 at 1:12 am)Minimalist Wrote: Quote:our founder's first attempt at creating a nation was a dismal failure. We feared a central government and the power of the executive so much we created an ineffectual loose knit confederation of states.
Another thing that these tea-bagging shitheads have forgotten...or never knew.
Let's start with how the original Tea Party was a rebellion against the economic stranglehold of a corporation and the new "Tea Party" is an astroturf creation of the corporations to support corporate interests.
Their grasp of history goes downhill from there.
Atheist Forums Hall of Shame:
"The trinity can be equated to having your cake and eating it too."
... -Lucent, trying to defend the Trinity concept
"(Yahweh's) actions are good because (Yahweh) is the ultimate standard of goodness. That’s not begging the question"
... -Statler Waldorf, Christian apologist
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 11:01 am
(This post was last modified: October 21, 2011 at 11:02 am by KichigaiNeko.)
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Everything is built on a lie 
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RE: Is America built on a lie?
October 21, 2011 at 11:33 am
Obvious article is obvious - and yet still Wrote:The Declaration of Independence was not only illegal, but actually treasonable
WHAT?!?!? It's ILLEGAL to overthrow your government?!?! SHOCKING!! **insert massive eye-roll here**
sorry about the illegal rebellion Britain ... but the land is just primo!
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