Obey rulers no matter how evil they are! (ugly side of Sunni Islam)

[Mystic]

Here are some hadiths about obeying rulers no matter what:

The Messenger of Allaah said: "Whoever disapproves of something done by his ruler then he should be patient, for whoever disobeys the ruler even a little will die as those who died in the Pre-Islaamic Period of Ignorance (i.e. as rebellious Sinners)." (Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim)

Sahih Muslim Hadith Hadith 4554
Hudhaifah (radhiAllaahu anhu) narrated in a long hadeeth that the Messenger of Allaah (sallAllaahu 'alaihi wa sallam) said,
"There will come leaders who will not follow my guidance nor will they follow my Sunnah. There will be amongst them men who will have the hearts of devils in the bodies of humans." He (Hudhaifah) asked, "What should I do O Messenger of Allaah if I reach that?" He replied, "You should hear and obey the ruler. Even if he flogs your back and takes your wealth you should still hear and obey."

Sahih Muslim Hadith
Hadith 4524 Narrated by AbuHurayrah
The Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) said: It is obligatory for you to listen to the ruler and obey him in adversity and prosperity, in pleasure and displeasure, and even when another person is given (rather undue) preference over you.

Sahih Muslim Hadith
Hadith 4551 Narrated by Alqamah ibn Wa'il al-Hadrami
It has been narrated on the authority of Alqamah ibn Wa'il al-Hadrami who learnt the tradition from his father. The latter said: Salamah ibn Yazid al-Ju'afi asked the Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him): Prophet of Allah, what do you think if we have rulers who rule over us and demand that we discharge our obligations towards them, but they (themselves) do not discharge their own responsibilities towards us? What do you order us to do? The Messenger of Allah (peace be upon him) avoided giving any answer. Salamah asked him again. He (again) avoided giving any answer. Then he asked again--it was the second time or the third time-- when Ash'ath ibn Qays (find that the Holy Prophet was being unnecessarily pressed for answer) pulled him aside and said: Listen to them and obey them, for on them will be their burden and on you will be your burden.

There is more such hadiths, but that is enough.

Notice these hadiths don't even state you can disobey him when he tells you to disobey God. That is something Sunnis take implied but really they are being commanded to obey without condition.

Instead of Quran and Sunnah providing a way to establish just society, instead of telling them how to make sure to have just rulers ruling over them and have the ruler accountable to the people, they were told to obey whatever ruler will rule them and stay obedient to them no matter how evil they become.

Some other hadiths talk about disobeying them when the command disobedience to God, and other hadiths say as long they establish Prayers, but as you can see, these hadiths don't have such conditions. But even those hadiths are not that great either, basically, you can't overthrow a tyrant or a bad ruler.

This is to me is the ugly side of Sunnism. What distinguishes Sunnism from Shiism is really that Sunnism accepted the rulership of the Caliphs, while Shiism rejected them and held there were divinely appointed leaders to be obeyed instead.

At least in Shia tradition, there is uprising of Imam Hussain, against the ruler, as well as uprising Hussain's grandson, Zaid ibn Ali ibn Hussain.

When you allow tyrant rulers to rule over you, and don't put them in check, your bound to have injustice.

Now back in the day of the sword, it was much easier to rise up and overthrow a government, as people rose up and over threw Uthman for example.

I don't think most Sunnis are aware of these hadiths.

[EspressoFrog]

Here are some hadiths about obeying rulers no matter what:

Both the metric ones and the US ones?!

[Justtristo]

It is much the same doctrine in the New Testament which in various mandates submission of believers to earthly authorities regardless of how tyrannical they are.

[Minimalist]

It is much the same doctrine in the New Testament which in various mandates submission of believers to earthly authorities regardless of how tyrannical they are.

Yep. So sayeth Thomas Jefferson:

In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.

[Mystic]

It is much the same doctrine in the New Testament which in various mandates submission of believers to earthly authorities regardless of how tyrannical they are.

I've heard about that before, do you have the exact verses that say so?

[Minimalist]

Here.

Colossians 3:22

22 Slaves, obey your earthly masters in everything; and do it, not only when their eye is on you and to curry their favor, but with sincerity of heart and reverence for the Lord. 23 Whatever you do, work at it with all your heart, as working for the Lord, not for human masters, 24 since you know that you will receive an inheritance from the Lord as a reward. It is the Lord Christ you are serving. 25 Anyone who does wrong will be repaid for their wrongs, and there is no favoritism.

"Who then is the faithful and wise slave, whom his master has put in charge of his household, to give the other slaves their allowance of food at the proper time? Blessed is that slave whom his master will find at work when he arrives." -- Matthew 24:45-46.

"Let all who are under the yoke of slavery regard their masters as worthy of all honor, so that the name of God and the teaching may not be blasphemed. Those who have believing masters must not be disrespectful to them on the ground that they are members of the church; rather they must serve them all the more, since those who benefit by their service are believers and beloved. Teach and urge these duties. Whoever teaches otherwise and does not agree with the sound words of our Lord Jesus Christ and the teaching that is in accordance with godliness, is conceited, understanding nothing, and has a morbid craving for controversy and for disputes about words. From these come envy, dissension, slander, base suspicions, and wrangling among those who are depraved in mind and bereft of the truth, imagining that godliness is a means of gain." -- 1 Timothy 6:1-5.

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, in singleness of heart, as you obey Christ; not only while being watched, and in order to please them, but as slaves of Christ, doing the will of God from the heart." -- Ephesians 6:5-6.

"Submit yourselves for the Lord’s sake to every authority instituted among men." -- 1 Peter 2:13

"Slaves, accept the authority of your masters with all deference, not only those who are kind and gentle but also those who are harsh. For it is a credit to you if, being aware of God, you endure pain while suffering unjustly. If you endure when you are beaten for doing wrong, what credit is that? But if you endure when you do right and suffer for it, you have God's approval." -- 1 Peter 2:18-29.


Xtianity being less a religion for slaves than one designed by slave holders!

[Cinjin]

It is much the same doctrine in the New Testament which in various mandates submission of believers to earthly authorities regardless of how tyrannical they are.

Yep. So sayeth Thomas Jefferson:

In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.

Curious ... the Roman Empire once fed Christians to wild animals (among other punishments) in the Colosseum. I wonder how the Christians of that time period felt about that little Biblical mandate of submission??



Christian under the rule of Nero: "Oh Roman gaurd ... yes I would like to turn myself in for either animal mauling or perhaps you could turn me into a human torch in Nero's garden? It's the right thing to do, and I know that god will be pleased with me upon my own horrific demise."


Doubtful.

[Minimalist]

I'd be astounded if Nero ever heard the term "christian."

All of this horseshit was invented later on.

[5thHorseman]

'Obey rulers no matter how evil they are! (ugly side of Sunni Islam)'

There's a nice side of Sunni Islam?

[Mystic]

There's a nice side of Sunni Islam?

There is a beautiful side to Sunni Islam, yes.