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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:31 am
(December 3, 2011 at 9:20 am)lucent Wrote: Atheists need to stop trying to redefine the definition of atheism. To say you lack a belief in something is a meaningless statement. It is simply an attempt by the atheist to redefine the parameters of the debate and escape any burden of proof for their position.
Bullshit. I lack belief! I'm not claiming anything. I lacked belief since birth. You can't stand that because it means the burden of proof is not on me, it's on you.
I'm not claiming that a god or god's don't exist, I don't know if they do or not. I just don't believe that any god exists. Lack of belief. An atheist is one who does not believe in god. Get used to it.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:36 am
(This post was last modified: December 3, 2011 at 9:38 am by lucent.)
(December 3, 2011 at 9:31 am)Ace Otana Wrote: (December 3, 2011 at 9:20 am)lucent Wrote: Atheists need to stop trying to redefine the definition of atheism. To say you lack a belief in something is a meaningless statement. It is simply an attempt by the atheist to redefine the parameters of the debate and escape any burden of proof for their position.
Bullshit. I lack belief! I'm not claiming anything. I lacked belief since birth. You can't stand that because it means the burden of proof is not on me, it's on you.
I'm not claiming that a god or god's don't exist, I don't know if they do or not. I just don't believe that any god exists. Lack of belief. An atheist is one who does not believe in god. Get used to it.
Rocks lack belief. You have a belief about God based on your concept of God and the evidence you're aware of. Based on the evidence, from the default position of either yes or no, you believe the evidence leans more towards the positive or negative. In your case it is towards the negative, and therefore you have a belief about it.
Atheists are trying to redefine atheism as the default position and it isn't. It is a positive claim that God does not exist. If you want to say you don't know, you're an agnostic.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:41 am
(December 3, 2011 at 9:36 am)lucent Wrote: Rocks lack belief. You have a belief about God based on your concept of God and the evidence you're aware of. Based on the evidence, from the default position of either yes or no, you believe the evidence leans more towards the positive or negative, in your case the negative, and therefore you have a belief about it.
Atheists are trying to redefine atheism as the default position and it isn't. It is a negative claim. If you want to say you don't know, you're an agnostic.
Evidence of god? I've seen none. I've with-held judgement. You know what that means? I'm not stating that there is or is not a god, I don't know but at the same time I don't believe it. I've with-held judgement because of a lack of evidence. Atheism is the default stance, you don't like it but that's tough. I have no belief. Also I by default lack belief in any concept you invent. I've looked into the whole god shit and I just don't believe it. Get over it.
Lack of belief does not equal belief.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:49 am
(December 3, 2011 at 9:41 am)Ace Otana Wrote: Evidence of god? I've seen none. I've with-held judgement. You know what that means? I'm not stating that there is or is not a god, I don't know but at the same time I don't believe it. I've with-held judgement because of a lack of evidence. Atheism is the default stance, you don't like it but that's tough. I have no belief. Also I by default lack belief in any concept you invent. I've looked into the whole god shit and I just don't believe it. Get over it.
Lack of belief does not equal belief.
Your belief about this is crippling your ability to think logically. Do you see how confused your statement is? Let's pick out some contradictions:
I'm not stating that there is or is not a god, I don't know
vs
I've with-held judgement because of a lack of evidence I have no belief
vs
I don't know but at the same time I don't believe it. I've looked into the whole god shit and I just don't believe it
Far from lacking a belief, you hold several contradictory viewpoints at the same time. Your mind is tangled in knots trying to justify your position, because it has no justification. Either you claim God doesn't exist or you don't know. Period.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:51 am
Typcal theist mindset cant understand not believing. It simply does not compute.
You can fix ignorance, you can't fix stupid.
Tinkety Tonk and down with the Nazis.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:54 am
(December 3, 2011 at 9:49 am)lucent Wrote: Far from lacking a belief, you hold several contradictory viewpoints at the same time. Your mind is tangled in knots trying to justify your position, because it has no justification. Either you claim God doesn't exist or you don't know. Period.
That's no contradiction. There are no contradictions. Atheist: I don't believe in god/ I lack belief. Agnostic: I do not or cannot know whether a god exists or not. There is no contradiction.
Either I believe in god or I don't. No claims made, no contradiction, no belief. 
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:55 am
(December 3, 2011 at 9:51 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Typcal theist mindset cant understand not believing. It simply does not compute.
I understand it perfectly well. It's a positive claim. If you won't listen to me, listen to one of your own:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xkfehPyydE
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 9:57 am
(December 3, 2011 at 9:55 am)lucent Wrote: (December 3, 2011 at 9:51 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Typcal theist mindset cant understand not believing. It simply does not compute.
I understand it perfectly well. It's a positive claim. No....it's not.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 10:03 am
(This post was last modified: December 3, 2011 at 10:04 am by lucent.)
(December 3, 2011 at 9:57 am)Ace Otana Wrote: (December 3, 2011 at 9:55 am)lucent Wrote: (December 3, 2011 at 9:51 am)downbeatplumb Wrote: Typcal theist mindset cant understand not believing. It simply does not compute.
I understand it perfectly well. It's a positive claim. No....it's not.
If you don't believe in God, you have a belief that there is no God. Not believing in something, believe it or not, also means you have a belief about it. This is elementary.
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RE: Atheism's Definition - Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy
December 3, 2011 at 10:07 am
(December 3, 2011 at 10:03 am)lucent Wrote: If you don't believe in God, you have a belief that there is no God. Not believing in something, believe it or not, also means you have a belief about it. This is elementary.
Explain how lack of belief = belief.
How is - I don't believe in X = I believe X does not exist?
Please, tell us...
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence - Carl Sagan
Mankind's intelligence walks hand in hand with it's stupidity.
Being an atheist says nothing about your overall intelligence, it just means you don't believe in god. Atheists can be as bright as any scientist and as stupid as any creationist.
You never really know just how stupid someone is, until you've argued with them.
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