I've often heard theists tout how their god knows everything (in other words, is omniscient). This lead to a question that has been in the back of my mind for quite some time.

According to the monogod religions, does knowing everything entail knowing what burning for eternity feels like for humans, qualitatively?

Or is that a consequence believers don't like to discuss?

I've heard many times that hell is the absence of god. So god can't know what hell feels like, so he's not omniscient.

But if he does know what hell feels like, somehow violating logic by his omnipotentness, then that makes him cruel and not omnibenevolent for throwing people in there anyway.

Any more than one omni attribute is necessarily internally logically contradictory.

Imma have to make a map of all the holes in god, cos somebody didn't think this through -_-

(August 15, 2015 at 3:07 am)Neimenovic Wrote: I've heard many times that hell is the absence of god. So god can't know what hell feels like, so he's not omniscient.

One thing that I've always found interesting about that claim is this:

Revelation 14:10

"they, too, will drink the wine of God's fury, which has been poured full strength into the cup of his wrath. They will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and of the Lamb."

If Jesus is supposed to be god, and god is supposed to be absent in hell, why is god hanging out with the damned whilst they're having burning sulfur rammed down their throats?

See? Can't get their own fucking story straight -_-

That's the thing about stories that never get put to the test, you can say whatever rubbish you like.

Yeah, in the story most often told, God should know exactly what it's like in hell.

It just seems a tad insane that god, for lacking the ability to unknow something, is effectively experiencing first hand what it feels like to be burning for eternity, qualitatively. To add, is also knowing qualitatively, what other things feel like, for example: knowing what it feels like to be sitting in a bus with a smelly obese 500kg granny sitting next to you for eternity.

Omni attributes are quite ridiculous once examined.

Well if he doesn't have the ability to unknow something, he's not omnipotent. If he can unknow something, he's not omniscient.

There just is no logical way to make this work. You need to wave your arms dramatically and yell 'Bbbbbbbut mysteries of faith!!!'....But then if god is so mysterious, how can you know anything about him at all?

See? Conundrum upon conundrum upon conundrum. Solve one, 10 other pop up.

God is detail oriented; if you look at the big picture, you'll see it's not Rembrandt but a childish doodle made out of mayonnaise on the kitchen floor.

If God is omniscient, then God must know the experience of God telling a lie.

If God is a liar (by definition), why should I listen to what people claim he's told them?

Boru

There's a deeper problem with the "does god...?" threads in these forums. One that I came to fully understand only yesterday, when I had a conversation here with one of our better theists. He obviously can't wrap his mind around the fact that when we say god, we do so in a metaphorical way, really talking about the people, who set him up, created him.

I tried to explain, but I think it's one of the reasons why they always say we're mad at god, we're critizising god's morality and so on, while all the way, we don't believe there is a god. Only peope who created a set of religious rules for their time and their region.

(August 15, 2015 at 6:16 am)abaris Wrote: There's a deeper problem with the "does god...?" threads in these forums. One that I came to fully understand only yesterday, when I had a conversation here with one of our better theists. He obviously can't wrap his mind around the fact that when we say god, we do so in a metaphorical way, really talking about the people, who set him up, created him.

I tried to explain, but I think it's one of the reasons why they always say we're mad at god, we're critizising god's morality and so on, while all the way, we don't believe there is a god. Only peope who created a set of religious rules for their time and their region.

Right, but this is why I included the modifiers:

"I've often heard theists"
"According to the monogod religions"
"Or is that a consequence believers"

The question, on analysis is clearly framed as a hypothetical, and at most, a query directed at believers about their beliefs.

Edit:

If certain theists can't understand that, I'll put it down to the fact that they either:

A) have a poor grasp on the English
B) have a poor grasp on reality
C) both A and B