(November 16, 2015 at 1:37 am)AtlasS33 Wrote:

(November 15, 2015 at 6:20 am)MrNoMorePropaganda Wrote: When will Barrack Obama give back his Nobel Peace Prize? Someone needs to take away his Nobel Peace Prize. He has made the world a more dangerous place.

But, by the way, AtlasS33, the gunmen knew Paris too well to be refugees I think - otherwise I agree with the video. At least 10% of Syrians are Christian and you have loads of Druze as well, and Shia and non-religious, who all want to escape DAESH. And altogether that's maybe 30% of Syrians. There's easy ways we can find out who is Christian and who radical Sunni:
1. We could see if they are willing to commit Shirk at the border - because believing Jesus is a deity is Shirk. We might also ask them if they are religious or not.
2. And then we find out their opinion of Ali and Aisha (to see if they are Sunni or Shia)
3. And then they can beat the DAESH flag and books written by Abdul Wahaab with a shoe for a couple of minutes too, but they have to do it with enthusiasm, just to make sure they're not lying.

If they fail the test then we don't let them in.

Christopher Greene always took an "anti immigration" stance, he's hotheaded, and that leads him to believe weird stuff and believe rumors sometimes. But two minutes with him, worth 24 hours of mainstream media to me. 

The coordination of the attacks too is not something that Jihadists would do. Jihadists -in their own homeland- are very bad when it comes to tactics, it's enough that the saggy Arab armies -ones like Kuwait's or Egypt- are enough to combat them and actually win twice. They are more like gangs; they can't even level up to an "army". How did they do such an attack ?

Then, you have the guns in the concert. I for one fact, know that an AK is too big to hide; even smaller versions like the AKS-74U can't be hidden; these are military grade rifles. How did they pass security ?

You can rule out the possibility of them "shooting from a far range" since the French government -and eye witneses- said they were inside the concert.

You can bet of course that the next ISIS attack would be with submachine guns since they are smaller and can be hidden inside coats or pants. Of course

Another thing : security was supposed to be tight already since the president was watching a match nearby. The concert had "The Eagles" inside and that's an "international event". Where the hell is security ?

Dogs alone can smell gunpowder and bombs from a very far distance, where were the K9s ? or did France decided out of a sudden not to use them?

I'm not saying that the blood is on Holland's hands. 
But in Charlie Hebdo, people too reported that the security was fishy and weird. 

You can trust me though on that Shia are not so nice. They are as terrible as Sunna, and actually have their own cutthroat militias across Iraq and Syria,  though since they are a minority they just practice taqyia more often. ISIS is Sunni "Only" because Sunna are the majority. If it was vise versa, ISIS would've became Shia.

Atlas, we've jousted on here before, but for the main part, I agree with most fo what you have said here......apart from this.  I can assure you that the IS jihadists are more than capable of this type of attack.....the planning and coordination are being well over played in the media.....8 gunman, in a capital city, strapped with suicide belts, would be disappointed with the death toll.  I say this with a heavy heart and in no way meant to disrespect aanyone here, but this attack has all the hallmarks of a Jihadist attack.

3 suicide bombers outside Stad-de-Paris with no casualties and 80,000 people inside?  Come on, this was amateurish.

You question them getting their rifles past security?  Which security?  The non-existent security on the borders?  Or the "security" on the door at the Bataclan?  We're talking Friday night bouncers here, unarmed and on a measly wage.  Think about it.

You keep asking about the "security?"  I'm not entirely sure what you are expecting?  The streets covered in armed police and Bomb disposal units at every corner?

The questions should not be directed at the forces on the ground, for what they were, they should be directed at the intelligence services.  A ball was dropped, big time... there is no way an attack like this remains totally radio silent in the staging week before the attack...no way.

Playing the blame game is pure deflection at this point though......those cowardly fucks are the only ones to blames, if there is a God, may he fu(k them in the ass for all eternity.

If I hear one more person tell me I need to pray to god to save me from someone who might kill me because he thinks god told him to to, I'm going to lose my shit.

Fucking religious people. This is why we don't like any of you.

I'm sick of all this "pray for Paris" shit, I refuse to insult the death and sufferings of Parisians and the grievings of their loved ones by allowing myself to be even remotely tempted into being pressured by theists into giving a completely fake bullshit prayer that I wouldn't even remotely mean.

How about "I feel deep sorrow for the sufferings of Paris right now" surely that is better than some imaginary benevolent dictator being prayed to when it comes to caring for real people who actually exist and are grieving and terrified?

Pray all you like but don't expect us atheists do the same.

I'm posting this because someone on my Facebook said "At times like this I think whether you're a Christian or an atheist you should pray for Paris right now."

I almost responded saying "Oki doki. I'll pray to Ra, that guy hasn't had much attention in a few thousand years, let's give him a shot. It surely can't do any less good than praying to Jehovah."

Pray for what exactly? And to who? The God who just sat by and watched some psychos gun down innocent people?

It must be confusing living in a fucking fairy tale. I'm with you, my thoughts and best wishes are with the families and friends. It's a heinous act and no amount of praying will make it OK.

Not wanting to get in an argument, but it seems to be a little bit petty to be getting so het up over being asked to pray, given the situation.

People are religious, quite what you expect I'm not sure.

Quote:Even though they voted the worst of the worst into office recently.

Ah, but you see in a democracy that is one of the risks you take.  When you rely on the "people" almost anything can happen and it is usually bad.

Still....we are going through the same exercise in self-immolation right now and could well end up with,



or



having their fingers on the nuclear button.


Think about that and remember what's voting.

(November 16, 2015 at 9:15 am)robvalue Wrote: Pray for what exactly? And to who? The God who just sat by and watched some psychos gun down innocent people?

It must be confusing living in a fucking fairy tale. I'm with you, my thoughts and best wishes are with the families and friends. It's a heinous act and no amount of praying will make it OK.

This all powerful, all seeing god thing can make a universe but can't make a gun jam? Stupid, useless god, who needs him?

(November 16, 2015 at 9:22 am)SofaKingHigh Wrote: Not wanting to get in an argument, but it seems to be a little bit petty to be getting so het up over being asked to pray, given the situation.

People are religious, quite what you expect I'm not sure.

It's the ridiculousness of being explicitly told that in situations as bad as this atheists should be praying too. They're religious so what do I expect? I expect them to pray. We're atheists though so if I refuse to pray what the fuck do they expect? Are they seriously going to suggest I'm a bad person for not praying to an imaginary God?

You're right... at times like this it's not important and that's why such bullshit like this pisses me off when people try to pressure me with that religious bullshit. Pray as much as you like, knock your socks off but don't expect atheists to pray for Paris that makes no fucking sense. As if praying actually means you give a shit. It means you're leaving an important matter to an imaginary person and if people didn't worship and pray to imaginary people there wouldn't be suicide bombings like this.

It is very relevant: It's thanks to religion that we have suicide bombers like this in the first place.

I'm not an angry atheist but it's religiousy motivated acts of violence like this that piss me off. I'm not anti-theist but I am anti-religion.

(November 16, 2015 at 2:18 pm)Evie Wrote:

(November 16, 2015 at 9:22 am)SofaKingHigh Wrote: Not wanting to get in an argument, but it seems to be a little bit petty to be getting so het up over being asked to pray, given the situation.

People are religious, quite what you expect I'm not sure.

It's the ridiculousness of being explicitly told that in situations as bad as this atheists should be praying too. They're religious so what do I expect? I expect them to pray. We're atheists though so if I refuse to pray what the fuck do they expect? Are they seriously going to suggest I'm a bad person for not praying to an imaginary God?

You're right... at times like this it's not important and that's why such bullshit like this pisses me off when people try to pressure me with that religious bullshit. Pray as much as you like, knock your socks off but don't expect atheists to pray for Paris that makes no fucking sense. As if praying actually means you give a shit. It means you're leaving an important matter to an imaginary person and if people didn't worship and pray to imaginary people there wouldn't be suicide bombings like this.

It is very relevant: It's thanks to religion that we have suicide bombers like this in the first place.

No it is not "petty". If religion worked like the claimers of prayer say it does, things would get fixed. Since prayer has never stopped human horrors, maybe humans need to consider, any bad we do or good we do, HUMANS are doing it to each other. Everyone thinks their god is on their side, and friend and foe alike pray and seems that if it should work the world would have peace by now.

The other bad logic claiming prayer works, is that these same advocates of it also claim their god has a plan, which would say if you are asking for changes, you don't fully trust this god you are claiming exists. 

Logic can only conclude that if we pretend this fictional being was real, at best humans are lab rats for him to toy with. If believers want to think of themselves  as lab rats, they can, I don't think I am a lab rat.