(January 13, 2016 at 4:32 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Give one thing ISIS does, that Mexican drug cartels don't do.

The Mexican cartels are not using catholicism as motivation/inspiration. Not finding many suicide bombers yelling "Our Lady of Guadalupe" as they go in for the kill.

(January 13, 2016 at 7:01 am)MrNoMorePropaganda Wrote:

(January 12, 2016 at 11:33 pm)Cato Wrote: I'm tired of hearing this tripe. Please tell me what the U.S. has to do with an ideology consummated decades before its founding in the marriage of al-Wahhab and al-Saud? ISIS is only its current untethered manifestation.

or the Americans still (stupidly) think that there is a secular opposition in Syria.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coalition_...ic_Syrians

(January 13, 2016 at 9:08 am)mh.brewer Wrote:

(January 13, 2016 at 4:32 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Give one thing ISIS does, that Mexican drug cartels don't do.

The Mexican cartels are not using catholicism as motivation/inspiration. Not finding many suicide bombers yelling "Our Lady of Guadalupe" as they go in for the kill.

I'm discussing aftermath. They both do the same crimes, create the same havoc around, and believe me many civilians did fall in the Mexican drug war; it's not just Syria bleeding; btw.

The problem is so deeper than that, if you can just think about it.

(January 13, 2016 at 8:15 am)paulpablo Wrote:

(January 13, 2016 at 6:07 am)yukapuka Wrote: based on what and who? imagine this where a court of law

if you went in and said that statement , do you know what is the first thing they will ask you? where is your references

besides reality point to otherwise, majority of Muslims live in peace and follow the law of Islam and law of the country they live in without any conflicts or clashes

again this comes down to your level of knowledge ABOUT Islam , one question where do you get your sources of information for such a conclusion and second how did you come to those conclusions, prove them

you cant just say "it is like this" without being questioned why you believe so

and dont say "because ISIS exists"

ISIS would have existed even if the people in it were not of ANY religion or ANY other religion , because their goals are material and power and revenge driven

what does Islam have with owning oil fields and lots of money? when in fact it preaches the opposite to be humble and to take as little from this life as possible and to live on the basics necessities

it doesn't preach about taking lands , it doesn't preach about this life in general and denounces the life of this world and seeking it and encourages seeking the hereafter with good deeds and helping people and charity and peace

so again , who and what are your sources?

None of what you just said has anything to do with what I'm saying.  Islam is submission to gods will, I'm saying I don't believe the Quran is the word of God anyway so all Muslims are equally Islamic to me.  

The Quran and Hadith contain several verses that could be interpreted as violant.

if your going to take that attitude with life, then EVERYTHING is a danger for you to watch and see

there is verses in the Quran which talk about war, but ONLY an absolutely dim witted person would see that and make a horrible conclusion

and the interesting thing about the Quran is that at its beginning few pages it mentions those who take some verse of the Quran and ignore the other

Quran already warned about doing that 1400 years ago, and the Prophet even said "the one who knows a little of the Quran is more dangerous then the one who knows none of it"

meaning its not for every person to interpret it by taking one verse or a few verses , and there is a whole field of science about Quran interpretation , its like ANY other field of science , there is a method and it requires study , you cant just take it and suddenly your a master interpretor, and if i have to emphasise that point to you, then you problem is that you lack common sense and nobody can help you

there is HEAVY punishment and warning for people who give false fatwas or talking without knowledge but conjecture

this is again talked about in the Quran itself

the QUran is called a BOOK for a reason, you cant read one page and determine all your beliefs on that

its common sense

if you were going to learn Physics or Mathematics you dont read the first chapter and ignore the rest and then wonder why you failed the test?

its common sense

that's why i keep saying people here are using double standards with the Quran, they would never apply teh saem kind of standards to other books that they do to the Quran, but with the Quran they are intentionally choosing to be ignorant

and always ALWAYS talking out of ignorance and opinion, like everyone else here

everyone that replies to me replies with opinion

and even the guy who claims to know Arabic, so what if you now Arabic? i can read Arabic too

does that make your arguments valid? its such a childish argument that it makes me cringe when i read people who say that, and they instantly disqualify themselves as unbiased debaters

stop talking about how you know Arabic and make a academic argument

and the rest of you go and get some common sense

yes the Quran can be taken out of context, but so can ANY writing

you can take a recipe and read a line such as "..cut the liver out.." and say very stupidly and ignorantly

"look this author was sinister and is instructing people to cut each others livers out"

do you realize how stupid you would look in public if you did that?

-about as stupid as you look right now?  


Now, forgive me...but I'm going to condense your entire post into the singlemost coherent and succinct statement you made...a statement that you could have made in place of your entire diatribe.

Quote: but ONLY an absolutely dim witted person would see that and make a horrible conclusion 

There are, apparently, plenty of dimwitted muslims then...as there are plenty of dimwitted people in general.  Perhaps "allah"...... in his infinite wisdom..should have considered that before releasing such an insufficient text as the quran?

(January 13, 2016 at 9:55 am)yukapuka Wrote:

(January 13, 2016 at 8:15 am)paulpablo Wrote: None of what you just said has anything to do with what I'm saying.  Islam is submission to gods will, I'm saying I don't believe the Quran is the word of God anyway so all Muslims are equally Islamic to me.  

The Quran and Hadith contain several verses that could be interpreted as violant.

if your going to take that attitude with life, then EVERYTHING is a danger for you to watch and see

there is verses in the Quran which talk about war, but ONLY an absolutely dim witted person would see that and make a horrible conclusion

and the interesting thing about the Quran is that at its beginning few pages it mentions those who take some verse of the Quran and ignore the other

Quran already warned about doing that 1400 years ago, and the Prophet even said "the one who knows a little of the Quran is more dangerous then the one who knows none of it"

meaning its not for every person to interpret it by taking one verse or a few verses , and there is a whole field of science about Quran interpretation , its like ANY other field of science , there is a method and it requires study , you cant just take it and suddenly your a master interpretor, and if i have to emphasise that point to you, then you problem is that you lack common sense and nobody can help you

there is HEAVY punishment and warning for people who give false fatwas or talking without knowledge but conjecture

this is again talked about in the Quran itself

the QUran is called a BOOK for a reason, you cant read one page and determine all your beliefs on that

its common sense

if you were going to learn Physics or Mathematics you dont read the first chapter and ignore the rest and then wonder why you failed the test?

its common sense

that's why i keep saying people here are using double standards with the Quran, they would never apply teh saem kind of standards to other books that they do to the Quran, but with the Quran they are intentionally choosing to be ignorant

and always ALWAYS talking out of ignorance and opinion, like everyone else here

everyone that replies to me replies with opinion

and even the guy who claims to know Arabic, so what if you now Arabic? i can read Arabic too

does that make your arguments valid? its such a childish argument that it makes me cringe when i read people who say that, and they instantly disqualify themselves as unbiased debaters

stop talking about how you know Arabic and make a academic argument

and the rest of you go and get some common sense

yes the Quran can be taken out of context, but so can ANY writing

you can take a recipe and read a line such as "..cut the liver out.." and say very stupidly and ignorantly

"look this author was sinister and is instructing people to cut each others livers out"

do you realize how stupid you would look in public if you did that?

You're copying and pasting what I wrote but don't seem to be replying to anything I said.

Islam is submission to god's will. People who consider themselves Islamic have a belief centred around the quran and sometimes hadith.  I don't believe there's evidence for god or his will or that the quran is anything other than an ancient book of myths written in Arabic, so Muslims are all equally Islamic to me.  I don't claim to be an expert in Islam.

I learned a long time ago it's impossible to debate people about their ancient holy books.  They simply say that verses have been abrogated, the translation is wrong or things of that nature.

Your example of a recipe book saying that you cut out the liver and someone might think it means cut out the liver of humans is a little far fetched compared to the verses in the quran.

Quote:The recompense of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and do mischief in the land is only that they shall be killed or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off on the opposite sides, or be exiled from the land.

This isn't a verse about crucifying and cutting the hands and feet off a lamb chop you're about to cook.  This verse is a punishment described to the vague offense of waging war against Allah and Muhammad and doing mischief in the land.

I can see how this verse could result in people being crucified for vague offenses which someone could think was waging a war against allah and his messenger, I think you will refuse to see how this could be taken the wrong way though.

(January 13, 2016 at 4:32 am)AtlasS33 Wrote: Give one thing ISIS does, that Mexican drug cartels don't do.

Not live in Mexico?

Shout allah hu akbar before sawing off the head of a pow? Point to the quran as justification for militant adventurism? Attempt to reestablish the "umma"?

Honestly, how hard did he think it would be to find those examples?

(January 13, 2016 at 8:52 am)Nay_Sayer Wrote: No, They are islamic, Very much so.  Next.

As a matter of fact, they think that muslims who say ISIS is not islamic are not "True Muslims." 

It's all so confusing.  Best to simply paint all the assholes with one brush.

Here's another bunch of fine islamic fucks.  I bet you are proud of them.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-35299597

Quote:Bomb near Pakistan polio centre 'kills 15'

Quote:Armed guards are routine for polio workers in Pakistan, who have been the target of many deadly attacks by Islamist militants in recent years.
Militants oppose polio vaccination, saying it is a Western conspiracy to sterilise Pakistani children.
Pakistan and Afghanistan are the only two countries where the disease is still endemic.

Gee.  What a fucking surprise that is!