(June 8, 2016 at 2:36 pm)ApeNotKillApe Wrote:

(June 8, 2016 at 2:34 pm)Ignorant Wrote: Because I value (more or less) what other human beings think about the things I find important, especially those who disagree with me.

Why do you think this story is important?

In Christianity, it is one of the more fundamental images of forgiveness and reconciliation between people and between people and God. It results in a party, and everyone is invited.

(June 8, 2016 at 2:56 pm)Ignorant Wrote:

(June 8, 2016 at 2:44 pm)madog Wrote: I can not know what you intend but I do know what your God wants of you ... just one example ...

"Mark 16:15  


And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation."

But I can ask you and Catholic_Lady is your intention to learn about atheists or proclaim the Gospel? [1]

I would remind you that deception is a sin according to your beliefs. [2]

I have no problem with mild evangelism, but even atheists respect honesty  [3]

1) Are the two mutually exclusive?

2) Why the persistent hermeneutic of suspicion?

2) I would hope that all of my words and actions are evangelistic in some way, even if I am not explicitly preaching the Gospel.  

1) No, just that I like it to be clear that you are also evangelizing ...

2) I could say the same whenever you highlight a question as if it were a statement ...

2) As I said its a nifty way of evangelizing on an atheist forum

(June 8, 2016 at 2:58 pm)Ignorant Wrote:

(June 8, 2016 at 2:36 pm)ApeNotKillApe Wrote: Why do you think this story is important?

In Christianity, it is one of the more fundamental images of forgiveness and reconciliation between people and between people and God. It results in a party, and everyone is invited.

Being forgiven is better than not needing forgiveness?

Seems to me the message is that it doesn't matter what the fuck you do.

I guess that is part of this so-called morality that the jesus freaks are always blabbering about?

(June 8, 2016 at 2:44 pm)madog Wrote:

(June 8, 2016 at 2:32 pm)Ignorant Wrote: 1) I don't need to do this. I want to do this because I find that differing points-of-view tend to enrich and enlarge my own point-of-view. Has that been your experience? 

I can not know what you intend but I do know what your God wants of you ... just one example ...

"Mark 16:15  


And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation."

But I can ask you and Catholic_Lady is your intention to learn about atheists or proclaim the Gospel?

I would remind you that deception is a sin according to your beliefs.

I have no problem with mild evangelism, but even atheists respect honesty

I'm here for a number of reasons. 

1. My husband works a lot, I live in a small town out in the middle of nowhere Texas (thanks airforce!) and I'm bored lol. 

2. When I first joined I had a lot of questions for atheists that I was curious to know the answer to, mostly sparked by a facebook friend I have who always posts atheist stuff. I think other people's perspective can be interesting, and definitely something anyone can learn from... even if only to enforce our own views. 

3. Though I think at this point most of my questions have been answered, I have made some friends here and find it hard to leave for that reason. And because I'm bored.

Quote:1. My husband works a lot, I live in a small town out in the middle of nowhere Texas (thanks airforce!) and I'm bored lol.

I always appreciated your honesty!

(June 8, 2016 at 3:13 pm)Minimalist Wrote: Seems to me the message is that it doesn't matter what the fuck you do.

I guess that is part of this so-called morality that the jesus freaks are always blabbering about?

The bible does make it pretty clear that it's not what you know. It's who you know.

As for evangelization, I very much believe in St Francis' approach: "preach the gospel always, when necessary use words."

We are called to be a good example of Christian love, and in doing so, we draw others to Christ, or in other words, the Christian way of living - which is to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, etc etc. I must admit I fail miserably many times, especially recently with how grumpy and depressed I've been.

To me, this forum is not any more or any less a place to "evangelize" as any other. It is not the reason I am here.

(June 8, 2016 at 2:58 pm)Ignorant Wrote:

(June 8, 2016 at 2:36 pm)ApeNotKillApe Wrote: Why do you think this story is important?

In Christianity, it is one of the more fundamental images of forgiveness and reconciliation between people and between people and God. It results in a party, and everyone is invited.

Nope sorry, still doesn't work.

First off you are still talking about the same character above him in God, which is still the violent OT and violent end times character. The "forgiveness" in the middle is fake, it is like beating your spouse, then promising not to hit them again only to go right back to beating the shit out of them.

Secondly, nobody has the right to tell me who I have to associate with if they hurt me. No third party has the right to force me to accept the transgressions of others who hurt me. That is my decision alone. Now, I am not against forgiveness as an idea, and certainly revenge doesn't teach anyone anything, but I decide whom I forgive, not a third party.

As watered down as many Christians try to paint the NT Jesus character, not even the NT authors agree as to how the OT applies. And even in the NT the Jesus character tells you to abandon your family and friends if they don't follow him. It is still a watered down form of tribal loyalty. 

In real life in civil society no one person has absolute power over anyone else, there is no monopoly in western governments. In real life we get to decide who our leaders are, and our leaders need our consent to rule over us and we don't have to blindly follow on person based solely on what that one person claims. 

That bible was still written in an age of tribal kingdoms and the Jesus character does not change the tribal times in which it was written. 


FYI, don't stupidly accuse me of hate or bigotry, my mom is still Catholic and I myself am a former Catholic.

Some people are so allergic to evangelization, I really don't mind it. I positively expect an honest believer like our Ignorant friend here to be eager to show to others what he or she sees as an important truth, just as I am eager to point out that I think it's BS because that's what I think is an important fact about the world.