(May 23, 2017 at 4:33 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Child abuse is most rampant in schools, and mostly done by teachers than any other vocation. Priests don't molest kids any more than the average man, so I don't know why they carry the stereotype.  

I'm not saying this to excuse their behavior or to say it is any less horrific (I'm sorry that it happens. I apologize on their behalf). But what I am saying is that I often see it talked about like it's something unique to Catholic churches and that it happens there more than any where else where adults deal closely with children. It doesn't at all.

But that's beside the point. I don't understand why we *always* need to bring up wrongdoings of Catholic clergy or other Christians or people from 1000 year ago or even Americans in threads about a radical Islamic terrorist attack. It happens every time and I don't understand why. A radical Islamist blows people up and immediately people here start: "Well the Crusades this and that," "Catholic priests this and that," "Christians this and that," "Americans this and that." I mean, come on already. Why use horrible tragedies to make a point about another group of people when those people had nothing to do with it? Why not just acknowledge and discuss the evil at hand that just happened rather than creating diversions?        

There are plenty of threads about Catholicism and Catholic priests here made entirely for the purpose to talking about how horrible they/we/our beliefs are. I don't understand why every thread about some Radical Islamic mother fucker blowing people up has to become about Catholic priests.

America supported terrorists to win the war against the soviet union.

That's why the fact is always brought up: America armed Jihadists and gave them training and weapons. Gave them the boost they needed in terms of training and arming.
Whenever a bomb is blown by a radical Muslim; it's not only the terrorist's fault; but it's also the fault of the U.S for training his militia to use bombing back in the cold war.

Also, radical Islam blossomed in Saudi Arabia. America and Saudi Arabia are allies.

Allow me to put it this way: America is friends with the factory of radical Islam since 1933.
Whenever a bomb explodes; think about the messed up foreign policy of the U.S

It's a fact: going to war with America means that Sunni and Shiite militias would invade with the U.S, slapping the existence out of the place with both airstrikes and suicide bombing. Look at Iraq.

It's always related. The facts enforce themselves on whoever knows a piece of history.

Just like Islam is used in American wars, Christianity is also used.


It's all related; CL.

---

And whenever a war breaks; millions of tiny little poor souls become psychopaths, rightist Europeans attacking mosques and infest the society with racism against immigrants, and crazy Muslims who eat eyeballs for dinner and blow up themselves for fun .

That's the big picture. It always begins with a twisted priest or a lying Sheikh, that got their propaganda fuel from the acts of a selfish piece of shit like Bush or Trump.

ISIS use the misery Muslims saw in Iraq to preach their propaganda. Mosques in Saudi Arabia produce terrorists by using the pain of Syrians.
Everything is related.

(May 23, 2017 at 7:33 pm)Aroura Wrote: The BBC is reporting that the bomber was a native, born right in Manchester.

The list of victims is truly heartbreaking.

That is the other fallacy, when you dig into these attacker's pasts either in Europe or America, most of them have legal status and mostly born and raised in the countries they attack. The right wing bullshit fear of the outsider, even with Mexicans is bullshit. 

You have more to fear from dying in a car accident, or even domestic violence than you have to fear of an outsider even in the case of an attacker. Even the Boston bombers where long time residents.

Just like the Boston bombers, early reports are that this kid dropped out of College, makes me wonder if he wasn't simply taking it out on society like the Boston bomber. The older brother of the Boston Bomber lost his kick boxing licence for domestic violence. 

But I will say every time one of these nuts does something like this the reaction of the sane gives me hope. Manchester is a very diverse city and EVERYONE of all labels pitched in and came out in force yesterday to let the world know that these acts will not divide them.

(May 24, 2017 at 3:02 am)AtlasS33 Wrote:

(May 23, 2017 at 4:33 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Child abuse is most rampant in schools, and mostly done by teachers than any other vocation. Priests don't molest kids any more than the average man, so I don't know why they carry the stereotype.  

I'm not saying this to excuse their behavior or to say it is any less horrific (I'm sorry that it happens. I apologize on their behalf). But what I am saying is that I often see it talked about like it's something unique to Catholic churches and that it happens there more than any where else where adults deal closely with children. It doesn't at all.

But that's beside the point. I don't understand why we *always* need to bring up wrongdoings of Catholic clergy or other Christians or people from 1000 year ago or even Americans in threads about a radical Islamic terrorist attack. It happens every time and I don't understand why. A radical Islamist blows people up and immediately people here start: "Well the Crusades this and that," "Catholic priests this and that," "Christians this and that," "Americans this and that." I mean, come on already. Why use horrible tragedies to make a point about another group of people when those people had nothing to do with it? Why not just acknowledge and discuss the evil at hand that just happened rather than creating diversions?        

There are plenty of threads about Catholicism and Catholic priests here made entirely for the purpose to talking about how horrible they/we/our beliefs are. I don't understand why every thread about some Radical Islamic mother fucker blowing people up has to become about Catholic priests.

America supported terrorists to win the war against the soviet union.

That's why the fact is always brought up: America armed Jihadists and gave them training and weapons. Gave them the boost they needed in terms of training and arming.
Whenever a bomb is blown by a radical Muslim; it's not only the terrorist's fault; but it's also the fault of the U.S for training his militia to use bombing back in the cold war.

Also, radical Islam blossomed in Saudi Arabia. America and Saudi Arabia are allies.

Allow me to put it this way: America is friends with the factory of radical Islam since 1933.
Whenever a bomb explodes; think about the messed up foreign policy of the U.S

It's a fact: going to war with America means that Sunni and Shiite militias would invade with the U.S, slapping the existence out of the place with both airstrikes and suicide bombing. Look at Iraq.

It's always related. The facts enforce themselves on whoever knows a piece of history.

Just like Islam is used in American wars, Christianity is also used.


It's all related; CL.

---

And whenever a war breaks; millions of tiny little poor souls become psychopaths, rightist Europeans attacking mosques and infest the society with racism against immigrants, and crazy Muslims who eat eyeballs for dinner and blow up themselves for fun .

That's the big picture. It always begins with a twisted priest or a lying Sheikh, that got their propaganda fuel from the acts of a selfish piece of shit like Bush or Trump.

ISIS use the misery Muslims saw in Iraq to preach their propaganda. Mosques in Saudi Arabia produce terrorists by using the pain of Syrians.
Everything is related.

But why suicide bombing? People have been kicked around for all of human history. When we hear the news about a young man that blows himself up in a crowd of other humans why is our prejudiced assumption that he was muslim affirmed within a day or so. Why are these monsters praised among their fellow believers? Why are the Jains not committing mass murder?

(May 23, 2017 at 4:50 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Yep, let's keep talking about Catholics and Catholic priests in a thread about a suicide bombing done by a radical Islamist who killed dozens of people. Because the handful of threads already dedicated to that aren't enough, and because somehow... all people of faith (especially Christians) hold some blame over what some nut job Islamist does.

I'm outta here.

Yeah, it's always funny how certain people manage to turn a thread about Islamic terrorism into a discussion about Christianity. A Muslim blew up a concert full of teenagers and children? Christians are to blame, obviously!  

Intentionally targeting little girls and their mothers? 
This is not about poverty or christians, or politics or racism or any of the other dodges. Right now, I feel like I need to lump the apologists in with Isis.

(May 24, 2017 at 7:03 am)Crunchy Wrote: Intentionally targeting little girls and their mothers? 
This is not about poverty or christians, or politics or racism or any of the other dodges. Right now, I feel like I need to lump the apologists in with Isis.

There are always apologists for this nonsense. It grates when I see "yeah but if we hadn't bombed [insert anywhere in the world] this wouldn't happen.

Bullshit apologist rhetoric. 

I'm quitting this thread. What should have been about an attoricity committed against young girls and families at a pop concert has turned into a fuckfest over who can one-up on the 'it's not just Islam' scale. Yeah, we get it. Doesn't change the fact that in Western Europe you have a very vocal and powerful extremist minority that infects communities and preys on young, often poorly educated and idealistic young men and women within Islamic communities and which is very successful in indoctrinating them to an extremist cause. It exists, but all too often people bury their head in the sand and what we're left with is young girls missing arms and heads in a pop concert and people looking at each other surprised when it happens, again and again.

More people need to take their time to review sites like Quilliam, an Islamic based secular progressive think tank that is often targeted for calling out how it is in British inner city Islamic communities.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/05/...g_share_tw

(May 24, 2017 at 6:25 am)Isis Wrote:

(May 23, 2017 at 4:50 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Yep, let's keep talking about Catholics and Catholic priests in a thread about a suicide bombing done by a radical Islamist who killed dozens of people. Because the handful of threads already dedicated to that aren't enough, and because somehow... all people of faith (especially Christians) hold some blame over what some nut job Islamist does.

I'm outta here.

Yeah, it's always funny how certain people manage to turn a thread about Islamic terrorism into a discussion about Christianity. A Muslim blew up a concert full of teenagers and children? Christians are to blame, obviously!  

PLEASE KNOCK THAT SHIT OFF, that is not what anyone questioning CL or any Christian is doing.

When you get tunnel vision and focus on one label at one point in history and you are not taking into account WORLDWIDE history, you are ignoring a larger sample.

We are not blaming Christians, we are saying "Those whom forget history are doomed to repeat it".

There is NOT one atheist here who is condoning what the sicko did. There is not one atheist here that is blaming CL for what the sicko did.

I am really getting sick of this misunderstanding and willful ignorance. 

I posted SEVERAL links to world history and included every major religion. Not to shame any one individual, but to say there has NEVER been a point in our species history where a label was 100% squeaky clean. No please go back and re read my posts. I even SAID, if an atheist was molesting children, or calling for physical violence i would expect THE SAME condemnation form other atheists NOT JUST THEISTS.

Islam is NOT getting a pass in this thread and nobody is singling out Christianity either.

(May 23, 2017 at 5:11 pm)Aroura Wrote:

(May 23, 2017 at 4:02 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Well, they didn't. 

There is a reason why when something like this happens, everyone automatically knows it's radical islam. Because the vast majority of the time, it is. Political correctness be damned in my opinion. No one here is saying Muslims are at fault. We are specifically talking about radical, extremist Muslims who think Allah wants them to kill everyone who is not them.

---

Look, I absolutely ABHOR radical islam.  And I also admit that mainstream islam has become more conservative over the last 20 or so years (and probably even slightly more radical).
But your statement here (my bold) is just flat out false.

Non muslims carry out 90% of terrorist attacks (2013 - USA)

As they say, lies, damned lies, and statistics. Rhythm likes to say this too but I've never seen him link to the data and I didn't feel like looking it up myself. The article you link to links to this:
https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publi...rror_05sum

For purposes of your statistic, when the Animal Liberation Front commits an act of vandalism, that counts as one incident. The 9/11 attacks that killed 2,972 people also count as...one incident.

Don't you think you're mixing apples and oranges with this statistic?

Let's look at the deaths and injuries in the report.

Deaths
Total: 3,178
Muslim: 2,984, or 94%

Injuries
Total: 14,038
Muslim: 13,051, or 93%

(May 24, 2017 at 6:25 am)Isis Wrote:

(May 23, 2017 at 4:50 pm)Catholic_Lady Wrote: Yep, let's keep talking about Catholics and Catholic priests in a thread about a suicide bombing done by a radical Islamist who killed dozens of people. Because the handful of threads already dedicated to that aren't enough, and because somehow... all people of faith (especially Christians) hold some blame over what some nut job Islamist does.

I'm outta here.

Yeah, it's always funny how certain people manage to turn a thread about Islamic terrorism into a discussion about Christianity. A Muslim blew up a concert full of teenagers and children? Christians are to blame, obviously!  

It's even funnier when somebody arms and funds terrorists and scumbags, then cry about them inflicting damage and death on his society.
It's even hilarious when you invade become allies with the factory of terrorism. More hilarious to invade the terrorists' homeland, killing 500,000 people and not expecting a rebound.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties...e_Iraq_War

Quote:Various scientific surveys of Iraqi deaths resulting from the first four years of the Iraq War estimated that over one million Iraqis died as a result of conflict during this time. A later study, published in 2011, estimated that approximately 500,000 Iraqis had died as a result of the conflict since the invasion.

[url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Iraq_War#cite_note-Hagopian-2][/url]
What's wrong with real history?
Why do people love to ignore facts? proven history is a fact.

America opened pandora's box with the Iraq war. I'm not exaggerating when I say: that war is enough to build an everlasting cause against anybody looks remotely similar to An American.

Racial, religious, mad insane vengeance. 500,000 dead is a number enough to summon demons on the face of this earth.

Add Syria and Afghanistan to the mix.

Not all terrorists have the luxury of knowledge like me.
I hate ignorance. I find it more disgusting than terrorism. Actually, I think it itself is a form of terrorism.
Not all terrorists are even have a cause other than pure vengeance.
So ignorant + terrorist...disgusting to the power infinity.


When somebody wake up to the sound of a cluster bomb, and find that his whole family is ripped to pieces, that person is very expected to build a type of grudge worthy of suicide bombing.

The innocent civilians never deserve death. A terrorist is a criminal because his act is degrading and shameful, he deserve death for his crime. But as long as other terrorists like the CIA and the U.S Army is not accounted for killing 500,000 people in one war, our civilization will burn.

Apologists? Bloody hell.

People bring up other religions because Abrahamic religions are violent. Only the Jews have managed to stay non-violent (to some degree), and they have been horrible victims of it. People are simply tired of religious folks killing other people because we don't bow down to their gods. That's all. It's perfectly relevant.

That said, I don't adhere to that philosophy. I was merely making a pseudo-joke based on someone else bringing up the Crusades. I think people will always find reasons to hurt each other, with or without religion.