(July 15, 2017 at 2:39 pm)snowtracks Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 11:38 am)Minimalist Wrote: Yet the Book of Romans is the same kind of absurd bible horseshit as the rest of it.  Until you can prove that your basic assumption is true - that there is a god - what you have is human-invented crap.

Face reality, boy.

Not trying to prove God or change your mind; God is self-evident. Now, go into the corner and repeat 100 times or until you understand. Mathematics is where there is 'proofs'.

Then why the fuck are you here? You know full fucking well that you saying that is as meaningless as coming into our homes and pissing on our carpet, it doesn't prove dick and just pisses us off. Why don't you find some evidence (and you know full fucking well what evidence is, contrary to your feigned ignorance) and win a Nobel prize for doing something no one else in history has ever managed to do? I'll even buy you dinner. At McDonald's.

If god really was self-evident then you're basically calling every one of us nonbelievers a bunch of inexcusably stupid jackasses, BTW, so kindly go fuck yourself. The only self-evident thing is that you're hopelessly deluded and no one's concept of god is remotely feasible because it's demonstrably false on at least one of every kind of claim they make about it. And you're no exception, braintrust.

(July 15, 2017 at 7:18 pm)snowtracks Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 6:00 pm)Inkfeather132 Wrote: Self-evident means that something doesn't need to be demonstrated. But it still can be demonstrated. In order for god to be self-evident he still needs evidence of his existence. Since there is no evidence of his existence, god is not self-evident.

Well, may someday this situation or something similar will happen that would demonstrate via the physical senses, then your ilk will believe. 

If a physical entity with the appearance of personhood were to materialize on the White House lawn and while saying “I’m God” (loud enough that it was recorded) levitated a foot above the ground, would that constitute proof that God is not hidden? As the Secret Service approached, this entity asked one agent to place his hand onto the entity’s shoulder which the agent did, thus making the entity to disappear. Later, in the briefing, the agent said the shoulder garment felt ‘velvety’, anything else you noticed? ‘Yes, as we approached this thing, there was an aroma of fruit, the closer we got the more pungent it became, much like orange blossoms’.

If that happened, was recorded, had evidence that it was authentic rather than fake, then I would certainly be re-evaluating my beliefs. Of course it could be god, or an alien, maybe even the devil come to deceive you? But I would definitely be considering it.

(July 15, 2017 at 7:34 pm)Godscreated Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 12:19 am)Inkfeather132 Wrote: If you can't prove it you can't say it's true, nor get upset when others don't believe you. If you can't prove it, why are you even here? Everything you have said is meaningless without proof.

 You say God doesn't exist yet you give no proof and you have none either. The proof I have is between God and myself. Anyone can have this proof if the accept Christ as their savior and start living in a real relationship with Him. It's not for me to give you or anyone else proof of God, as I said the scriptures tell me to give and account of what I believe and then the rest is for the triune God to do.

GC

Do you believe leprechauns exist? The Loch Ness Monster? Bigfoot? Unicorns? If you don't believe, give me the evidence that they don't exist. If the evidence of god is such that it can't be demonstrated by one person to another, it isn't actually evidence. If the evidence is between you and god, then keep it between you and god. There's no point in you being here.

(July 15, 2017 at 7:59 pm)Astonished Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 2:39 pm)snowtracks Wrote: Not trying to prove God or change your mind; God is self-evident. Now, go into the corner and repeat 100 times or until you understand. Mathematics is where there is 'proofs'.

Then why the fuck are you here? You know full fucking well that you saying that is as meaningless as coming into our homes and pissing on our carpet, it doesn't prove dick and just pisses us off. Why don't you find some evidence (and you know full fucking well what evidence is, contrary to your feigned ignorance) and win a Nobel prize for doing something no one else in history has ever managed to do? I'll even buy you dinner. At McDonald's.

If god really was self-evident then you're basically calling every one of us nonbelievers a bunch of inexcusably stupid jackasses, BTW, so kindly go fuck yourself. The only self-evident thing is that you're hopelessly deluded and no one's concept of god is remotely feasible because it's demonstrably false on at least one of every kind of claim they make about it. And you're no exception, braintrust.

You do realize that this is a mssg. board for discussion, right? or maybe I misunderstood.

(July 15, 2017 at 9:43 pm)snowtracks Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 7:59 pm)Astonished Wrote: Then why the fuck are you here? You know full fucking well that you saying that is as meaningless as coming into our homes and pissing on our carpet, it doesn't prove dick and just pisses us off. Why don't you find some evidence (and you know full fucking well what evidence is, contrary to your feigned ignorance) and win a Nobel prize for doing something no one else in history has ever managed to do? I'll even buy you dinner. At McDonald's.

If god really was self-evident then you're basically calling every one of us nonbelievers a bunch of inexcusably stupid jackasses, BTW, so kindly go fuck yourself. The only self-evident thing is that you're hopelessly deluded and no one's concept of god is remotely feasible because it's demonstrably false on at least one of every kind of claim they make about it. And you're no exception, braintrust.

You do realize that this is a mssg. board for discussion, right? or maybe I misunderstood.

Well then why don't you stop:
1. Making unfounded assertions and refusing to back them up
2. Throwing around backhanded insults that make you look arrogant and condescending
3. Refusing to acknowledge the other side's arguments and evidence and asserting that you're right and cannot BE wrong

All of those are completely counter-intuitive if you're trying to have a PRODUCTIVE discussion which I don't for a minute believe you're here to do. It's unbelievably rare to see anyone on the theist side of things interested in stopping any of those things but then most of them are just trolls anyway and I suspect I'm wasting my breath on one right now.

(July 15, 2017 at 10:07 pm)Astonished Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 9:43 pm)snowtracks Wrote: You do realize that this is a mssg. board for discussion, right? or maybe I misunderstood.

Well then why don't you stop:
1. Making unfounded assertions and refusing to back them up
2. Throwing around backhanded insults that make you look arrogant and condescending
3. Refusing to acknowledge the other side's arguments and evidence and asserting that you're right and cannot BE wrong

All of those are completely counter-intuitive if you're trying to have a PRODUCTIVE discussion which I don't for a minute believe you're here to do. It's unbelievably rare to see anyone on the theist side of things interested in stopping any of those things but then most of them are just trolls anyway and I suspect I'm wasting my breath on one right now.

Here's a question: Who died and put you in charge, MR PRODUCTIVE?

Dude, I'm just tired of hearing bullshit assertions from people like you and I called you out on it. If you fail to learn anything from this, like being more careful with how you throw around baseless claims and backhanded insults, that's on you, but I'm not letting your ignorance be an excuse for why you came up in here being a careless dick. If you want a productive discussion, those three things are the minimum things you'll need to change about your approach. Again, if you don't want to absorb that information, that's on you, all I can do is put it out there. But the remainder of this discussion is just going to be you continuing to say that you know god's phone number and the rest of us are idiots for not being able to see it, so can you imagine the rest of us not wanting to put up with that? THINK about things for once, for fuck's sake.

(July 15, 2017 at 8:30 pm)Inkfeather132 Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 7:34 pm)Godscreated Wrote:  You say God doesn't exist yet you give no proof and you have none either. The proof I have is between God and myself. Anyone can have this proof if the accept Christ as their savior and start living in a real relationship with Him. It's not for me to give you or anyone else proof of God, as I said the scriptures tell me to give and account of what I believe and then the rest is for the triune God to do.

GC

Do you believe leprechauns exist? The Loch Ness Monster? Bigfoot? Unicorns? If you don't believe, give me the evidence that they don't exist. If the evidence of god is such that it can't be demonstrated by one person to another, it isn't actually evidence. If the evidence is between you and god, then keep it between you and god. There's no point in you being here.

 It doesn't matter whether I believe in those things or not, I'm neither trying to prove or disprove them and I've said many times that I can not prove God to an atheist's satisfaction. Neither can an atheist disprove God to my satisfaction. There is a huge difference in the two though. I know that God exist and so an atheist could never disprove that which exists regardless of what the atheist thinks. Those who say that God doesn't exist make a positive statement, it then becomes their responsibility to prove the statement they made, it isn't nor ever has been the responsibility of the other person to disprove the statement in any type of argument. Because the atheists can't disprove God they want to move the responsibility of their doubt on the Christian, only in an argument about God does the burden of the atheist's belief become the responsibility of the Christian. I've been here a lot longer than you have and have every right to be here, so just calm down or just quit reading my posts.

GC

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(July 15, 2017 at 10:16 pm)Astonished Wrote: Dude, I'm just tired of hearing bullshit assertions from people like you and I called you out on it. If you fail to learn anything from this, like being more careful with how you throw around baseless claims and backhanded insults, that's on you, but I'm not letting your ignorance be an excuse for why you came up in here being a careless dick. If you want a productive discussion, those three things are the minimum things you'll need to change about your approach. Again, if you don't want to absorb that information, that's on you, all I can do is put it out there. But the remainder of this discussion is just going to be you continuing to say that you know god's phone number and the rest of us are idiots for not being able to see it, so can you imagine the rest of us not wanting to put up with that? THINK about things for once, for fuck's sake.

This will be a rare post to you from me, so newbie don't get your self over excited. If you're tired of reading Christians posts then simply STOP and it will solve your problem. The only one who is being careless is you, the Christians here know you could not care less about us and I for one couldn't care less what you think about me. (Bold mine in your post.) We do not have to change anything in the way we post, we do it responsibly and because you lack the intelligence to understand, well that's on you. We do know how to communicate with God and it's obvious you don't and if that hurts your feelings then change. If you want Christians to respond to you in a manner that's pleasant to you then start treating us with some kind of real respect, stop your insults and profane language, grow up and stop acting like a first grader. Snowtracks and I have been here much longer than you have and we were welcomed to this site by the atheists who have been here much longer than you have, just get over yourself and become human like everyone else here.

GC

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(July 15, 2017 at 7:46 pm)Lutrinae Wrote:

(July 15, 2017 at 7:45 pm)Godscreated Wrote: You have no idea what I know nor can you prove different, I refer to the above answer.

GC

Psychology actually can, and it is no different than others who believe in that which they can offer no proof for something's existence.

 Like you and your proof for where the material came from to make an entire universe, oh that's right you have no idea you say it was just there. You want me to prove God, then you prove where that material came from and saying it always existed isn't proof.

GC

I love being told that God is self-evident. Guess my brain is really messed up?

(July 17, 2017 at 2:55 am)JackRussell Wrote: I love being told that God is self-evident. Guess my brain is really messed up?

Do you remember Moses and the Ten Plagues?  Well, the Israelites witnessed Ten Plagues Yahweh imposed on the Egyptians and led the Israelites across the Red Sea on dry ground after he parted the waters so that they could escape the pursuing Egyptians.  Within the hour they had forgotten all about Yahweh and made themselves a golden calf idol.  So if Yahweh didn't make a lasting impression on them and they saw his works with their own eyeballs how can Yahweh be self-evident to modern man?

(July 17, 2017 at 3:29 am)Wyrd of Gawd Wrote:

(July 17, 2017 at 2:55 am)JackRussell Wrote: I love being told that God is self-evident. Guess my brain is really messed up?

Do you remember Moses and the Ten Plagues?  Well, the Israelites witnessed Ten Plagues Yahweh imposed on the Egyptians and led the Israelites across the Red Sea on dry ground after he parted the waters so that they could escape the pursuing Egyptians.  Within the hour they had forgotten all about Yahweh and made themselves a golden calf idol.  So if Yahweh didn't make a lasting impression on them and they saw his works with their own eyeballs how can Yahweh be self-evident to modern man?

And these diptards have the stones to say they know more than we do. As if being on here longer than me means a damn thing. The fact that they haven't learned fuck-all in that time speaks volumes about their incapability. If that's the best reply GC can come up with, he's right, I don't want to hear it. Anyone wanting to claim they've got god on speed-dial needs to be in a rubber room with a straightjacket, not telling people they're superior and dictating how others behave. The absolute hallmark of insanity and people are taught to be either proud of it or respectfully kowtow to it; FUCK THAT SHIT. Again, GC, for the last time, if your god is going to withhold his existence and his love from me for ANY reason, he's not worth the shit he's made of. You are both without excuse.